Lee Waters: Well, I'd rather not, Presiding Officer. It's very distracting to have these constant noises-off—to ask a question when she won't listen to the answer.
Lee Waters: Touché, Presiding Officer. [Laughter.] The extra information Natasha Asghar was trying to provide was hard to hear. The fact is, the fundamental question we need to ask ourselves is do we think Wales should have an airport. If we think Wales should have an airport, there is market failure, so the private sector by itself is not going to provide that airport. Therefore, just as with...
Lee Waters: Well, it is a staggering level of ignorance, really, about the set of realities facing us. The private sector are not interested in an airport that isn't making money. Very few airports, across the world, make money, and I would challenge Natasha Asghar to give me some examples of airports that she thinks we should model, from around the world, that are profit making. [Interruption.]
Lee Waters: Okay. Well, I completely reject that characterisation. The T9 bus service, as the Member should know, has had a significant drop in demand, as many bus services have right across the bus industry, right across the country, for every government. Passenger levels have not returned to their pre-pandemic levels, so we have to make a hard-headed judgment of where best to put the subsidy, and this...
Lee Waters: Thank you very much. Well, nobody saw it coming because it was a decision by the company, in the face of what they described as macroeconomic conditions, to withdraw from the airport; they've withdrawn from other airports too. The whole industry is facing significant pressures from inflation and the rising cost of energy. And also, aviation is a sector with quite a precarious business model,...
Lee Waters: Yes, thank you, and Russell George is right that there have been some difficulties on the Cambrian line. The whole rail system across the country has had a difficult autumn. The new trains that we are bringing in on the Cambrian line next year will be able to carry more passengers. There will be increased capacity, and, of course, there'll be increased frequency to hourly. We'd hoped to bring...
Lee Waters: Yes, thank you. The Welsh Government is investing £800 million on a new fleet of trains that will serve passengers across Wales. This will improve passenger comfort and facilities, and these brand-new trains are now running in north Wales, and will be introduced across the whole Welsh rail network in this year and next year.
Lee Waters: I've been very encouraged by the work in Newport, in Swansea and in Cardiff on offering free bus travel at certain periods, and it's worked. We now have data to show that it is successful and there is plenty of international evidence, as well, from Dunkirk to many cities around the world where free bus travel is effective. The reality, though, at the moment, given our financial settlement, is...
Lee Waters: Certainly, and I'd be very happy to brief Members and encourage Members to take part in a round-table themselves with me on any ideas they have to help shape our thinking. Essentially, this is part of the Wales transport strategy. We set out some initial thoughts, looking at other examples in other parts of the UK and on the continent of how rural areas addressed the need for sustainable...
Lee Waters: Well, I completely agree that flexibility is the key here, and as we do the work with TfW and the local authorities identifying where an optimum bus network goes, there will be a place for standard scheduled services and there will be a place for complementary, flexible, demand-responsive services. As Huw Irranca knows, we've been trialling the Fflecsi service across different parts of Wales...
Lee Waters: Well, thank you to Carolyn Thomas for her continued championing of buses. It has been a neglected policy issue for too long, and not seen as fashionable, and I think it's time we changed that, and she's doing great work leading the cross-party group on public transport to that end. The question of how the cuts will impact is a very relevant and current one. I would say that what we're talking...
Lee Waters: Sorry, can you hear me now?
Lee Waters: I apologise.
Lee Waters: Yes, I obviously don't know at which point you lost me, and I'm not going to set a test to see who was paying attention, because I'd be disappointed with the result, I'm sure. [Laughter.] So, I mentioned the point of transport poverty—I'm not sure if that was recorded—which is critical. The issue of women's safety, which Delyth Jewell mentioned, is a really important point too, and there...
Lee Waters: Forgive me. Are you having difficulty hearing me?
Lee Waters: Well, thank you for that series of well-targeted questions. So, as I say, we need to make bus use normal again. It used to be normal. It's stopped becoming normal. Over half of people never use a bus. It is by definition something that lots of people have no experience of, and that is critical to change if we want to meet our climate change targets, because, without tackling transport, which...
Lee Waters: Thank you for those questions. There are many of them, and I'll do my best to answer them, but I warmly welcome Natasha Asghar's statement that she accepts the role of franchising and asks how we make it affordable, sustainable and deliverable, and this, I think, is at the crux of it, really. I think we need to decouple how do you make the system better and then the question of how do we grow...
Lee Waters: So, as we look at the stark science of climate change, and as we reflect on the advice of the UK Committee on Climate Change, the move to electric cars is not enough. We need to see fewer car trips and a shift of travel modes from car to public transport. To reach net zero, we must acknowledge the centrality of the bus system. Buses already carry three quarters of public transport journeys in...
Lee Waters: Diolch, Dirprwy Llywydd. Earlier this year, we published a White Paper, setting out our plans to bring bus services in Wales back under public control. Its title captured our ambition: 'One Network, One Timetable, One Ticket’. And to meet the urgent challenge of climate change, we need more people using sustainable forms of transport. To do that, we need to make bus, rail and active travel...
Lee Waters: Well, I'm glad the Member mentioned the Morlais scheme on Ynys Môn, which is an excellent scheme made possible by European funding—funding that is no longer available to us, and which, despite the promise by the UK Government that we would not be a penny worse off, has not been replaced. So, our ability to do similar schemes to Morlais has been impeded by Brexit and the failure of the UK...
