<p>Questions Without Notice from Party Spokespeople</p>

3. 2. Questions to the Cabinet Secretary for Education – in the Senedd at 3:03 pm on 6 July 2016.

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Photo of Ann Jones Ann Jones Labour 3:03, 6 July 2016

We now move to party spokespeople’s questions. First this week is party spokesperson Llyr Gruffydd.

Photo of Llyr Gruffydd Llyr Gruffydd Plaid Cymru

Diolch, Ddirprwy Lywydd. Can I welcome the Cabinet Secretary to her first education questions? I’ll start by asking her to confirm, maybe, once and for all to the Chamber, that the funding for the class-sizes policy, which we’ve just been discussing and which you’re committed to, will be delivered separately to the £100 million education promise that was made by the Labour party at the election.

Photo of Kirsty Williams Kirsty Williams Liberal Democrat

Can I welcome the new spokesperson for Plaid Cymru? I was grateful to have and early opportunity to discuss with him what joint priorities we have together and I look forward to working with him. As you will be aware, there are a number of initiatives that I wish to take forward in the education field. The finances of those are being discussed in the usual discussions between myself and the finance Minister and will be finally revealed in the budget when that’s published later this year.

Photo of Llyr Gruffydd Llyr Gruffydd Plaid Cymru 3:04, 6 July 2016

Well, I think it is rather disappointing that there still is ambiguity around that because not only these benches, but other benches have expressed a concern with regard to the lack of clarity there. Maybe you could give us, therefore, some clarity around the regional consortia, which continue to divide opinion within the education sector. Your Liberal Democrat manifesto committed to abolishing those bodies, while the Labour manifesto supported their continuation. So, could you maybe give an indication which party manifesto policy you’ll be pursuing?

Photo of Kirsty Williams Kirsty Williams Liberal Democrat

Can I say that the role of consortia is a role that there is a discussion about? My manifesto commitment to abolish the regional consortia was based on the fact that the manifesto also called for local government reorganisation. Whilst there is still a lack of clarity around what the future map or the future look of what local authorities will do in Wales, I think we have to be cautious in throwing up the education improvement system that we have in Wales while there is that uncertainty.

What is clear to me is that we have had some encouraging news with the publication of Estyn’s report into the south Wales central consortia. The news around GwE, the north Wales consortia, is less than positive. I will be awaiting the reports of Estyn on all four consortia before I make a definitive statement on the way forward with regard to school improvement structures in Wales.

Photo of Llyr Gruffydd Llyr Gruffydd Plaid Cymru 3:05, 6 July 2016

Well, what is it about Liberal Democrats and manifesto pledges? I don’t know. There we are. Okay, well, there’s still ambiguity there.

Let’s see whether you’re sticking to your guns on PISA, then, because, 18 months ago, in questioning the First Minister about Government changes to PISA targets, you said and I quote, and no doubt, there’ll be many of these over the coming months:

‘If we ever needed an example of the absolute poverty of ambition from this Government, then it came last week. One of your most staunchly defended targets in the Chamber has been ditched—although perhaps we should not be surprised, given that your own Government’s adviser described it as ‘plain stupid’. The response from your Minister is a new ambitious target to put us in the same place in 2021 as Scotland last year. That is hardly striving for ambition, First Minister.’

Your words. So, what’s your ambition, Cabinet Secretary, and will you, therefore, be setting new targets?

Photo of Kirsty Williams Kirsty Williams Liberal Democrat 3:06, 6 July 2016

First, may I say that PISA remains a very important indicator of how the Welsh education system is performing? It’s not the only indicator, but it is an important one if our students are to compete in a worldwide economy when they leave the education system. The Member will be aware that the last round of PISA tests were undertaken by Welsh students in the autumn of last year. We expect the publication of those results in the autumn of this year. I hope that we will make improvements, but I’m sure the Member will forgive me that, having just taken up this role some months after those tests were taken, I’m not in a position to have any influence on them.

What I am clear about is that the successful implementation of a new curriculum, based around Donaldson’s ‘Successful Futures’, gives us the best opportunity for our children to compete internationally with their counterparts across the world, and that will certainly be my focus in coming months to make sure that that curriculum is developed and that schools and teachers are in a position to deliver on that.

Photo of Ann Jones Ann Jones Labour 3:07, 6 July 2016

Thank you. We move to the UKIP spokesperson, Mark Reckless. No?

Photo of Mark Reckless Mark Reckless UKIP

I’ve no questions on this occasion.

Photo of Ann Jones Ann Jones Labour

Okay. Thank you very much. We’ll move, then, to the Welsh Conservatives’ spokesperson, Darren Millar.

Photo of Darren Millar Darren Millar Conservative

Thank you, Deputy Presiding Officer. Could I also welcome the Cabinet Secretary to her first questions—[Interruption.]

Photo of Darren Millar Darren Millar Conservative

[Continues.]—on education matters here in the Senedd? [Interruption.] If Members are ready, I’ll continue.

Photo of Ann Jones Ann Jones Labour

I was just saying, I’ve just asked them once, I shan’t ask again.

Photo of Darren Millar Darren Millar Conservative

Cabinet Secretary, you published a statement recently on the additional learning needs Bill and the progress that you hope to make on that. Can you set out the timetable by which you expect to publish a draft Bill for consideration by the Assembly?

Photo of Kirsty Williams Kirsty Williams Liberal Democrat

Can I say how pleased I am that Darren Millar will be shadowing me? Having worked closely together for the last five years on the health committee, I would’ve missed him if the change had not been made. You’ll be aware from the First Minister’s statement that the additional learning needs Bill is a legislative priority for the Government; it is long overdue. I know it was of regret to many that the Government was not in a position to move forward on this in the last term. The Bill will be taken through the Assembly by my ministerial colleague and we hope to publish a draft Bill as soon as possible.

Photo of Darren Millar Darren Millar Conservative 3:09, 6 July 2016

Can you give us some confidence about the resources that might be attached to that Bill, Cabinet Secretary? One of the concerns that many people have is that it will be inadequately resourced in terms of the outcomes that that Bill hopes to achieve and that that will have a detrimental impact on the education opportunities for individuals with additional learning needs. What resources are attached to this at the moment, appreciating the response that you already have given in respect of the discussions that you’re having with the Cabinet Secretary for finance about the future allocations to your budget?

Photo of Kirsty Williams Kirsty Williams Liberal Democrat

The Member will be aware that, when the Bill is published, alongside that there will be a regulatory impact assessment and there will also be a financial assessment, which will outline the resources that will be needed for the successful implementation of that Bill.

Photo of Darren Millar Darren Millar Conservative

One way, of course, of releasing resources would be to scrap the regional consortia that you so heartily recommended to the Assembly should have been done prior to the elections. I checked your manifesto earlier today, in terms of your commitment, and at no point did it suggest that the commitment to abolish the regional consortia was attached to local government reform. So, I think that has come as quite a surprise to many Members here today.

Can I give you the wholehearted support of the Welsh Conservatives should you proceed to want to scrap the regional consortia, particularly given the views of the Estyn inspectorate in respect of their recent report into the north Wales regional consortia, GwE, which you’ve already referred to? You will be aware that it was found to be unsatisfactory in terms of its resource management, and I would suggest to you that that does not represent good value for money for Welsh taxpayers.

Photo of Kirsty Williams Kirsty Williams Liberal Democrat 3:10, 6 July 2016

Can I urge the Member to read not just the education section of the Welsh Liberal Democrat manifesto but the entire document? There’s much in it to commend to you. The consortia do have an important role to play in terms of educational improvement whilst we still have a system of 22 local authorities, many of which, in the past, have been demonstrated not to effectively have educational improvement departments and functions within them. What the Member is absolutely right to say is that the Estyn report into GwE, the north Wales consortium, is disappointing. I met with the chief inspector of Estyn to discuss that report last week. My officials met with the representatives of GwE yesterday. It is not good enough and they will need to improve. In stark contrast, however, is the Estyn report into the consortium in south Wales central. All four reports will be published during the summer, and I will be meeting with all consortia in September. I expect universally good provision from all of them. If that is not possible, we will have to look again at the role of consortia. If they cannot add value to the educational attainment of their children, we will have to look again.

Photo of Ann Jones Ann Jones Labour 3:12, 6 July 2016

Thank you. We’ll move back to the questions on the order paper. Question 3, Suzy Davies.