We now move on to the next item on the agenda, which is a statement by the Cabinet Secretary for Economy and Infrastructure on the national infrastructure commission for Wales, and I call on the Cabinet Secretary for Economy and Infrastructure, Ken Skates.

Thank you, Deputy Presiding Officer. Today, I am launching a consultation on a national infrastructure commission for Wales. This Government’s delivery document, ‘Taking Wales Forward’, sets out how we will work to secure more and better jobs through a stronger, fairer economy; improve and reform our public services; and build a united, connected and sustainable Wales. ‘Taking Wales Forward’ pulls no punches. We know how tough the next five years are going to be and how challenging it will be to try and create the level of economic stability needed for the long-term well-being of our people and communities.

A fundamental element to improving economic stability is the range and quality of a country’s infrastructure—the physical systems and services that we need to have in place in order for Wales to work effectively. We are living at a time of particular financial uncertainty, which makes it even more important to act now to strengthen the way we consider and prioritise future infrastructure needs and create the conditions for stable, long-term investment.

This Government is committed to moving towards a better informed, longer term strategy of investment in infrastructure, which enshrines the principles of the Well-being of Future Generations (Wales) Act 2015. That better informed approach will enable the more efficient development of projects, as their importance and value will be understood by the people of Wales. This Government has therefore committed in ‘Taking Wales Forward’ to establish a national infrastructure commission for Wales, to provide us with independent and expert advice on strategic infrastructure needs and priorities.

The establishment of a national infrastructure commission for Wales also reflects our agreements with Plaid Cymru, as part of the compact to move Wales forward. We intend establishing an advisory, non-statutory national infrastructure commission for Wales to provide independent and expert strategic advice. We propose that the commission starts as an advisory body, responsible for analysing, advising and making recommendations to Government on Wales’s longer term infrastructure needs for the next five to 30-year period.

Responsibility for making investment decisions for infrastructure that is devolved would remain with Welsh Ministers, and with the UK Government for infrastructure that is non-devolved. The Wales infrastructure investment plan would continue to be set by the Welsh Government, and set out our overall infrastructure investment plan for the term of the administration, which would be informed by the commission. The commission would also inform our national development framework, which will provide a longer term, strategic perspective on planning needs, and is a key component of the changes introduced in the Planning (Wales) Act 2015 for reforming the planning system to ensure that it is fair, resilient and enables development.

This Government appreciates that there are a range of models already in existence, and different ideas for the status and the remit of an infrastructure body. We therefore see the establishment of an advisory, non-statutory commission as a first stage in strengthening decision making and delivery on infrastructure, and we are open to changing the body’s status and remit if, with experience, clear benefits emerge for doing so. The consultation asks a range of questions about how the commission should be set up and run in practice, including its relationship with the infrastructure commission that the UK Government is establishing with other bodies, such as those that are already the subject of price control mechanisms.

If our commission is going to be a game changer, its members, who will be chosen through a public appointments system, will need to be both independent of Government, expert and experienced. There will be no question of members being appointed because of their office or who they represent. The public appointments exercise we will run will make sure of this. We need people who think and operate across sectors, and are creative and inclusive in analysing future needs—people who will be able to focus on priorities for any new research that will be integrated, and add genuine value to analysing and understanding our infrastructure needs.

That is why we are proposing that the commission should be able to look at cross-cutting delivery issues, if it considers them a barrier to delivering infrastructure needs, including governance, costs, financing, and programme or project management methodology. We are determined to have a commission that is as diverse as possible, and are specifically asking for ideas on how best to engender interest from less obvious applicant fields. We are committed to a geographically inclusive commission that advises on infrastructure needs for the whole of Wales, and the consultation proposes arrangements for how the commission engages with people and communities across the country.

We want the commission to work in an open and transparent way, and propose that the commission publishes annual reports of its work. The consultation opened yesterday and, taking account of the Christmas break and our desire to receive as many informed responses as possible, extends to 9 January. Depending on the feedback from consultation, we intend establishing the commission by summer 2017.

Have you finished? I never know whether you have, because I always see you turn the page over and I think there’s another page. Adam Price.

Thank you, madam Deputy Presiding Officer. I’m very grateful to the Cabinet Secretary for today’s statement and indeed for the commitment to create the infrastructure commission, originally set out in the compact, and also for the willingness that he has just set out in his statement for the role, the remit, the status and the focus of the infrastructure commission to evolve, and for it itself to be able to address some of the wide cross-cutting areas of potential interest that it may want to focus on.

I’m grateful to him for having had sight of an early version of the consultation document, which has been published today, and for the positive engagement that we’ve had with the Government so far. He’s aware, and it won’t come as any surprise, obviously, because Plaid Cymru published its own document setting out our vision in terms of the national infrastructure commission recently, that there is some daylight, I think, between us still on a number of issues. If I may, in my short remarks here, I’d just like to concentrate on three of those very, very briefly.

The Cabinet Secretary has just said that, at least initially, the infrastructure commission will be constituted on a non-statutory basis. I note that his party colleague and former leader of the Labour party, Neil Kinnock, recently fairly fiercely actually criticised the UK Government’s decision to quietly shelve their plans, previously, to put the UK national infrastructure commission on a statutory footing. He went as far as to claim that this rowing back had actually wrecked the commission because it didn’t give it sufficient status and independence. So, I was wondering if the Cabinet Secretary could respond or reflect on Lord Kinnock’s view that actually a statutory basis is an important element for a successful infrastructure commission.

Secondly, on the issue of financing, I note that the Cabinet Secretary did refer to financing as part of those cross-cutting delivery issues that he referred to. It is an area of key concern actually. One of the constraints, one of the co-ordination problems—failures—that we have at the moment, I think, is the ability to put together the complex package of financing that is often required in the kind of major infrastructure investment projects that we’re talking about. It’s a very complex, very specialist field and I think the Cabinet Secretary may be getting a bit of a flavour of that, indirectly, with the Circuit of Wales, for example. And because, of course, we haven’t had an infrastructure commission in Wales, that’s held us back in terms of the quantity and the scale of infrastructure investment. We don’t have the expertise available to us, which is really why, certainly in our vision, we see a central role, whether it’s directly or indirectly, for the infrastructure commission in putting together the financing arrangements, including some of the innovative approaches—the non-profit distributing model that the finance Secretary referred to earlier—but also more conventional approaches to public-private partnership as well. So, I’d be grateful if the Cabinet Secretary could say a little bit about his evolving thinking on the role of the infrastructure commission in that. We’re agnostic as to who does it. There is a suggestion that the development bank could actually build up a team that is specifically looking at infrastructure investment. We’re open to that. The point is that we don’t currently have the expertise in Wales and we need to change that very, very quickly.

Lastly, it’s really a question that kind of overlaps, once again, his responsibility and that of his Cabinet colleague the finance Secretary, but it’s a question of the appetite within Government for both accelerating the pace, but also extending the scale of public infrastructure investment. Last year, the OECD produced a report that said that a modern economy, an advanced economy, should be spending around 5 per cent of GVA on the renewal and modernisation of infrastructure. In the UK last year, that was as low as 1.5 per cent. It’s possibly even lower in Wales because of the historic constraints on our ability to invest in projects such as this. The Scottish Government has recently announced a £20 billion programme over the next five years. Is the appetite there in Government, if necessary looking at innovative sources of finance to overcome some of the constraints that we still face in terms of borrowing powers, et cetera? Because would the Cabinet Secretary agree that, as Gerry Holtham, former financial special adviser to the Welsh Government said, this could have a dual benefit for Wales, not just in terms of laying the foundations, through the infrastructure itself, for a generation to come, but also having a very significant stimulus in terms of the economy? If we looked at a £3 billion additional programme over a period of five years, that could be a stimulus equal to 1 per cent additional growth in terms of GVA. So, I’d be very interested to hear what’s the current thinking of the Government in terms of have you got the appetite for actually ramping up a level of public infrastructure investment that, for a variety of reasons, has been far lower than many of our partner and competitor nations elsewhere in Europe over the last few years.

Can I thank the Member for his comments, and put on record my thanks to both Adam Price and to Dai Lloyd for the very constructive discussions that we’ve had? I’d like to thank the Members and their party for the advance notice that I was given as well of the proposals for the Plaid Cymru infrastructure commission for Wales. I do think discussions and the document that you have produced have been invaluable in pressing forward deliberations that we’ve had to date, and, as I set out in my statement, this, I believe, is the first step in establishing an infrastructure commission for Wales.

In terms of what’s happened at a UK Government level, I recognise that it was something of a surprise that the UK Government did not proceed with making their commission statutory. We have asked for detailed reasoning in this regard, because we had been developing our model on the basis that they were going to be making theirs statutory, and therefore the natural next step based on evidence gathered in the years to come would be that we could also then transform ours into a statutory body. I’ve pledged to ensure that, by the end of this Assembly, there will be a review of the remit, efficacy and operations of the national infrastructure commission for Wales, so that we can fully assess whether it should be statutory. And then, if so, it will enable us to propose legislation when possible.

In terms of the financing of work, of course, it’s essential that I work very closely with colleagues across Government, but in particular with the Cabinet Secretary for Finance and Local Government, but the Member is also right insofar as innovative financing is concerned. I think membership of the infrastructure commission will be absolutely essential in this regard. It will be very important that we have the appropriate expertise that perhaps has not been available until recent times to enable us to deliberate over what sort of innovative finance can actually support the major infrastructure projects that Wales very much needs.

If I can just review some of the considerations that we’ve been giving to raising additional funding, we do share the aim of raising additional moneys for public infrastructure investment by developing models that retain most of the attractive features of the non-profit distributing model, but which reflect the current classification regime, which can inhibit some of the developments that are being proposed by Plaid Cymru. We have engaged legal and financial advisers to assist with developing a model that allows for the public sector to capture some of the returns to equity, which, of course, the Scots have been particularly successful with through hub, and which we are also proposing to do.

We’ve extensively consulted with colleagues from Scottish Futures Trust and also with Her Majesty’s Treasury, with the Office for National Statistics, Eurostat and the European Public-private Partnership Expertise Centre of the European Investment Bank, and we’re developing our model in consultation with experts, including a peer review with the European expertise centre.

In terms of the historic levels of underinvestment in much of our infrastructure, I think during questions earlier, and during the urgent question, I mentioned that, historically, we’ve seen underinvestment in our rail network. It’s fair to say that we need to significantly increase the level of investment right across our physical and digital infrastructure to ensure that we have a country that is well connected and united, and one in which people are able to live within their communities without concern over how they will access places of employment. For that reason, it’s essential that we proceed with what is one of the most ambitious infrastructure programmes that a Government has introduced since the dawn of devolution, which includes proposals for an M4 relief road, a Menai third crossing, and upgrades to the A494, A55, A40, Newtown bypass and Caernarfon bypass, in addition to the next phases of superfast broadband connectivity, and which also captures social programmes, such as new health centres and hospitals, and, of course, twenty-first century schools, higher education and further education.

The Member is absolutely right in asserting that capital programmes can dramatically increase the degree of economic growth in a country, and, for that reason, we wish also to accelerate the programme of building so that we actually then fuel the economy of the future of Wales.

I’d like to thank the Cabinet Secretary for his statement today. The proposed infrastructure commission for Wales doesn’t, I would say, seem to bear much resemblance to the original proposal put forward by Plaid Cymru—a proposal that, of course, formed the basis for Plaid Cymru’s support for the Welsh Government.

You’ve also proposed a non-statutory advisory body that doesn’t seem to be truly arm’s length from Government. The Confederation of British Industry have previously noted—and I quote them here—that transferring devolved infrastructure planning, financing and delivery to an independent Welsh infrastructure commission would allow a holistic approach to planning our infrastructure, achieve economies of scale and giving business the confidence to invest.

So, can I ask, on that basis, why you chose to limit the role of the commission to providing advice, rather than adopting the Plaid Cymru proposals to borrow the amount stated—£5.5 billion?

The UK Government have put its national infrastructure commission on a permanent footing and have established a royal charter. This, of course, provides a commitment of the body’s independence, I’d say. So, can I ask how you will ensure that the commission is independent and also perhaps you could talk to the governance arrangements as well, to that point?

The consultation document asks whether the commission’s remit should extend to non-devolved as well as devolved infrastructure. Perhaps the Cabinet Secretary can provide some further details on what impact you feel that a non-statutory Welsh commission will have on non-devolved areas, and how it will influence UK Government decisions. The consultation also states that the remit would not extend to social infrastructure, so I’d be interested in why you have made that decision. Again, it seems to be in contrast to Plaid’s approach.

Finally, you state that the commission will enshrine the principles of the Well-being of Future Generations (Wales) Act. Now, how will you propose to monitor and enforce this on a non-statutory body, which is not subject to the Act? Perhaps you could answer whether this will be included in the remit letter that you’ll be sending to the commission.

Can I thank the Member for his contribution, and say that, actually, I think we need to give more respect to the discussions that have taken place between the Government and Plaid Cymru, because the compact is what has actually delivered this piece of work that is now going to be taken forward? I think it is a major piece of work that we can be proud of.

In terms of the commission itself, well, it would be independent and, as I said in my statement, the membership of the commission will be appointed on the basis of expert knowledge and experience and certainly not by virtue of any office that they hold. I expect members to be able to think and to operate right across all sectors. They will need to be creative and they will need to be inclusive in analysing future needs and also the public policy challenges ahead of us, such as decarbonisation.

Appointments will be made through an open public appointments exercise, which, of course, will be in accordance with the code of practice for ministerial appointments for public bodies. There will be an exception—and this recognises another point that the Member raised—insofar as UK Government activity is concerned and infrastructure across the border. There will be one exception, and that will be the direct appointment of a member of the UK infrastructure commission, which will then recognise the cross-border nature of much of our infrastructure, especially the infrastructure that will be developed in the coming decades, and I think, in particular, the roll-out of the metro north-east and also some of the road infrastructure that extends from mid Wales into the midlands.

The Member also raised points about borrowing and why we will not be incorporating within the commission’s remit the ability to be able to borrow. Now, this is largely an issue that’s come to the fore of late. It’s a recent development, but it concerns whether or not borrowing would sit on or off balance sheet. The ONS considers that not-for-profit models cannot apply a profit cap and sit off balance sheet. We know that because there was recently the rejection of the Scottish Government’s application of the model applied to the Aberdeen Western bypass capital project. There are also, of course, questions, which I think have been raised in recent Plenary sessions, concerning our ability to be able to finance borrowing, which would be considerable, estimated between £600 million and £700 million annually. That said, we should not lose sight of the fact that we need to be hugely ambitious insofar as our infrastructure requirements are concerned, and that’s why I’m determined to press ahead with a most ambitious infrastructure building programme.

Thank you, Cabinet Secretary, for your statement on the commission. I don’t think it’ll come as any surprise to you that those of us who are outside your cosy friendship with Plaid Cymru might be a little worried about who will actually constitute this committee. Is it going to be a number of apparatchiks from both parties or, indeed, are you actually going to look outside party colleagues to actually populate this cabinet? So, can the Cabinet Secretary indicate whether approaches were made to any or all of the following people, the sort of people we would really want to populate this commission, people such as Gerry Holtham, who managed the Morley fund with £125 billion-worth of assets, Nigel Annett, who helped guide Glas Cymru to a not-for-profit organisation, Keith Griffiths, founder of Aedas, an internationally renowned architectural company, and Sir Terry Morgan, chairman of a huge construction project, Crossrail, in London? These people were mooted as possible candidates, and it would seem that they would have been eminently suitable for this crucial committee.

I’d like to thank the Member for his comments and assure him that it is not due to a cosy friendship that we’re here today, presenting plans for a national infrastructure commission, it’s because both parties have decided to be inclusive, to be tolerant and open-minded in discussions that have taken place. We’d welcome any other parties that wish to act in a similar way and that have constructive ideas for us to take forward as a Government. The appointments process will be in line with regular public appointments procedures, and I can assure the Member it will not be carried out by party-political apparatchiks in any way, shape or form whatsoever.

First, I’d like to thank the Cabinet Secretary for prefacing his remarks by saying that, of course, the future generations Act is the umbrella by which we should judge everything. We have to deliver a united, connected and sustainable Wales, and, if we don’t provide the public transport for people to get to work, they won’t be able to keep those precious jobs. So, I’m sure we’re not going to be appointing any apparatchiks. What I am concerned about is that we are appointing people who really understand the challenge of the future technologies that we’re going to need to keep ahead of the game. So, I want to just talk about two things. One is the internet of things. We know that, in Bristol, they track everybody who leaves for work, at what time and where they’re going through their mobile phone. I wonder whether we have that capacity here in Wales; and if not, why not? I’m aware that the Department for Culture, Media and Sport has invested £10 million in a research and development project to look at how it can be made to work in the city region. Is it going to be built into the south Wales metro, and is it going to be built into Cardiff’s new bus station? Because it’s absolutely hopeless that we don’t have that level of connectivity with new technologies.

The second thing is that you don’t see many electric cars in Wales, and I wonder why that is. I’m aware that there are many electric points in south Wales. It wouldn’t be surprising if we didn’t see any in north Wales, because there are no electric connection points. So, you won’t be able to get beyond Brecon because you won’t be able to get back. So, obviously, we need to have a network that can provide for the new types of cars that are going to be not polluting in the way that diesel or petrol fumes are. I’m told that some car producers are even forgetting about electric cars and going straight for hydrogen. If that’s the new technology, we only have two connection points in Wales—one in Port Talbot and one in Treforest. So, are these the sorts of things that we are going to be able to really get to grips with in this national infrastructure commission? And are you going to be looking not just beyond Wales but beyond Britain to ensure that we are getting the very best of world-class individuals who really, really understand these new technologies, and that we fast-forward and move beyond the rest of the UK in having the infrastructure that we’re going to need in the future?

Can I thank the Member for the important points and questions that she raised in her contribution, and say that she is absolutely right in that the well-being goals are the driving force behind the creation of an infrastructure commission—goals that will ensure that we focus on longer-term strategies to drive infrastructure investment to help provide the sort of sustainable and integrated communities that we all wish to see across Wales? In respect of a question posed earlier by Russell George with regard to the well-being goals, it would be my intention to invite the commissioner to examine the potential of challenging the commission and holding the commission to account over the implementation of the goals, and for checking that they are being honoured.

In terms of membership—and I think the Member is right also to state that membership of the commission will be absolutely essential in paying due regard to emerging digital technologies—I am most certainly not closed to the idea of having experts from outside of Wales join the commission. This will be a fully open and transparent public appointments process, and I would welcome experts from anywhere, whether it be Wales, UK or further afield, because as I said in my statement, we want a diverse commission—one that has members who genuinely add value and are able to demonstrate a clear ability in analysing and understanding our infrastructure needs, not just physical, but also digital.

In terms of the city deals and smart cities, well, of course, it was a manifesto pledge for our party to support the development of smart towns and cities. In addition to this, as part of the consultation that took place for the new Wales and borders franchise, it was clear that what passengers wish for is a service that takes advantage of new and emerging digital technologies insofar as ticketing and on-board information is concerned, as well as a variety of other services. So, we would expect, during the process of procurement that is taking place now, four bidders to be able to present ambitious proposals to exploit and take advantage of the very latest and emerging digital technologies in transport.

In terms of motor vehicles, it is true that, until recently, Wales has not had as many charging points as we would wish for electric cars. But I am assured by my colleague the Cabinet Secretary for Environment that 100 electric charging points are being developed across Wales. The Member is also right to identify hydrogen cell cars as actually being a particular focus of research and development now. In this regard, we have a very proud story to tell with Riversimple in mid Wales—a company that is being supported by Welsh Government; a company that featured in the opening session of today’s Autolink 2016 conference here in Cardiff. I will be making a statement on export opportunities in the coming weeks, based on my recent trip to Japan. But last week, when I spoke with investors in Japan, there was clear knowledge of the research and development that has taken place with regard to hydrogen cell cars in Wales and in the UK. There is a good amount of interest in supporting that research and helping us to exploit it for the benefit not just of car users but the wider environment.

I would like to thank you, Cabinet Secretary. I very much welcome your announcement today. I understand that the Welsh Government is clearly at a very early stage with regard to the commission, but one thing I would like to focus on is the fact that these infrastructure developments that we are looking at must be linked back to good jobs and work and training opportunities. I was struck by a fact that I read on the weekend that no Welsh local authority has as many jobs now as it did before Thatcher started swinging her axe in 1981. What guidance will the Welsh Government give to the commission to ensure that good work opportunities are prioritised? In addition, how will the Welsh Government’s ambitious apprenticeships policy tie into the work of the commission? Finally, I think the Valleys taskforce has a key role to play in delivering the commission’s objectives. How will it fit into the work of the commission?

I think the Member is absolutely right to identify the need for higher quality jobs within the economy, not just in order to give improved life chances to people right across all of our communities, but also to drive up the GVA of the Welsh economy. We will be piloting a Better Jobs, Closer to Home project, I believe, in the Valleys as part of the Valleys taskforce that my colleague the Minister for lifelong learning, is chairing. It is essential that we use every lever at our disposal to ensure that people who have not been able to access opportunities for well-paid work are given opportunities through investment in infrastructure. I do believe that, alongside the development of the infrastructure commission, the creation of the development bank will assist in levering additional resources into small and medium-sized enterprises, which will be absolutely essential in order to enable them to grow their capital and therefore take advantage of some of the major infrastructure schemes that are coming down the line. Perhaps what’s most important of all to employers in the private sector and the public sector is a clear pipeline of opportunities for infrastructure upgrades. It is something that I hear very regularly from representatives of companies of all sizes—the need for a predictable and scheduled provision of infrastructure projects that can be exploited. This is something that I believe the commission could have a very important role in delivering.

May I thank the Cabinet Secretary for Economy and Infrastructure for his statement, and welcome this statement indeed, and also thank him for his kind words? I thank him for the collaboration over the past few months between his office and Adam Price’s office and my office, on this idea of a national infrastructure commission for Wales, the NICW. Of course, as the Cabinet Secretary has already said, our NICW is different to your NICW, isn’t it? But more about that in due course. Of course, our NICW has been the fruit of four years’ thorough and detailed work on the part of Adam Price and colleagues, and those who research this kind of issue, and people working in the field, naturally. We launched it, as you’ve already mentioned, and as Adam mentioned, a few weeks ago, and people such as the Institution of Civil Engineers were very excited about these ideas for a NICW that was put before them at that time. That is, an empowered NICW that stands alone, on its own two feet and can borrow, naturally, and can also draw in other sources of funding.

So, a very powerful body—that is the vision, because, as you know, we live in very difficult times. The economy of Wales—. If you look at the wealth, 75 per cent of our wealth, as such, comes from the public sector and only 25 per cent comes from the private sector. In order to increase wealth, we need to increase what business does, and to develop the economy, as you know, we need to invest in skills and also invest in infrastructure, and there’s a genuine need to invest in infrastructure. You mentioned that we need to be ambitious. Well, we do need to be ambitious, and innovative, because we need to go for it. We have several projects in the pipeline—we’ve hear about them this afternoon, and about we need to do. There’s an estimate here that there are infrastructure projects worth £40 billion waiting to be constructed. We will stay waiting for those if we don’t do something innovative and different about the investment system, and get hold of the capital in order to build these things. So, that’s why we’ve brought forward our idea of a national infrastructure commission before you. I’m very pleased that the Cabinet Secretary has welcomed that idea and has been willing to develop it and to be open to discussion, as you’ve already announced here. We would expect to see a little bit of evolution of your original idea of having some kind of body that is only to consult and to advise. Fundamentally, we need a body that is going to do things, and as the civil engineers and others in the field have already said, that’s what they want to see happening, because time is against us and there are grave concerns, especially in these uncertain days following Brexit. We need to get to grips with these issues.

So, I see that we are going to be able to consult now. Can I just ask: how open are you to changing your mind? If you’re going to have a whole host of people coming back to you and saying ‘Well, actually, we would prefer to have an empowered body that can do things such as borrow’, then are you going to go for it and change your mind, basically, and develop the kind of infrastructure that Jenny Rathbone and Vikki Howells and others mentioned? We will just be adding to the waiting list if we don’t get to grips with these things.

I would like to know, as Adam has already asked, what exactly is the rationale, at present, behind exiling social construction projects such as constructing schools, building hospitals and homes? Why can’t we do that ourselves under the NICW remit? Under our particular NICW, I would like to think that we could be able to do that, and I would hope that your NICW could develop the ability to do that, too. Because, at the end of the day, there is a genuine need to go for it. The situation of the economy is fragile. We need to develop jobs for our young people and develop the wealth of our nation, and there is a way here, with the development of this adventurous body, for us to be innovative and to lead the way in these isles. Thank you.

I'd like to thank Dai Lloyd for his comments and for his kind thanks, as well, for the way that I and my office have been able to discuss proposals with him and with Adam Price. I've said before that I've no monopoly on wisdom or any copyrights on good ideas, and I think what this process has shown us is that, actually, it's really important that we should share good ideas, discuss and debate them, and then reach an informed position, rather than to just flippantly reject them. For that reason, I can assure the Member that I'm very much open to alternatives being proposed during the course of the consultation. That was one of the reasons why I wanted to make sure the consultation was open for a good period, so that it allows us to take into consideration the latest position, in particular with regard to the Scottish Government’s model and the recent judgment north of the border as well, because that clearly had an impact on the way that we approached your party’s model for a national infrastructure commission for Wales. I won’t rehearse the other issues that we’ve had during discussions and the concerns that I’ve raised in the Chamber and in private discussions with you. Suffice it to say that I am open to persuasive arguments for amending the model that I have proposed this week.

In terms of the level of infrastructure that is required to fuel economic growth in the future, I think it’s also important that we respect the role of the private sector in delivering what could be game-changing projects in Wales. For that reason, I think the commission’s role in taking a long-term look at our infrastructure needs will be absolutely essential. In terms of two projects alone, Wylfa Newydd and the tidal lagoon in Swansea bay, we have the potential to lever in more than £15 billion of investment and provide work for thousands upon thousands of people for many years to come. That’s important because it requires Welsh Government to ensure that the infrastructure that’s necessary is in place for those projects to be delivered on time and in a way that captures as many job opportunities as possible for local people. I think that’s why as well, alongside the development of the commission, it’s going to be important that we gain an evidence base from the Better Jobs, Closer to Home pilot to inform how we’re going to be ensuring that major infrastructure projects benefit communities and people that perhaps in the past have not benefitted from major infrastructure projects.

In terms of social infrastructure, I feel that the processes in place at present for determining where and what social infrastructure should be delivered are fair and are operating properly, and operating responsibly. But, again, during the process of the consultation, I would be open to any persuasive arguments to the contrary.

Thank you. I have two more speakers who I intend to take, so if it’s just a question and a short answer from the Minister, we’ll get through that. Jeremy Miles.

Diolch, Ddirprwy Lywydd. I welcome the statement from the Cabinet Secretary. You indicate in the consultation that the work of the commission, and the commission’s advice, needs to be set in the context of a realistic forecast of the level of capital investment that’s likely to be available, and you’ve spoken a bit about the range of sources that might come from. Is it your intention that Government would indicate to the commission in the remit letter what the sort of envelope of funding might be, or would that be something that you’d expect the commission itself to generate?

The Presiding Officer took the Chair.

Secondly, briefly, in terms of the criteria that will be used to assess the viability of any particular project, is it the intention to look more broadly at the impact of a particular project on the local and regional and, in fact, national economy? I ask the question because I gather than only two transport projects, Crossrail and the northern line extension, have been green lit formally on that basis. So, I’d be interested in your thoughts on the criteria for endorsing particular projects.

Can I thank Jeremy Miles for his questions and say that, under the model that we are proposing in terms of the pool of available funding, the financing and the delivery of infrastructure would remain the responsibility of Government. It would be informed by the advice of the new body, but the actual quantum of resources available would still be determined by Government. I would expect members, in regard to the impact assessment that the Member drew attention to, to adopt best practice insofar as assessment of economic or other impacts are concerned, and this will require, of course, the right members of the commission to be appointed.

I likewise welcome today’s statement and, Cabinet Secretary, your response to my colleague Vikki Howells when you alluded to the importance of having a clear pipeline for projects, which is something that was brought to me first hand in a visit to Tarmac in Hendre in my constituency yesterday, when they stressed the importance of a more structured approach to major infrastructure projects. In the statement, Cabinet Secretary, you say the Welsh Government is

‘committed to a geographically inclusive commission that advises on infrastructure needs for the whole of Wales’.

I’d urge you to place a strong emphasis on that. Also, in the consultation, it says about expert knowledge. I think that needs to also take into account that knowledge and understanding of the diverse and different demands of the regions and factors across the nation to ensure that that inclusivity is relevant within all the work.

Can I thank the Member for her questions and say I’m very familiar with Tarmac in Hendre? I believe that it was formerly the Lloyd quarry—the Lloyd family of Pantymwyn. I was particularly pleased to be able to join the Member yesterday at P&A fencing in Mold to learn of their plans to more than double the number of employees that they have, in part off the back of providing fencing for major infrastructure programmes. That demonstrated how small and medium-sized enterprises in Wales can take advantage of major infrastructure programmes across the country.

I think the Member is absolutely right to call for geographical respect to be paid to our infrastructure. In regard to this, I will ensure that the commission meets not just in south-east Wales, where one might expect it, but also across Wales—in north Wales, in mid Wales and in west Wales.

I thank the Cabinet Secretary.