4. 3. Statement: The Additional Learning Needs and Educational Tribunal (Wales) Bill

Part of the debate – in the Senedd at 3:01 pm on 13 December 2016.

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Photo of Alun Davies Alun Davies Labour 3:01, 13 December 2016

I’m grateful to the Conservatives’ spokesperson for his kind remarks. I know that the Conservatives have played a significant role in the development of this legislation, with Angela Burns chairing the committee in the previous Assembly. I would certainly put on record my thanks to Angela for the work that she did at that time. It has certainly helped us in developing the new draft.

I’m grateful to Darren for looking at the Bill, both in terms of what we published yesterday, but also the wider transformational process and programme upon which we are embarking at the moment. Without wishing, then, to become immediately churlish, I would say very gently that we’re not seeking to hold the NHS to account in these reforms. What we’re seeking to do is to ensure that the NHS works seamlessly with local authorities, with schools, with the educational services, in order to ensure that the child comes first and not the ease with which some professionals might see these services being delivered. It’s the child’s needs that we’re talking about it, and it is the interests of the child that should come first, second and third. It is the purpose of this legislation to bring those services together. The final point that was made about existing provisions and support for existing learners is one where we wish to build upon and not diminish. It’s certainly the importance of ensuring that we do have those services in place to build upon—that is what we’re seeking to do as part of this wider transformational agenda.

Let me say, in terms of the health needs and the issue that was raised by Llyr Gruffydd as well—which, I apologise, I didn’t answer in full or, in fact, at all. I apologise for that. We believe that local authorities and governing bodies already have responsibilities to support children and young people who do have healthcare needs. We are delivering and revising specific guidance on these matters, which will be published in the new year. If Members, having read through those guidelines, believe that they need to be improved or strengthened, then we’ll have an opportunity to do that in the new year. Let me say this: the Bill is silent on those issues, but our minds are open to conversations on those matters. If the guidance that will be published does not deliver the sort of certainty that people wish to see, then we will consider that at Stage 2.

In terms of transport, we are aware that learner transport is already covered by legislation. We do not believe there is a necessity for an additional layer of legislation on these matters, but we recognise the force of the argument, and we recognise that what has been said about the ability of people to access the courses and the support required will sometimes require access to transport as well. If we believe, looking through the scrutiny of this legislation, that the existing transport legislation requires strengthening, then, clearly, that is something that we are prepared to consider. At the moment, we believe that the existing legislation does cover all of these matters.

I've been in correspondence with the United Kingdom Government in recent days on cross-border issues. We’re having a conversation on these matters. On some of these matters, we’re having a robust conversation; on others, we're having conversations of a different nature. But let me say this: the United Kingdom Government recognises the policy agenda, and I think both Governments share the same ambition for our learners, and what we will seek to do is to ensure that we do have a seamless service available across the border. It is important, as far as learners are concerned, that the border becomes almost invisible and that people are able to access the services that they require wherever those services are located, and that we deliver legislation that enables that to happen. There have been some cross-border issues. I recognise that, but, certainly, I hope that those are being addressed in the legislation.

Members will be aware that the Cabinet Secretary for Education has already been very, very clear that she wants to see schools sharing services and sharing facilities, and that what we want to do is to introduce flexibility for particularly smaller schools to be able to access excellence in terms of the support required for learners. This legislation will build upon those ambitions, and this legislation may well be a test for those ambitions as well. Certainly, the changes that the Cabinet Secretary outlined here some weeks ago will enable and, we hope, will ensure that schools do have the flexibility to ensure that we do have access to the best services and that they will be able to share services where necessary.

In terms of health professionals, the wider transformational agenda, and the wider transformational programme, is one that looks at bringing people together, strengthening the system, strengthening what we have available to us, enabling people to work together. A designated clinical lead in each individual health board will, I hope, enable that to happen, so that we don't have the cumbersome, overly complex ways of working that we’ve seen all too often between different elements of our public services. So, when we debate and discuss these matters at both Stage 1 and Stage 2, I hope that we will have the opportunity to test the strength of this Bill—to test the strength of the Bill and the code, the statutory guidance that will be published in February—to enable us to understand whether we need to make further provisions to ensure that these services are able to work together.

And, in closing, I will apologise to the Deputy Presenting Officer, who did, of course, chair that committee. [Laughter.]