5. 5. Debate on the Children, Young People and Education Committee's Inquiry into the Education Improvement Grant: Gypsy, Roma and Traveller, and Minority Ethnic Children

Part of the debate – in the Senedd at 3:23 pm on 3 May 2017.

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Photo of Lynne Neagle Lynne Neagle Labour 3:23, 3 May 2017

Thank you, Deputy Presiding Officer. Can I thank all the Members who have contributed this afternoon? I think it’s been an excellent debate. Darren Millar, thank you for your contribution and for your work on the inquiry. You quite rightly highlighted the quite alarming patchwork nature, really, of the provision and the fact that we were, as a committee, unable to actually identify what was happening on the ground, which was, in itself, very worrying. I, too, am grateful for the tribute that you paid to the Gwent ethnic minority support service, who I think made a big impression on the whole committee and who are doing an absolutely excellent job. But the problem that we have got is that, as far as we know, those cases of good practice are not being spread. And as you say, the evidence from the consortia was disappointing. I do share your concerns about the session that we had with Estyn. It was worrying that they came to us and said that they had done this review back in 2011 and hadn’t actually followed up on the recommendations. I think if the Welsh Government was doing that, we would have something very strong to say about it. I think, with the inspectorates, we have to expect that there will be that rigour in following up where they have invested the time in actually inspecting something.

Can I thank Julie Morgan for her contribution? Julie is a very passionate advocate of the Gypsy, Roma and Traveller community, and especially of the children, and I was really pleased that Julie, as a member of the committee, played such a key role in the inquiry. I share the concern that the equality impact assessment that was undertaken was not sufficient, and I know that the stakeholders felt that, and I hope that, although mindful of what the Welsh Government have just said, going forward, the Welsh Government will learn lessons from this in taking similar decisions in the future.

Julie made very important points about role models, and that was something that came out in the inquiry—that we're trying to encourage these young people to be in school, but yet they haven't actually got many role models, and that goes for Gypsy, Roma and Traveller children, but also for minority ethnic children. That was also an issue that came out in the inquiry. And thank you for highlighting the peer-review project. I think it's vitally important that we all keep the views of children at the centre of what we are trying to achieve.

Can I thank Bethan Jenkins for her contribution, for stepping up to the plate for Llyr today? It's much appreciated. Thank you for your comments. I don't think the committee was saying that these are a homogenous group. Particularly with minority ethnic learners, that is certainly not the case, but we have to make sure that where we have minority ethnic groups that are not performing, we ensure that the right interventions are in place, and that certainly wasn't clear from the evidence that we took. Similarly, we weren't in a position to recommend specifically what local authorities or consortia should be doing, because we just didn't have sufficient information on what was happening on the ground, which is why the key focus, really, of our recommendations has been on the need for there to be proper, rigorous monitoring and evaluation.

Can I thank David Melding for his contribution today, for highlighting the very important tensions between mainstream provision and ring-fenced targeting provision? I certainly agree with you that while we would all hope that everything can be achieved through a mainstream setting, there are clearly circumstances where that is not going to happen, and that's why we need this targeted approach. And I thank you, too, for your emphasis on the need for proper monitoring and evaluation, and also for your kind words about the committee's work in this area.

Can I thank the Cabinet Secretary for her contribution as well today, and for her very constructive engagement with the committee on this topic? I particularly welcome what you've said today about the need to strengthen the performance management framework; that is most welcome, and we will look forward to following up with you on that. And to thank Members generally for their participation today and just repeat what I've said in the previous committee debates that we've had: this isn't just a one-off that we're going to put aside and leave; we are intending to follow this up very rigorously going forward and to continue to shine a spotlight on this very important area of work. So, thank you very much, everyone.