Diolch, Dirprwy Lywydd. I thank Members for their contributions this afternoon. Dawn Bowden raised the important point that, of course, welfare reform is part of a wider social agenda of this UK Conservative Government, and it's a central theme of austerity.

In Gareth Bennett's contribution—I listened to it carefully—I wasn't sure whether, by the end, he was going to defect to the Conservative Party or the communist party [Laughter.] But I thank him for his contribution this afternoon.

I have to say that I'm deeply disappointed with the Minister's response to the debate today. It is a fact that the Scottish Government have negotiated, through their fiscal framework, with the UK Government, for an uplift to the block grant in order to cover the costs of the administration of welfare. I think it's interesting to point out as well that, earlier on in the debate in this Chamber, the Cabinet Secretary for local government reiterated the Welsh Government's proposals for the devolution of justice to this place. Nobody has suggested that there would be an enormous administrative cost that would mean that public services would have to be cut to cover it. In fact, the First Minister himself has repeatedly said that he is confident that the Welsh Government can come to an arrangement with the UK Government in order to have a Barnett consequential, and other consequentials as well, so that Wales can cover the costs of further powers. There is no reason why that cannot be negotiated between the Welsh Government and the UK Government for the administration of welfare, and universal credit in particular.

Let's also not kid ourselves: to suggest that devolved services and devolved Government and local government is not already paying a hefty price for the damaging welfare reforms that are being pushed through I think is to be in complete denial about the reality. Part of the point of devolution of the administration of welfare would be that we would run a more efficient and effective and humane system in this country that would end up saving money for public services. Why are there programmes that the Welsh Government is administering at the moment, such as Supporting People? These are very good programmes indeed, but part of the reason for the increased demand upon those services is because welfare is being administered by the Conservatives at Westminster today. And I have to say, I find it absolutely incredible that a Labour Minister would rather a Conservative in London administer welfare and social protection for the citizens of Wales than take responsibility themselves.

Let's also bear in mind the fact that the administration of welfare, of course, was always devolved and localised. The interwar period was that period where centralisation occurred—