Questions Without Notice from the Party Leaders

Part of 1. Questions to the First Minister – in the Senedd at 1:39 pm on 17 April 2018.

Alert me about debates like this

Photo of Carwyn Jones Carwyn Jones Labour 1:39, 17 April 2018

Thank you, Presiding Officer. First of all, I have no fear of the leak inquiry; I ordered it. And it is something that I was under no—it was not imposed on me, it was something that I took forward and Members can see the conclusion. There are far wider legal issues here that arise as a result of the operation of section 37. It's worth me exploring that with Members in detail. Now, first of all, there have been discussions with the Presiding Officer. It's not the case that this came out of the blue. It's not something I would choose to do, I have to say, if other options were available, but we have to protect the position of a senior member of Welsh Government staff who, if the motion was passed, would be at risk of prosecution. This is a serious issue—a hugely serious legal issue—and it is incumbent on us to make sure that steps are taken to protect her. But it goes beyond that.

Section 37 is so broadly defined that, without greater clarity—[Interruption.] Well, if the Member wanted to listen carefully, he might learn something. Okay? Section 37 is so broadly defined, and it lacks such clarity, that potentially any document of any kind that is in the control of a Minister, or an employee of Welsh Government, is potentially releaseable—any document—regardless of whether it was caught by an exemption of the Freedom of Information Act 2000, regardless of whether it was caught by the Data Protection Act 1998, regardless of whether a document might be libellous, regardless of whether the document might contain details of national security. Now, I have in my possession documents that are given to me as First Minister that deal with national security. Under the interpretation at the moment that we have, that would be releaseable—that would be releaseable. [Interruption.] Well, it is; there is no clarity on it.

Secondly—[Interruption.]