7. Debate on the External Affairs and Additional Legislation Committee report: 'How is the Welsh Government preparing for Brexit?'

Part of the debate – in the Senedd at 5:02 pm on 18 April 2018.

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Photo of David Rees David Rees Labour 5:02, 18 April 2018

I think it's important that we clarify some of the points. And for Leanne Wood's purposes: yes, I think, can you also pass on what an important role Steffan Lewis plays in the committee? We will also look forward to him coming back to the committee because he has an important role and he does take a deep interest in these issues and it helps the committee tremendously. So, we look forward to seeing him coming back as well.

It's been clear that many Members highlighted similar issues. We've had the questions of the funding aspects, and I'm very pleased the Cabinet Secretary highlighted how strongly the Welsh Government is opposed to the possible intentions of a Westminster-controlled fund, where it should actually be more focused upon the needs of Wales and should be allocated to Wales as a block to allow that to happen.

Again, can I thank Mick for his kind words and his contribution to the committee, to the work on Brexit? And he's quite right: we're not alone in this issue, it occurs across the various institutions within the UK because the meetings we attended represented Scotland, the Lords and Commons and there was a unanimous feeling about the failure of the JMC. And we cannot let the UK Government control any funding that should have been coming to us anyway.

Mark highlighted the point that he's deeply disappointed that only some were accepted in principle—so am I. There's no question about that. But we are moving forward, and we do need to have clarity on the guidance for allowing bodies to establish contingency planning. That is critical. I know the Cabinet Secretary has highlighted that there are limits to being able to know how much he can give because there is so much uncertainty that still exists, and I also appreciate that, but we've got to get preparing for this. We now need to know there's a transition period, so we can start working towards preparing for that transition period and whatever happens afterwards. And I totally agree with the Cabinet Secretary on a personal view: I do not believe we will get everything resolved before October, by which time they have to go to the Parliaments for the consideration of any withdrawal deal. So, this is going to be a long game to be played.

Can I also remind everyone of Jane Hutt's championship of the equalities agenda on this? She has been to the fore, pushing the committee to look at these issues and the implications as a consequence of Brexit on equalities and what we need to do on that, and we will not be going past those issues. 

Jenny Rathbone highlighted something about the Bulgarian representative, and it was mentioned about the agencies. He reminded us, actually, of an interesting question: that membership of agencies is complicated because some of the agencies are linked to the single market and, as such, we've got to look very carefully. If Theresa May doesn't want to be in the single market, that limits our access to agencies. So, there's some serious thinking the UK Government has to have, and we need to have those discussions, and preparations, for what implications they may have for Wales.

I now turn to Michelle Brown, and I have to express my huge disappointment that she used the opportunity to give what I considered a rerun of the referendum arguments. There is no project fear, there's purely a look at how we can deliver the best for Wales; that is what we are trying to do. In my opinion, I think she's misrepresented the Government's work. And they are responding; the number of times they've mentioned that they're responding to the will of the people. I suppose President Trump would say that section was actually more like fake news than genuine news.

So, let's refer it back to what we are focusing on: how does Wales prepare for Brexit? And that is critical. We face many more months ahead of us—11 months now, actually, until we leave, probably about six months of negotiations to the withdrawal agreement, and then the discussions on the withdrawal agreement. And in that time, there will be many, many issues that will arise, both at EU level and UK level, that will have to be negotiated to ensure that Wales gets its best deal. And we prepare our businesses, we prepare our public bodies, we prepare our third sector for ensuring that, when it happens, we're in a strong position to move forward, and that we are going to be impacted minimally by anything that arises as a consequence of Brexit.

We will continue to hold the Welsh and UK Governments to account, because I will give credit to Robin Walker, who has attended the committee, and he has committed himself to come back. We will hold them to account. It would be nice if David Davis, the Secretary of State, would also attend because it might reflect that, perhaps, his understanding of devolution as well—it seems to be lacking at the moment. But we will continue our work to safeguard the interests of the people of Wales. So, I hope that Members will therefore accept the report and let us move forward, keeping an eye on what happens in Brexit. And don't take your eyes off it because if you blink, you'll miss something.