Part of the debate – in the Senedd at 3:00 pm on 15 May 2018.
It really is an abject failure of understanding, Llywydd. What happens in Scotland is for people in Scotland to comment upon, and it's for them to comment upon what is right for them in their circumstances. Scotland—where, let us not forget, a majority of the local population voted to remain in the European Union. Here in Wales, different considerations, different powers, different arrangements apply. We debate what is right for Wales, and the agreement that we bring forward is one that we know is right for devolution and right for our nation as well.
And let me clear up as well, Llywydd, if I could, once and for all, what 'consent' means in this context. Consent means that the Assembly has voted positively in favour of the draft regulations being put before Parliament. That is what consent means, and nothing else.
In a third defence, Llywydd, the UK Government has always previously claimed that the constraints envisaged in its original Bill would be temporary, but there was nothing in that Bill to substantiate that. Now, there are sunset clauses on the face of the Bill. Some have argued that these could be extended ad infinitum, but let me be clear again: this Bill simply does not allow for that to happen. The only way in which the sunset clauses could be extended would be by way of new parliamentary legislation, and that new parliamentary legislation would of course be subject to the Assembly's consent.
In a fourth development, the agreement gives an unequivocal guarantee that UK Ministers will not bring before Parliament any legislation for England making changes to retain EU law in framework areas. As the report of the Constitutional and Legislative Affairs Committee said, in its report, yesterday, this recognition of England in the agreement is 'constitutionally notable'. It is just one way, Llywydd, in which the agreement breaks new ground in defence of devolution and the future operation of the United Kingdom. A level playing field has been created, it applies to all administrations, and it is now in everybody's interests, as the First Minister said earlier this afternoon, to agree a new post-EU rulebook as quickly as possible.
Finally, the agreement makes clear that any new primary legislation establishing new UK frameworks will be negotiated, negotiated by all partners coming around the table on the basis of parity, and that the outcomes of such negotiations will themselves require the Assembly's legislative consent in accordance with normal principles.
Llywydd, I want to end by addressing some of the wider constitutional issues that the Bill draws to the surface. Many of the objections and criticisms I've heard in recent days and weeks have not really been about the Bill or the agreement at all. They've been about the Sewel convention itself, a convention that the CLAC report says that the force of it has been 'maintained and reaffirmed' as a result of this agreement.
I've also heard a lot of ill-informed criticism of the 'not normally' formulation in the agreement, as if by agreeing to that we've somehow 'sold out', as we're told, on devolution, in that offensive phrase. But the commitment 'not normally' to legislate without consent is in the Government of Wales Act, to which this Assembly gave its consent, and it's there in the Scotland Act too. Have we reached a moment where we need to move beyond Sewel and the 'not normally' formula? Well, I agree with the conclusion reached recently by Professor Michael Keating of University of Aberdeen, when he said that the Sewel convention
'has worked well for almost twenty 20 years', but it was not designed to bear the burden that Brexit is now placing on it. That is why, in 'Brexit and Devolution', this Welsh Government argued for the creation of a new UK council of Ministers, which would be able to reach binding decisions that would be supported by a dispute resolution mechanism and an independent secretariat, and which would operate with far greater visibility to the public.
Llywydd, our ambitions for devolution are by no means exhausted by the agreement we have reached, but our objective from the beginning has been a withdrawal Bill that delivers stability and certainty for businesses and citizens about the rights, obligations and responsibilities that will exists at the point at which we leave the European Union. We have defended and entrenched our devolution settlement. We have provided for the successful operation of the United Kingdom after Brexit. We have delivered a good deal for the Assembly and a good deal for Wales. I'm proud to ask the Assembly to give its consent to this legislative consent motion this afternoon.