Part of 1. Questions to the First Minister – in the Senedd at 1:40 pm on 5 June 2018.
We don't anticipate that at all. The last franchise was let on the basis that there would be no growth in passenger numbers. There was an enormous growth in passenger numbers, and we see now the overcrowding that takes place on so many services not just on the Valleys lines, but across many services that run on the Wales and the borders franchise network. We have built into the agreement the expectation that passenger numbers will rise, particularly but not exclusively passengers going through Cardiff Central, and the agreement is based on seeing an increase in passenger numbers. I can't see the numbers decreasing. I can't see that people will want to travel less or not travel into work. We must be careful to make sure, of course, that there is sufficient capacity over the next few years that people feel that there is a comfortable and good-value alternative to the car. But what we can't do is keep on building roads into our cities in the hope that that will resolve the issue of traffic. It can't be done without demolishing houses.