3. Statement by the Cabinet Secretary for Economy and Transport: Rail Services and the South Wales Metro

Part of the debate – in the Senedd at 3:18 pm on 5 June 2018.

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Photo of Ken Skates Ken Skates Labour 3:18, 5 June 2018

Can I thank the Member for his questions and his contribution? I think it's fair to say that his message was somewhat inconsistent with the message given earlier from the leader of his party, in terms of welcoming the franchise agreement. I should just point out that the new arrangements were described earlier this afternoon by the leader of Plaid Cymru as 'second rate'. 

It's clear that the position of Plaid Cymru, with regard to letting this franchise, is such that they would have been in no other position, were they in power, other than to continue with the current franchise arrangements, because it is simply—[Interruption.] Because it is simply not possible to ensure that a public body is able to run the current rail network as it stands in law. We tried to change that law, as every party recognises. It could have been the case—a not-for-profit organisation could have won the contract if they had bid, but none did, and we clearly would still prefer nationalisation. However, within the straitjacket in which we operate, we believe that this is, by far, the best deal that could have been struck.

Indeed, Members of Plaid Cymru signed up to a report not long ago that stated that, if we were to reach the point that we're at today, we would have achieved heroic ambition. We've done that, and in having that position—one that is so intransigent as to not recognise that we need to be pragmatic with regard to the award of the rail franchise—it suggests that the only way forward for Plaid Cymru would have been to continue with the current arrangements, and the price of that would have been enormous: 16 per cent higher in terms of subsidies. So, the price that Plaid would have paid over the course of 15 years would have amounted to more than £300 million in addition: 16 per cent more. We're going to save 16 per cent as a consequence of the agreement that we've reached, and there would have been a continuation of the poor services that Members have already highlighted and, of course, the accumulation, annually, of profits of more than £28 million. That's a fact, if you'd continued with the current arrangements, and that's the only place you could have gone to, based on your current argument.

If Plaid Cymru can't welcome our having delivered what their own Members described as a heroic ambition, then surely—surely—there should be some recognition of the enormous benefits that will come to Wales as a consequence of this new franchise: £800 million more on rolling stock; £194 million more on stations; half-price tickets for 16 to 18-year-olds; half of the trains built in Wales. I think it's time to just recognise that, sometimes, we do deliver. We do deliver and we have done. We have delivered an excellent franchise arrangement for the people of Wales.

Profits were raised as an issue earlier, and by the Member now. The profit of 3 per cent was mentioned earlier, and 2.9 per cent. Well, if you look at what Arriva have been making in terms of profits: pre-tax profits in recent times have reached as much as 18.6 per cent; post-tax profits, 6.9 per cent; dividends of £20 million being paid to the parent company; just £3 million invested in—[Interruption.]

We did not sign that contract. That was not a Labour—. That was a non-departmental public body. They got it wrong. They got it wrong, and I'm on record on numerous occasions saying that they got it wrong. I wish those on that side of the Chamber would admit that they've been quick to criticise the way that we've gone about procuring this exercise on numerous occasions, but now is the time to be contrite because we have got it right for the people of Wales.

And in terms of the operator and development partner making a profit, well, it's interesting, because Keolis and Amey both have excellent track records in delivery. If you look at customer satisfaction, actually the two best performing networks at the moment in the UK, in terms of customer satisfaction, are the docklands light railway and the Manchester metro system—both operated by Keolis. And in terms of Amey: an excellent track record, as the Member should know, because one of the organisations that they work for is the Plaid-run Isle of Anglesey council. 

In terms of quality, and the Member is absolutely right to say that it's all about the quality of provision—I'll forgive him for not having read all of the brief, because there is a substantial amount of information in there—but he said that people will have to ride on rusting rolling stock that we have now. The statement said that every train is going to be replaced, and that 95 per cent of all passenger journeys will be based on brand-new rolling stock by 2023. [Interruption.] No, the Member said we will still be operating rusting rolling stock that we have now. [Interruption.] No.