6. Welsh Conservatives Debate: School Standards

– in the Senedd on 19 September 2018.

Alert me about debates like this

(Translated)

The following amendments have been selected: amendment 1 in the name of Julie James, and amendments 2 and 3 in the name of Rhun ap Iorwerth.

Photo of Ann Jones Ann Jones Labour 4:41, 19 September 2018

(Translated)

The next item is the Welsh Conservatives' debate on school standards, and I call on Suzy Davies to move the motion. Suzy Davies.  

(Translated)

Motion NDM6776 Paul Davies

To propose that the National Assembly for Wales:

1. Regrets that the GCSE attainment of A*-C grades in Wales for summer 2018 were the worst since 2005.

2. Expresses concern over school standards, given the number of Welsh schools placed in special measures by Estyn and in receipt of warning notices from Welsh local education authorities.

3. Calls on the Welsh Government to invest more in education to address the funding gap per pupil between England and Wales.

(Translated)

Motion moved.

Photo of Suzy Davies Suzy Davies Conservative 4:42, 19 September 2018

Diolch yn fawr, Dirprwy Lywydd. I've had quite a lot to do in my first 24 hours in this new role. I want to begin, colleagues, on behalf of us all, I think, by offering my congratulations to students, teachers and staff across Wales on the work that you put into this year's exams, and offer our best wishes to everybody, whatever their results. 

There are many ways to shape a future, and exam certificates are just some of the tools that you have to do that. Our role here is to be certain that those tools are the best quality and what you personally need to begin shaping the type of future that you will find sustaining, satisfying and productive. But not everybody's sustaining, satisfying and productive future will be shaped by good exam results, so it is just as much our role to build an education system that helps our young people to acquire different tools to build those lives—something I'm sure we'll debate on another day.

So, if Members who were hoping to contribute to this debate by calling this motion an attack on all those I've just congratulated, then you're barking up the wrong tree. This debate is about holding Welsh Government to account on the delivery of promises we all want to see kept: higher standards, more confident learners, more relevant course content leading to worthwhile academic qualifications in this case, which command the respect of all. And as the motion suggests, Cabinet Secretary, you're not there yet.

The purpose of a debate like this, at various intervals, is going to test whether the path you're on is going anywhere near the destination you're seeking. And the response to point 1 of our motion, given in your first amendment, is so full of whataboutery that I suspect that you too are worried by the fact that GCSE attainment of A* to C grades this summer is the worst in 13 years. These new Wales-only GCSEs were supposed to get the best out of our students.

Now, let's be fair here: the number of As and A*s at GCSE have gone up a little bit compared to last year—about 0.5 per cent—although still lower than the two previous years. But personally, I'm pleased to see some growth. I'd like to think that the brightest students are getting a fairer share of attention, which has been difficult when schools have felt compelled to concentrate on students on the C/D GCSE borderline to avoid negative statistics. And I'm not necessarily blaming schools for that. I'm blaming decades of a system that, despite years of talking about this, has done nothing to achieve parity of esteem for non-academic qualifications. It's meant countless young people being shoehorned into GCSE courses that depress their achievement and confidence while they miss out on a different education that could identify and fertilise their strengths.

Back to the motion. The number of highest fliers has gone up a little, but the proportion of A* to C grades has fallen down by 1.2 per cent on last year. That may not sound a lot, but it is worth remembering that last year's results were themselves the lowest since 2006, with Qualifications Wales and Welsh Government blaming the bad news on the leap in early entries—pupils aged 15 or younger.

Photo of Suzy Davies Suzy Davies Conservative 4:45, 19 September 2018

Now, we've had years of inappropriate early entries and we should have stopped this long ago. But now that they have been stopped—they were down by 77 per cent this year—the attainment of good GCSE grades is lower still: A* to C in maths, English language and literature, Welsh language, biology, chemistry and physics—the biggies—all down according to Qualifications Wales. You cannot disguise this, Cabinet Secretary, as you've attempted to do in your amendment, by combining these unfortunate figures with others. We've accepted a modest improvement in the percentage of A and A* grades at GCSE, but you're hoping to suggest an overall better picture by adding in growth in those particular grades and A* to C grades at A-level.

What you don't say is that the number of learners taking A-levels fell by 10 per cent—10 per cent. Qualifications Wales said that 'fewer weaker candidates'—their words, not mine—took A-levels this year, so of course the proportion of top grades rose. A 50 per cent increase in the numbers taking GCSE science, the new version—that is great news. But is that because a chunk of them didn't take the exam in year 10, as happened in previous cohorts? The small improvements in maths and maths numeracy at 16 don't disguise the overall drop for all-age entries either, but certainly confirm the good sense in getting rid of early entry. I'm glad to see, however, that both of us take Qualifications Wales at their word when they say that, despite all the changes, standards are stable. It is, therefore, I say, perfectly fair to compare this year with last year and those years before. 

Before returning to the motion again, can I just commend you on your bravery in referring to the IFS figures in point c of your first amendment, Cabinet Secretary? It's hardly a victory to claim that the spending per pupil here is now much nearer that of a different Government purely on the grounds that that other Government is now less generous than it was previously. Yes indeed, the UK Government is spending less per head than it was in 2008, but so are you, and, from the point where the data between England and Wales is fully consistent, which is 2013-14, roughly, Welsh spending per head has declined year on year, whereas the decline in England only started two years ago. And why has there been a decrease in per head spend in England? Because there's been a 10 per cent rise in pupil population, with which resources have not yet caught up. Why has there been a decrease in spend per head in Wales—and it is still about 2 per cent lower? Static pupil numbers and a deliberate cut in total spending—a very different story and one wholly at odds with the pledge to invest an extra £100 million on driving up school standards made in your programme for government. Point 3 of our motion and both the Plaid amendments, which we support, speak to that very different story. So, let's see how you spend that £23.5 million Barnett consequential that you'll be getting from the UK Government. Perhaps you can tell us as well whether you plan to use the opportunity of local government reform as an opportunity for education funding reform as well.

To finish, Dirprwy Lywydd, on point 2 of our motion and our worry over the number of Welsh schools of concern to Estyn and in receipt of local authority warning notices, regardless of the Government's amendment's reference to the OECD, there are 45 education institutions across half of Wales's local authorities that are in special measures or in need of significant improvement. One of them's been in that state for four years. I think the number of red category secondary schools has risen, and, as you know, we've argued in the past that the yellow and green category schools—the increase there is just as much a product of changing the categories as it is genuine improvement. Only a third of those statutory warning notices to schools has been complied with. I think this is pretty grim and I don't imagine for one second that you're any happier with this situation than we are. But I did hope that, because of your commitment to education, you would take a step that your Cabinet colleagues seem determined to avoid.

I've spent years listening to the Cabinet Secretary for health, in particular, telling us of his expectations of health boards when it comes to scrutiny of performance. And, when those expectations have gone unmet, he just repeats his expectations. His powers of intervention go unused and LHB management remains unsupported as a result, and, in some cases, unpunished. You have powers under the School Standards and Organisation (Wales) Act 2013 to intervene in underperforming schools when it becomes clear that they cannot sort themselves out despite all the school challenge and consortium support that they have. As of January this year, those powers have not been exercised in the five years of the Act's existence. Now, I believe that every school should have the chance to be the architect of its own recovery, but there comes a time when a Cabinet Secretary has to consider the tools he or she has to shape people's futures and treat those powers to intervene as duties to intervene. And I'd like to know if you think that time has now come. Thank you.

Photo of Ann Jones Ann Jones Labour 4:50, 19 September 2018

Thank you. I have selected the three amendments to the motion, and can I call on the Cabinet Secretary for Education to formally move amendment 1, tabled in the name of Julie James?

(Translated)

Amendment 1—Julie James

Delete all and replace with:

To propose that the National Assembly for Wales:

1. Welcomes:

a. that the proportion of pupils being awarded top grades at A*-A in GCSE and A-levels has increased;

b. an increase of 50 per cent in the number of entries for GCSE Science, with more entries gaining A*-C;

c. an increase in A*-C in GCSE Mathematics and Mathematics-Numeracy when recognising best outcome obtained by 16-year-olds across November and summer series; and

d. that 76.3 per cent of A-Level pupils gained A*-C, the highest since 2009.  

2. Notes:

a. Qualification Wales’s warning that with the scale and complexity of recent changes, care should be taken when drawing any conclusions from comparing summer 2018 GCSE results and previous years but overall performance remains broadly stable;

b. that the OECD reported progress in several policy areas and a shift in the Welsh approach to school improvement away from a piecemeal and short-term policy orientation towards one that is guided by a long-term vision; and

c. the Institute for Fiscal Studies’ conclusion that school spending per pupil has fallen by more in England than in Wales over the last eight years, virtually eliminating the gap in spending per pupil between the two countries.

(Translated)

Amendment 1 moved.

Photo of Ann Jones Ann Jones Labour

Thank you. Can I now call on Llyr Gruffydd to move amendments 2 and 3, tabled in the name of Rhun ap Iorwerth?

(Translated)

Amendment 2—Rhun ap Iorwerth

Add as new point at end of motion:

Calls on the Welsh Government to provide enough investment in education to ensure that the whole education workforce receives sufficient training of a high standard.

Amendment 3—Rhun ap Iorwerth

Add as new point at end of motion:

Calls on the Welsh Government to provide enough investment in education to ensure that the pay and conditions on the whole education workforce attracts a highly skilled workforce.

(Translated)

Amendments 2 and 3 moved.

Photo of Llyr Gruffydd Llyr Gruffydd Plaid Cymru 4:50, 19 September 2018

Thank you, Deputy Presiding Officer. I move those amendments in the name of Plaid Cymru. Of course, we have seen a number of changes and reforms over the years, particularly maybe over the last two Assembly terms. We've seen the review of the qualifications system, we've seen an ongoing review now of the national curriculum, we've seen changes to additional learning needs as well, of course. And the Welsh Government and Qualifications Wales regularly remind us, as we've heard, that, due to the scale and the complexity of those recent changes, we should take care when drawing any conclusions from comparing results from one year to the other. Well, you know what? I've been here for probably seven years now, and I don't think I've had a single year where I haven't been told that it's difficult to make those comparisons, and that underlines to me, I think, the way that the Welsh Government has constantly been reforming, changing, moving the goalposts—largely, I'm sure, rightly so. But it just leaves me wondering whether we'll ever get to a level of consistency within the system where we can in future, maybe, make those kinds of comparisons.

And spare a thought for the teachers who are grappling with those changes at the coalface on a daily basis, and, of course, the biggest change is yet to come in that curriculum reform and the consequential changes in qualifications and assessment systems.

There is an irony, I think, in that no doubt the Cabinet Secretary will tell us in a minute that we mustn't make those year-on-year comparisons, but, in the Government's own amendment, of course, it welcomes the increase in A* to C GCSE maths and maths numeracy results. Well, I'm not sure that we can have it both ways. Maybe we can, but, you know, what does that do in terms of confusing people out there as to whether we can or cannot make meaningful comparisons?

I have to say that, given the huge reduction in early entry to GCSE this year compared to last—I think around 16 per cent of all qualifications last year were early entry and it's now barely 4 per cent this year—I was hoping that maybe that would have an impression on the overall A* to C pass rate, but it is disappointing that we've seen the headline statistic again down this year. And, of course, the gap between attainment in Wales, England and Northern Ireland—whilst there may be caveats and health warnings, it is a comparison that people will make. So, maybe the question we should be asking is: if comparing is difficult, what is the Welsh Government doing to educate pupils, parents and the wider public about how we do that?

So, whilst making annual comparisons is admittedly increasingly difficult, I think there is one thing that is plain to see, and that is, of course, that it is unrealistic and unfair of the Welsh Government and anyone else to expect year-on-year improvement in A-level and GCSE performance when, of course, we see year-on-year school budgets reducing and shrinking and the resources available diminishing. Unless, of course, schools and local authorities are provided with fairer funding, then I don't think we can realistically expect our pupils to be constantly improving and achieving their full potential.

Local authorities, teachers, teaching unions—they tell us that schools have now reached crisis point. Following real-terms cuts to per pupil funding of £300 since 2009, the education unions are saying that we're seeing increases in class sizes, it's leading to an overreliance on teaching assistants, who aren't, of course, properly paid, it's leading to a detrimental impact on the curriculum, and pupils' education will inevitably suffer as a result. So, it's a miracle, actually, that they are performing as well as they are performing under those circumstances. And that does have an effect or an impact on teachers' and pupils' morale as well, and there's a vicious circle, isn't there, really? With diminishing levels of staffing in many of our schools, the workload on the remaining teachers is much higher and the pressures and the stress are bound to show. It's certainly reflected in the way that fewer people are being attracted into the profession now, with numbers of new trainee teachers missing targets, secondary school teachers targets missed by over a third in 2016-17, the target missed as well for primary school trainees, and a third of teachers who responded to the Education Workforce Council's national education workforce survey said that they intended to leave the profession in the next three years. And, of course National Education Union Cymru figures as well have shown that over 15,000 working days a year are now lost by teachers due to stress-related illnesses.

Now, Plaid Cymru's fully costed manifesto from 2016 outlined how we would introduce a number of initiatives, including an annual premium payment to teachers and a payment as well to teaching assistants—we mustn't forget them. We talked about a greater focus on allowing time for training, a greater emphasis on continuing professional development, more time to prepare and to teach and to mark, but, of course, all of this costs money, and we recognise that. But creating a world-class education system will cost money, and we mustn't fool ourselves that we can do it any other way. So, the Welsh Government must step up to that mark, and it's only then that we can fairly and reasonable expect our teachers and our pupils to achieve the improved standards and results that we all want to see.

Photo of Mohammad Asghar Mohammad Asghar Conservative 4:56, 19 September 2018

'We were once the nation that championed education—we were pioneers of state schools, high standards and achievement and had one of the first universities that was open to all. Now we underperform at every level.'

These are not my words, Deputy Presiding Officer; these are the words of the Cabinet Secretary for Education in her leadership speech to the Welsh Liberal Democrat Party conference four years ago, and, today, my speech, actually, is covering her promises and her words and her performance in the last few years.

In her speech, in Newport, she claimed

'a generation of our children have been let down by an education system that continues to struggle.'

Sadly, that struggle continues today. GCSE results this year are the worst in over a decade. Attainment of grades A to C for all ages have fallen in Welsh language, English literature, the sciences and mathematics. This is particularly worrying when you consider that the number of learners taking A-levels have fallen by nearly 10 per cent since 2015. Four years ago, the Cabinet Secretary deplored the poor PISA results for Wales. She bemoaned the fact that, for a third time in a row, Wales fell behind the rest of the United Kingdom in reading, maths and science. And yet figures published by the OECD show that Wales has the worst performing education system in the United Kingdom. For the fourth time in a decade, Wales finished significantly behind all other UK nations in the PISA ranking. Estyn's most recent figures show that 45 education institutions across Wales are currently in special measures or in need of significant improvement. I'm concerned to see that the highest number of education institutions in special measures are in Newport, with Torfaen having the highest number of schools in need of significant improvement—both, of course, in my south-east Wales region. As the Cabinet Secretary said in one of her conference speeches four years ago—the quote is:

'Too many of our schools are underperforming—all of them underfunded.'

Today, schools in Wales remain significantly underfunded, with serious consequences for educational standards across our country. According to NASUWT, the spend per pupil funding gap between England and Wales has widened to £678. This has had a devastating knock-on effect on teacher retention, teacher training, school building repairs and various measures to support the learning needs of disadvantaged groups and children from poorer families. The Cabinet Secretary initially cut funding to educate children of Gypsy, Roma and Traveller groups, traditionally amongst the most deprived in Wales, and has failed to reinstate the grant in full. Estyn claim the gap between the proportion of pupils eligible for free school meals achieving five A to C GCSEs and those who are not remains stubbornly high, and all this on the watch of the Cabinet Secretary who claimed four years ago—again, she said, in her words—

'in Labour's Wales, a child from the poorest background is much less likely to do well at school than children from similar backgrounds in England.'

Quote closed. Deputy Presiding Officer, to quote from the Cabinet Secretary's speech from 2014 one more time:

'This great nation of ours which has so many talented people and such great community spirit, is too often being let down by a lacklustre government that fails to deliver time and time again.'

I agree with that. It is a tragedy for Wales that the Cabinet Secretary chose to join this lacklustre failing Government to keep it in office. Thank you.

Photo of Michelle Brown Michelle Brown UKIP 5:00, 19 September 2018

'No significant improvements in Welsh education until 2022'. Those aren't my words, but those of the chief inspector of schools in Wales. Now, that might not be too bad if the Welsh education system were the best in the world, or even the best in Europe. The best in the UK would make it less worrying that there will be four years of stagnation. But, that isn't the case, is it? Under this Labour Government, who talk about equality, Wales has the worst education system in the UK. 

On 1 December 2016, the Cabinet Secretary for Education told The Guardian that there was a 'new sense of purpose', and voiced her disappointment at not doing very well in PISA. That's a very spun way of saying, 'Not doing very well in the classroom', 'Not doing very well for our families and their children' and 'Not doing very well for our economy that needs educated workers and entrepreneurs'. How can we attract young, aspirational families to Wales when an expert tells them that the failing education system will not be fixed for at least another four years?

We have a shortage of doctors and other highly educated professionals, but we're never going to be able to attract those who have benefited from a decent education and want the same for their children to bring their skills and their families here. What advice would the Government give to parents thinking of moving to Wales—'Don't bother for the next four years'? The 2016 article made reference to the previous lost decade, yet the Cabinet Secretary only talked about a new sense of purpose. Well, that was nearly two years ago, and what have been the results of that new sense of purpose as guided by the Cabinet Secretary? Let's hear the words of the chief inspector for schools again: 'No significant improvements in Welsh education until 2022'.

Over the past couple of years, the Cabinet Secretary and Minister have produced a seemingly endless stream of statements announcing that money will be allocated to various projects and a fair few talking shops have been created. But, how can we trust that these changes will work? The Labour Government has been running education for more than 20 years and failing since day 1. What excuse is there for the decades of failure? Will the Cabinet Secretary be willing to explain it? I doubt it. We need to know that the Government knows what has been going wrong so that we can be confident that they will fix the problems, but the Labour amendment shows that we have no reason to believe that Labour understand the problem. And therefore, they're incapable of fixing it. I can tell from the Cabinet Secretary's reaction that she doesn't think there's a problem, but I'm sure I'll hear from her on that in a minute.

They say performance has been stable—yes, it has not wavered from being bad; it's solidly poor. So, UKIP will be supporting this motion unamended. Labour may feel that they don't need to do much with the portfolio that they've dumped on their Lib Dem scapegoat, but the rest of Wales does. We are fed up with a Government that systematically uses the launch of a new initiative as cover for previous bad performance and as a way of deflecting justified criticism. Stop letting our young people down and start being part of building their future and the future economy of Wales. Fund education properly now and don't accept that nothing will be improved until 2022—that's far too late for thousands of young people. Thank you.

Photo of David Melding David Melding Conservative 5:03, 19 September 2018

Cabinet Secretary, I hope you'll forgive me for having the temerity to start with some good news, because actually there is some good news out there. I know we bumped into each other in the canteen during the summer recess, proving that AMs continue to work through what the outside world continues to call the holiday period, and I did explain that my niece Nia was about to get her A-level grades and she was sitting STEM subjects. We were talking about the need to encourage pupils to take on the challenge of STEM subjects and I'm delighted to say that she did get her grades and got the place in her first preference, which is the University of East Anglia, to read environmental engineering. So, she's off to Norwich on Saturday, Deputy Presiding Officer, and I'm sure that we all want to send our best wishes to all our young people who are embarking on this most exciting stage of life. They demonstrate the potential of our young people, and, of course, it's always a tragedy when we don't reach that level where the maximum number of our young people can have those sorts of life experiences and start to meet their real potential.

So, it's really important that we challenge ourselves in terms of the standards we are delivering in education, and I think it's appropriate for us to look at these exam results, to look at PISA, and to urge the Government to have a strategy that really does turn us around so that we can again be the place to be in the United Kingdom, or perhaps Europe and the world. Why not? That's the sort of ambition we should have, so that future generations will talk about our education system the way that many did talk about the number of teachers and professionals that were produced by the Welsh education system generations ago. And that's how we want the rest of the UK, I think, to talk about us.

Can I say that my own particular commitment to the education sector is in the area of special needs? I'm the chair of the governing body at Meadowbank School, which is a primary school for children with speech and language learning difficulties and, now, wider disabilities as well. And, in relation to this afternoon's debate, I'm the chair of governors at Headlands School, which is a school for young people with significant emotional and behavioural difficulties. It's technically an independent school run by the charity Action for Children, but in effect it provides places to the state sector. I think it's a real glowing example of what high expectations deliver, because there there is a culture of achievement and high expectations. Our motto is 'Expectations are everything', and we encourage young people to sit GCSEs and A-levels, and I'm delighted to say that some will now be leaving us and going on to further education or higher education. That's the sort of outcome that we want to see, because we should see these young people as full of potential, and not see their particular difficulty as defining them.

I think other groups are key here when it comes to expectation: those that are in receipt of free school meals—we need to do much better for that group of young people—and then, also, care-experienced children. I'm not going to concentrate on that, this afternoon, but clearly they are in a similar category. Again, I think our expectations must be higher when we set our policies and what we expect of schools: what support mechanisms they should have in place. How are they meeting the obvious deficiencies that some in those areas will experience, like where can they go and do homework, have access to modern equipment? And even our young people that can't rely on their parents or guardians to help with their maths homework or something. This is a common experience, and we should be able, in our system, to ensure that those students get the support that others do when they've got access through friends and relatives to that type of expertise.

So, I think it's really, really important, and I would like to see things like the Estyn inspection process tweaked so that we really do emphasise subsets when it comes to performance in exams, such as special needs—that are catered for in the main stream; that's an increasing direction for public policy and one I'm broadly in favour of—and, as I said, free school meals and care-experienced children. Above all, I never want to see in Wales a culture develop where certain students are discouraged from sitting GCSEs or A-levels because it is seen as a way of disguising the actual overall performance in that school community. 

Photo of Nick Ramsay Nick Ramsay Conservative 5:09, 19 September 2018

The problem with speaking at this point in any debate—well, certainly this one—is that many things have been said. Half the Members have already put the boot into the poor Lib Dem scapegoat, or whatever. They were unfortunate words that they used, and they were not my words, Kirsty—they're words of other Members. And now David Melding has pulled the positive rug from under my feet by talking about some of the good things that have happened in Wales. So, there is little left for me to add to the good comments that have gone before, other than to say that I would also like to add my congratulations to students who've worked so hard to achieve their grades this summer, as well as the teachers and the parents who supported them. I hope that at least most students got what they needed to progress on to the next stage of their careers. I'm delighted to hear about your relative, David Melding, and wish her all the best at the University of East Anglia.

While a number of results across Wales may have been disappointing, I would like to highlight some of the results in schools in my own constituency, including my old school, Croesyceiliog, which bucked the national trend and saw an improvement in the percentage of students getting five A* to C grades including English and Maths. At A-level, Monmouth Comprehensive School and King Henry VIII School saw increases in the percentage of students getting three A* to C grades, rising to 75 per cent and 55 per cent respectively, as well as a promising improvement in the pass rate in Chepstow. I know that you've got all these figures at your fingertips, so you know these, Cabinet Secretary. [Interruption.] I'm going to stop there with the schools. Overall, Monmouthshire saw improvements in all the key indicators at A-level, but at GCSE, Monmouthshire's secondary schools did follow the national trend and saw a dip in the five A* to C measure, so I think I'd like to hear—and we'd all like to hear—from the Cabinet Secretary some of the reasons that you feel we are seeing this Wales-wide decline at that level of qualification.

Given that we are dealing with new qualifications, how can you assure us that standards are being maintained from year to year, and that a C achieved in 2016 is of an equal standard to that achieved in 2017 or 2018? There are very real concerns in schools that the hurdles have not been secured at the exact same height. If that is just a perception, then it is a perception, but it's one that needs to be addressed and dealt with so that we can have confidence in the system. I'm sure you would agree that we need rigorous and robust qualifications. Grading must also be fair to each year group so that our economy can have confidence in what those grades mean.

Now, as you know, Cabinet Secretary, I'm a reasonable man and, in the ilk of David Melding, I must say that there are areas that impact on school standards where the Welsh Government deserves some credit. Last week, the First Minister visited the brand-new Monmouth Comprehensive School—a £45 million joint project between the Welsh Government and the Conservative-run Monmouthshire County Council. I know that the First Minister has been impressed with what has been achieved there—an awe-inspiring building and an example of Welsh Government and local authority collaboration in delivering on the twenty-first century school model. I also recognise that the Welsh Government has committed to a further contribution to my local authority in the next round of twenty-first century schools funding in an effort to upgrade some of what is left of some of the worst buildings, particularly in the secondary sector. So, I look forward to hearing about your plans to continue the process of redesigning education through modifying our school buildings.

Finally, I'd like to say a little about the funding gap, which other Members have touched on, and I welcome that, finally, in a Government amendment, there is a tentative acceptance that there is a funding gap, although you claim that that has narrowed, not because of any action by the Welsh Government, but due to decisions in England. I don't think this is the case with education of simply passing the buck and blaming the UK Government, which we hear too often. Clearly, there is an issue with funding across the board, but we do have to make the most of the resources we have and make sure that that is best targeted. The fact remains that there has been, and continues to be, a funding gap of hundreds of pounds per pupil, which, in an average primary school of 210 pupils, could mean as much as £100,000 per year. That's extra teachers, teaching assistants, information technology equipment, all those people who contribute to the positive outcomes in young people achieving their full potential. That's the reality on the ground. My own local authority has increased school spending as a share of its budget, despite receiving some of the deepest cuts of any local authority in Wales in terms of the overall amount—the revenue support grant—and we know that the underfunding of rural councils continues to be a problem. You know full well, coming from a rural constituency, what that can mean.

Finally, Dirprwy Lywydd, as we heard in the previous debate, we often hear a lot of words in this Chamber that are very well meaning, but, I think, to paraphrase Lee Waters in the previous debate, the time for words is rapidly coming to an end and we really need to see some action and some improvement in these areas.

Photo of Caroline Jones Caroline Jones UKIP 5:14, 19 September 2018

I would like to thank the Welsh Conservatives for bringing forward this important debate today. As a former teacher, I'm passionate about affording pupils the opportunities to capitalise on their talents and enable them to fulfil their ambitions. Whilst I recognise the progress that has been made, we still have a long path to tread, and we have to have a workable strategy in place to ensure success for Welsh pupils, not only for this generation, but for the generations to follow. Factually, this year's GCSE results are the worst in a decade, and it is noticed that curriculum changes have been further delayed. According to the head of Estyn, we won't see any significant progress until after 2022, and I feel that that's leaving it far too late for the current cohort of pupils. The current generation of pupils are our future, and we must ensure that all the stops are pulled out to give them every chance to succeed in their ambitions. These young people are our future doctors, our nurses, computer programmers, data scientists and business leaders. If we don't equip them with the necessary skills and knowledge, then how are they going to fulfil their dreams and ambitions? Without those skills, our economy will suffer and our health and social care sector will be understaffed, adding more pressure to an already pressurised environment.

Education is the foundation of our nation and the success of our economy is dependent on the success of our educational achievements and attainments of future generations. We have become too focused in meeting artificial targets rather than outcomes. Just this week, the Association of School and College Leaders highlighted that target pressures are seeing pupils being removed from school registers so that their grades do not count towards the school's performance measures. This is deplorable, and thankfully the Welsh Government has indicated that this will not be tolerated. 

However, this is the situation that has been created. Teachers are under immense pressure to meet performance targets despite falling budgets. We need to move away from artificial performance measures and focus on providing an education system that focuses upon the needs of the child. We have to have a curriculum that focuses upon the needs of our nation as well as the child, and above all, we have to ensure that schools have the resources to meet those needs.

This year's GCSE results are a wake-up call, but it is also an opportunity to look at things differently, and work on things that have maybe not been as successful as we want. So we've got this golden opportunity here, and as a person who believes strongly in devolution, and as a former teacher, I believe in giving our young people the opportunity. We have it in our hands. Come on, let's all work together and give everyone the opportunity they deserve so that we can all work together for a positive outcome. Thank you.

Photo of Ann Jones Ann Jones Labour 5:17, 19 September 2018

Thank you. Can I now call the Cabinet Secretary for Education, Kirsty Williams? 

Photo of Kirsty Williams Kirsty Williams Liberal Democrat 5:18, 19 September 2018

Thank you very much, Deputy Presiding Officer. Back in August I had the privilege of celebrating examination results with the learners at Ysgol Gyfun Gymraeg Glantaf for A-levels and the West Monmouth School on GCSE day. I'd like to congratulate David's niece. I predicted that as a student of STEM she would do well, and clearly she has, and I know that there are other Assembly Members in this Chamber who had a direct interest in GCSE results day, and I know that they had much to celebrate in their own families. I'm sure colleagues will want to congratulate learners across Wales on their own tremendous achievements and agree with me when I take this opportunity to praise our teachers for their hard work across all the areas of education and particularly those who have worked so tirelessly to adapt to changes in delivering the new GCSE qualifications, including the 15 that were awarded for the first time this summer.

I must admit, Deputy Presiding Officer, to being disappointed to read the Conservatives' motion, which completely ignores the positives in this summer's results. For starters, they completely skip over and ignore this year's A-level results as it doesn't fit their narrative. Hopefully they will welcome the fact that 76.3 per cent of learners in Wales gained an A* to C in their A-levels, and that is the highest since 2009. Hopefully they will also welcome the highest ever proportion of students achieving an A-level A*. In fact, when it comes to A* to A performances at A-level, it is only the region of London and the south-east that does better than Wales. 

With regard to GCSEs, it is of course correct, and I am the first to acknowledge, that there has been a dip in overall results when compared to last year. What I will not accept, and I do not accept, is that there has been a drop in standards. In fact, quite the opposite. I have been clear that this Government will support all of our learners. We must never lower our expectations for any of our young people, no matter what their background. And that is why I will make no apologies for keeping the pressure up rather than taking the easy option and coasting.

Photo of Kirsty Williams Kirsty Williams Liberal Democrat 5:20, 19 September 2018

I welcome the strong action that has been taken by schools in switching from vocational science to GCSE science. Taking vocational qualifications at 16, such as BTEC science, is absolutely the right path for some of our learners in Wales. But it is not acceptable to me, and I would hope to others in the Chamber today, that schools have thought it appropriate for 40 per cent of learners to be taking a vocational course. This might have got them the desired results in terms of school performance measures, but that should never, never ever come before the interests of learners. And you and I, David, are at one on that point.

I am pleased that this year we have seen an increase of 50 per cent in the number of students being entered for GCSE science—I repeat: 50 per cent more entries in GCSE science—with more of those entries gaining A* to C. And it’s also very pleasing to see the individual sciences—biology, chemistry and physics—those entries are up by over 10 per cent. Now, having such a huge increase in a cohort will of course distort the results. We all knew that this difficult decision would make it easier for the opponents to criticise and misrepresent the overall results. It is a tough decision, but it’s also the right decision—raising standards and improving the opportunity for all of our learners and, most of all, for those from a poorer background. This move, alongside others, such as ending the inappropriate use of early entry, does make it difficult to draw meaningful comparisons. It simply makes no sense to compare this year’s results with previous years. Now, that isn’t my view—that’s the view of the independent regulator, Qualifications Wales, who has described making comparisons as 'simplistic', due to the significant shift in the size and the nature of the cohort, let alone the changes to the examinations themselves.

And I have to say, I have been somewhat confused by the approach taken by the new Conservative spokesperson. She fails, it seems, to understand the unitised nature of our new science GCSEs. She wants parity of esteem between vocational qualifications and academic qualifications, but then goes on to criticise a drop in A-level entries. Let’s be absolutely clear why there’s a drop in A-level entries—when there’s a drop in the cohort, there are simply fewer students of that age in our schools and colleges. And for those students who were struggling with A-levels, because they were forced into A-levels, moving to more vocational qualifications is absolutely the right thing. So, you can’t say on one hand you are sorry that less-able students are not doing A-level anymore, and then call for parity of esteem. You absolutely also fail to understand the ongoing impact of early entry on overall figures, but we have changed that policy. We’re also changing performance measures to the very system that you’ve just called for that looks at a more holistic approach to how we judge our schools. We are investing in leadership, we’re investing in our more able and talented children and we're spending more on the pupil deprivation grant than ever before to address the concerns of vulnerable groups that David Melding just mentioned. And let me be absolutely clear: money received by this Government for pay of teachers will be spent on the pay of teachers.

Now, this idea that we somehow sit back and do nothing about schools that are causing concern is simply nonsense. The reason why I know the results of King Henry in Abergavenny is because we look in-depth at each individual school. We double back and check the relationship they have had with their regional consortium. We have asked local authorities to report on each time they’ve used a statutory notice for a school causing concern, and I receive regular reports to understand, from each local authority and consortium, what they have done to support the school that is in special measures. And if I’m not satisfied with that response, then I go back to that regional consortium and I go back to that local authority.

There is so much I could say about Michelle’s characterisation of the Welsh education system. She talked about doctors. How are we going to get doctors to come to Wales? Well, maybe those doctors will be the record number of Welsh students who have achieved a place in medical school for this academic year. They will come back to this country to be doctors, so that their children can receive exactly the same education that they have had that enabled them to go to medical school. And scapegoat? Every day, I am proud to do this job, and I'm even prouder when I remember that by taking this job it kept you, and the pernicious views expressed by your leader yesterday, from getting anywhere near the Government.

With regard to Plaid Cymru's amendments, we will be supporting both of them. I am committed, Llyr, to continuing to invest in our workforce to ensure that we have a whole education workforce that receives sufficient training of a high standard. A £5.85 million professional learning funding allocation was awarded to regional consortia during 2017-18 to support the work of professional learning pioneers and to enhance consortia capacity to develop the national approach to professional learning. We have also made available a further £5.5 million during 2018-19 to develop a national approach to professional learning to ensure that all schools are able to plan appropriately for curriculum change and beyond.

As you will know—it's something that both my party and your party have campaigned on for a number of years—the Welsh Government will assume responsibility for setting teachers' pay and conditions from the end of this month. I am expecting this week to receive an important report from Professor Mick Waters with options on how we can use those new powers to better reward our teachers and attract high-quality recruits to the profession. One thing I will reiterate, though, is that this isn't just about money and salaries. Those who want to work with our children are motivated by something so much more than that—there are better ways to get rich. They are motivated by the desire to be part of the public sector workforce to do something amazing for our children and young people.

So, we also have to look at the issue of conditions. Taking over responsibility for teachers' pay and conditions is an incredibly important step in our education system. Right from the outset, we want to make sure that we have a system based on the values of equity and of excellence, and a commitment to an inclusive public service education. I believe that this is fundamental to supporting and strengthening our teaching profession.

To conclude, Llywydd, we do not support the Conservatives' motion, which simply misrepresents and talks down the changes and the progress that we are making here in Wales. I certainly won't be lectured by them on issues of funding.

Mohammad Asghar was at great pains to quote the OECD, so let me tell him what the OECD says about our system. We are seeing

'Progress in several policy areas and a shift in the Welsh approach to school improvement away from a piecemeal and short-term policy orientation towards one that is guided by a long-term vision.'

I know—I know—that there is no room for complacency, but working together with the sector, we will continue our national mission to raise standards, reduce the attainment gap and deliver an education system that is a source of national pride and enjoys public confidence. 

Photo of Ann Jones Ann Jones Labour 5:28, 19 September 2018

Thank you. Can I now call on Darren Millar to reply to the debate?

Photo of Darren Millar Darren Millar Conservative

Thank you, Deputy Presiding Officer. Can I thank the Cabinet Secretary for responding to our debate, although, obviously, I disagree, largely, with what she said? Our debate, of course, was opened by Suzy Davies, our new spokesperson in this role, and I thought she did an excellent job, despite the disparaging view of the Cabinet Secretary. I certainly welcome her to the role and know that she will be a formidable champion for the Welsh education system and will fight to improve it tooth and nail every step of the way.

She set out very clearly, I thought, the reality of the situation and the challenges that we face. We had, although you wouldn't imagine that this was the case, given the Cabinet Secretary's speech just now, the worst set of GCSE results for over 15 years. How is that something that we can be proud of here in Wales? The Cabinet Secretary seemed to suggest that it was because she'd discouraged people from doing the science BTEC course as a vocational course and encouraged people to take up GCSE sciences, but it wasn't just the sciences that those figures dipped in. We also saw worse results in maths, worse results in English language and worse results in English literature—just three subjects that I've picked out at random. So, you can't simply suggest that it's because you're encouraging more people to take those academic qualifications.

Frankly, I'm fed up of hearing people diss vocational qualifications in this Chamber. We've heard all of this 'parity of esteem' talk from the Government in the past, yet you've actually sought to disincentivise schools from encouraging people to take appropriate vocational qualifications where that is what is best for the children under their care. 

Photo of Darren Millar Darren Millar Conservative 5:30, 19 September 2018

I would be the first person in this Chamber to acknowledge the hard work of teachers across Wales, who do their best to support learners to achieve their potential. I want to congratulate as well those young people across Wales, including my own daughter and my own son, who managed to get decent grades in their GCSEs and A-levels this year. I also think it's appropriate to thank the school governors who've contributed to the success and turnaround in many of our schools. We had David Melding talk about his experience as a school governor and I know that there are many, including myself, that are also school governors in this Chamber. But these people are volunteers, giving of their own time, dedicating themselves to their community by serving on those school governing bodies, and I want to pay tribute to each and every one of them. 

The Cabinet Secretary likes to choose and make comparisons with England when it suits her, but doesn't like to make comparisons with other parts of the UK when it doesn't suit her. The reality is that we know that per-pupil funding in Wales is less than it is over the border in England. That has consequences for the opportunities for young people to have the resources in those schools to be able to reach their potential. These are not things that just, you know, I am saying or anybody on these benches; other individuals, the teaching unions, are also adding to a growing chorus of voices, frankly, that are saying you have to do something about this.

And I have to say, Suzy—. [Laughter.] And I have to say, Kirsty, pardon me—Cabinet Secretary—that it's a little bit rich of the Liberal Democrats to do a deal—we would rather Suzy there—to do a deal to go into Government on the basis that an extra £100 million is going to be invested in education to improve school standards, and then whip it away with cuts on the other hand, because you haven't actually increased school spending by £100 million over this term. That is not happening at all and, you know, if you get your calculator out it's very clear that that's not happened because, of course, the spending has been reducing.

I have a lot of sympathy, actually, for what Michelle Brown was saying earlier on in her contribution. Ultimately, it is our economy that will pay a price for this failure in future years. If we don't have a highly educated workforce that is fit for the future, our economy is going to suffer. And in addition, we're not going to attract people in to create the wealth in our country if we've got a poor education system, and we're going to discourage people from staying here also if our education system is poor. So, we've got to raise our game. We've got to make sure that it's better than it currently is.

Mohammad Asghar was absolutely right to point out the failures in recent years. He was absolutely right to talk about the wonderful heritage that we have as well here in Wales, in terms of the pioneering school movements that Griffith Jones of Llanddowror and others established all those many years ago. But the reality is that when we look at those PISA rankings, I'm not sure what the Government's expectation is going to be when the next set of rankings are going to be published, but I think that aspirations are pretty low in this Chamber because no-one feels very confident that we've managed to turn that situation around since the last set of results.

And I've heard what the inspectorate have said—the chief inspector—that we shouldn't expect any significant improvement until 2022. Well, frankly, that's too long for the children, as Caroline Jones rightly pointed out, that are currently in the education system. We've got to be more ambitious than having to wait four years and press the reset button at that point. We need to be turning this situation around right now for those young people, because otherwise they will be another failed generation as a result of this very tired Labour-led Government.

I think also we need to reflect on what is going on elsewhere in the UK, because the situation is improving, actually, in England. The standards are rising. They're holding their own in terms of the world economy and league tables. We're the only ones that are going backwards here to any significant extent. We're the only ones in the bottom half of the world rankings in terms of any home nation in the UK, and that is not something of which we can be proud.

So, I implore you, Cabinet Secretary, I implore you to get more money from the finance Cabinet Secretary in this year's budget round, invest it in our schools so that they have the resources that they need to be able to improve the results in future years. I urge you to pick up the pace of reform so that we don't have to wait for another four years before we see the improvements that we need. I urge you to give a shot in the arm to those teachers—not just in our schools but also in our further education colleges, those lecturers who've helped to deliver decent GCSE and A-level results this year—so that we can really begin to see the sort of potential that we have in Wales being fully realised. Because unless we see that, we won't see the future of Wales being the way that it ought to be. 

Photo of Ann Jones Ann Jones Labour 5:35, 19 September 2018

The proposal is to agree the motion without amendment. Does any Member object? [Objection.] Therefore we defer voting under this item until voting time. 

(Translated)

Voting deferred until voting time.