Questions now from the party spokespeople. The UKIP spokesperson, Michelle Brown.

Thank you, Presiding Officer. Cabinet Secretary, some time ago, I asked you if you saw any advantages for further and higher education establishments in leaving the EU and you replied that you didn't. An article by the BBC earlier this month highlighted that our colleges are discovering that there are opportunities for further and higher education for those who take the trouble to look for them. Does that article earlier this month, where the BBC reported that the head of Cardiff college said that Brexit is leading to a huge £3 million boost from Chinese students, show that you were wrong or is it the college principal who is wrong?

I'm very pleased that Cardiff and Vale College are looking to explore new opportunities. International students are very important to both our FE and HE institutions, and I would like to send a very clear message to students across the world that, in coming to study in Wales, they can be assured of a very positive experience. If only I could convince the Home Office not to include their numbers in our immigration figures, perhaps we could have even more of them.

Thank you for the answer, Cabinet Secretary. The vice-principal went on to say:

'Our partnership with China has become very strong over the last two years, potentially helped by Brexit.'

Your party—by which I mean the Liberal Democrat party that you represent, rather than the Labour Party that you've ended up serving—wants to ignore the votes of the majority of Welsh voters and stay in the EU, as do your fellow members of the Cabinet. If you get your way and secure a fake Brexit, what steps will you take to make up the multimillion-pound shortfall from the dividend that colleges and universities can expect from Brexit?

I have to say, Presiding Officer, that the Member, and perhaps her colleagues around her—but I can never tell whether there is consensus amongst the members of the UKIP group—are the only people who I know, in the FE and the HE sectors, who are approaching Brexit without trepidation. I would urge her to listen to Universities Wales and the FE sector about the very real challenges that are going to face further and higher education as a result of Brexit: the fact that there will be restrictions on the number of students who can come and study here; the fact that there is already a huge amount of disquiet from European members of faculty who are potentially already making decisions to leave Welsh HE and go and work elsewhere; the threat to Horizon 2020 and the threat to the availability of Welsh students to participate in Erasmus+. All of those issues present a very real threat to our FE and HE sectors. 

Thank you for the list of red herrings, Cabinet Secretary. I'll crack on to the practical aspect of this. I'd like to know what you're actually doing to help universities and colleges market themselves to the wider and more lucrative international student base. For example, have you asked vice-chancellors in FE colleges what practical support you can give them? For instance, sponsoring and organising their attendance at educational fairs and paying for the release of staff for them to do that in international markets such as China and Malaysia, which could be very lucrative for us, or how lending them endorsement from Welsh Government could give their marketing campaigns more impact, so that more students can be attracted to Wales. Can you please explain to me what practical measures you're currently taking to actually market our universities and colleges outside the EU, which is, actually, where the majority of the market is—not the EU?

Clearly, the Member did not particularly listen when I was recently at the Children, Young People and Education Committee giving evidence in this regard. If she had listened, she would be aware of the £2 million-plus investment that has been given to Global Wales via the European transition fund to assist them in marketing HE institutions abroad. In September, I hosted, alongside the vice-chancellor of Swansea University, a 'Study in Wales' event at the British consulate in New York. We continue to develop our relationships with the HE sector in Vietnam, and one of the pro vice-chancellors from University of Wales Trinity Saint David will be in Vietnam shortly, again developing systems-to-systems working.

But, let me be absolutely clear, while all this is very welcome, if the Member listens to Universities Wales, she will be aware of their huge concerns regarding the impact of Brexit. If she cared to listen to the student voice, she would be aware that those concerns expressed by the universities and the concerns expressed by me and this Government, are the concerns expressed by the student voice as well. I wonder why there is such consensus in this regard if these fears are unfounded.

Plaid Cymru spokesperson, Llyr Gruffydd.

Thank you very much, Llywydd. Minister, teachers in schools are to receive a pay rise of 3.5 per cent, or up to 3.5 per cent, but we will have a situation then where teachers teaching sixth-form pupils in schools will receive a pay rise, whilst those teaching sixth-form students in further education colleges won’t receive a corresponding pay rise. Now, I’m not going to ask you to intervene in the current negotiations, but, as a point of principle, do you agree that we need to ensure fair play in terms of salary to teachers in FE colleges, as compared to those in schools?

Well, may I say thank you very much, Llyr, for the question? You will be aware that teachers' salaries are currently decided by the Westminster Government, and we'll receive a consequential in order to pay for that, but that isn't happening as far as FE is concerned.

As regards the current situation, we’re monitoring the situation regarding the negotiations between the unions and ColegauCymru, and, let’s be clear, they are responsible for determining the salaries. But, in principle, I believe that it would make sense that a person teaching physics to the sixth form in a school deserves the same kind of salary as those teaching in sixth-form colleges.

Thank you for that clarity and thank you for accepting the principle, because that is an important message the sector wants to hear. According to ColegauCymru, it seems that £10 million will be required to pay for salary increases for FE staff in order to provide the same pay rise for them.

Now, being aware of the funding situation in the sector as it currently exists, then it’s likely that the Welsh Government would need to meet that cost, or at least some of that cost. So, can I ask, as you know that there is a dispute at the moment, as you know that the likelihood is that the Government will be asked to contribute to that additional cost should it arise, and also, as you know that the Government’s budget here is in the process of being completed, what negotiations have you had with the Cabinet Secretary for Finance to argue for further support to ensure fair salaries for those in that sector?

Well, until we’re clear about what the outcome of the discussions will be, it’s very difficult for us to decide what should be included in the budget. But, may I make it quite clear to you that we are aware of the position? The finance Secretary is aware that this might be a matter that we will need to look at. So, I do think that we need to underscore the fact, of course, that we are endeavouring to deal with these issues while we’re still trying to deal with austerity, because, of course, that has created a problem. So, it is a difficult question and it’s a difficult issue for us to take these decisions, but you must be quite clear that we are aware of the situation, as is the finance Secretary.

Thank you very much. Now, you said recently, and I’m sure that you may have anticipated that someone might raise this—but you said that there may be a need for more emphasis on lifelong learning, and that that isn’t a priority for the Welsh Government. Can you be clear with us: isn’t that your fault, because you are the Minister responsible for this area within this Government?

Thank you very much. Obviously, that was discussed at another forum, and I don’t believe that this is the place to discuss the future priorities of the Labour Party. But may I make it quite clear that it is austerity that has led to the cuts that have taken place to date, but that the current Government is completely committed to ensuring that we continue to invest in basic skills and in teaching English as a second language, and also to ensuring that we teach people digital skills? So, that commitment still stands from the Government.

Conservative spokesperson, Suzy Davies. 

Diolch yn fawr, Llywydd. Yesterday was Restart a Heart Day. I'm sure you've been anticipating this question. The health Secretary's out-of-hospital cardiac arrest plan can only go so far, and as far as I can tell from speaking to the relevant charities across Wales, there is still resistance among your officials to include emergency life-saving skills, not just cardiopulmonary resuscitation, as a mandatory part of the new Donaldson curriculum. Now, I appreciate that the Donaldson approach is about not being over-prescriptive, but there are exceptions to this already. What evidence do I need to give you to make the teaching of mandatory life-saving skills one of those exceptions?   

Thank you, Suzy. I had indeed anticipated, at some stage, you would ask this question, because of your times campaigning in this regard. As you quite rightly identify, 'Successful Futures' has challenged us to rethink our approach to the curriculum, and it makes very clear that a high degree of prescription and detail at a national level inhibits, and I would quote from Donaldson's report,

'flow and progression in children and young people’s learning'.

As such, we need to ensure that the curriculum does not provide a comprehensive, detailed list of everything that has to be taught, and there is real danger in doing that. However, these are important skills that children should have access to learning. So, you'll be aware that one of the areas of learning and experience, as outlined by Donaldson, is health and well-being, and that work is currently being taken forward by our network of pioneer schools. Officials are also working with pioneer schools and representatives from the British Heart Foundation, the British Red Cross and St John Ambulance to consider safety and the health of others in the new curriculum. And they're working together to consider how that curriculum can support and enable schools to incorporate life-saving skills as the learner needs.  

Thank you. I was anticipating your answer as well, as it happens. I expect we'll be back here before the Donaldson curriculum is finalised, because I think there is space—this is not the same as, 'Can I bring falconry on to the curriculum?', this is about life-saving skills. And there's a demand for it to be mandatory on the curriculum, as far as I can tell, so perhaps we'll return to it. 

In the meantime, I just want to go back to the questions you were answering earlier on on female school pupils' welfare. The Children's Commissioner for Wales has found that gender bullying, of course, is still a problem in our schools, and that there's a recognition now that autistic spectrum disorder amongst girls is probably recognised less frequently than its actual prevalence, partly, of course, because girls manage to learn behaviour that disguises the experiences they're actually having. Now, I personally think Paul Davies's Bill will direct both attention and resources towards this, but I'd be grateful to know what you're doing at the moment to raise awareness with staff and pupils about how girls with autistic spectrum disorder conditions may present in schools, and how to support them if they're being bullied, and perhaps on those occasions when they might be the perpetrator. Thank you. 

Thank you, Suzy. Let me be clear: there is hardly a day goes past when I am not asked to put something in the curriculum, so, believe me, there is a lot of demand for very many subjects to be a statutory element of the curriculum. I don't know if I've ever had falconry, but I have had other things of that ilk that have been suggested to me should be mandatory for all schoolchildren.

On the issue of bullying, I'm sure that many Members may have seen newspaper coverage and internet coverage of some cases just this week of a young girl. I want to make it absolutely clear: there is no place for bullying of any kind of any of our students in our schools. I expect our schools, as I said to Leanne Wood, to be safe spaces for our children and young people. We are in the process this very term of updating and refreshing our anti-bullying guidance to all schools to make it a much more useable document than perhaps we have had in the past and that will be published later on.

The Member also makes a very good point about the identification and support of children with additional learning needs—

No, no. 

—of all kinds. 

But not ALN.

ALN and children with neurodifferences who may present in school with different sets of behaviours that perhaps could be a point that a bully decides to focus on. So, our new professional learning development, both in initial teacher education and continuing professional development for staff already in the school—it partly does address the ALN, because if we can get it right for ALN children we'll be getting it right for all of our children. The benefits of greater understanding, empathy and how we can deal with difference in our classroom—regardless of the source of that difference—actually help all of our children. I'm very pleased to say the initial feedback from Estyn, who are looking at our new ALN preparations and transformation programme, have been very positive about the developments to date.

I'm grateful for that answer, actually. I'm pleased to hear that the work's being done on the bullying guidance there, which I hope will be as broad as possible and include bullying for lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender—and a whole range of other factors that we've spoken about here before.

I was grateful to the Minister for confirming my understanding that the pay rise for teachers—the Barnettisation consequential of that, which you mentioned would go to teachers in recent questions here—probably doesn't include lecturers. Can I ask you then—the finance Secretary, a couple of weeks ago in reply to my question on the draft budget, said that he was putting £15 million into your budget to go, quote, direct to schools. Now, is that new money or is it part of the £100 million he's already promised you and what is it to be spent on? 

First of all, can I just correct—? It's a technical thing, but it does need to be corrected.

That's fine. 

There is not a Barnett consequential to pay for teachers' pay rises. In England, that money has to come out of the Department for Education. These are resources that we have persuaded the Westminster Government it was their duty to provide for us, so it's not a Barnett consequential. Although that seems like a minor thing, actually, it is, in the big scheme of things, quite an important distinction to make. I can also be absolutely clear that every single penny of that money will be distributed, via the revenue support grant, to local authorities to be used for teachers' pay. None of it will be retained in the centre. The £15 million is additional to my budget; that's why you will see a plus sign next to the education main expenditure group in the finance Minister's paperwork. We will be distributing that money via individual local authorities. It will primarily be for the purpose of professional development, and I hope to make a statement to the Chamber at a later date to give full details of our new professional development package for existing staff in our schools.