1. Will the Cabinet Secretary make a statement on the future of the national broadcasting archive for Wales? 237

The Welsh Government supports the proposal to establish a national broadcasting archive at the National Library of Wales. The discussions with the library are ongoing in supporting the planning process. But we do want to ensure that any development is on firm and sustainable foundations, without impacting on any of the current duties of the national library.

Thank you for that response, Minister. But I have to say, it was a matter of disappointment for me to understand last week that you had rejected £1 million for the national library, which would attract, of course, additional money from the Heritage Lottery Fund of about £5 million, with the support of the Welsh Government, to allow the development of a national broadcasting archive for Wales. Is it possible, therefore, to have confirmation on a couple of questions that follow from that? Is there confirmation that there is a commitment of £5 million to the plan from the lottery in May 2017? Is that factually correct—£5 million towards a national project of £9 million to create a national broadcasting archive, including archives from the BBC, ITV, S4C and independent companies? There is a richness of Welsh heritage there in both languages from the twentieth century, and, of course, the emphasis of this plan is the availability and the access for the public. We’re not talking here about tapes stored in some faraway warehouse, or even being destroyed, because that is the threat now.

Now, there is supposed to be a formal request to be submitted in the week beginning 18 December to the HLF. Why have you left it so late to say ‘no’ in terms of the £1 million of capital and that strategic support? Is the Welsh Government, in principle, against establishing a national broadcasting archive for Wales? Can the Government look again at this to see how any concern you have could be worked out, so that that £5 million of HLF funding is not lost for Wales, because that’s the threat now, and that the people of Wales will have access to a real national archive? Because we are talking here about building a nation, and about the memory of a nation—that’s what an archive is. Yesterday, we heard of the importance of establishing national bodies, and there is a real need for a solution to this situation now, otherwise a very valuable archive will be lost forever. How about it, Minister?

There is no question of losing the archive. The archive is the responsibility of the BBC, and the provision for its future is one that the library has expressed an interest in. And, indeed, it is true to say that some preparatory work has been done, and there has been correspondence between myself and the library over a period of a year on this issue, trying to put in place firm foundations for this development. For example, I wasn't content that the current staff of the library would have to be redirected, possibly, to duties related to the archive, which would put at risk the position of the library, and that we had to safeguard the financial situation of the library. And to that end, the £1 million, if I can respond to the question in this way, is still on the table. And I have discussed this issue this morning, as it happens, with the Cabinet Secretary for Finance. What I wasn't happy to do was to proceed with this proposal until the library had reviewed its plan in its entirety, and given us an assurance that it was sustainable, and that it wouldn't, in any way, weaken the general provisions and broader provisions of the library.

Can I add my support to Dai Lloyd, in saying how important this project is? And I am indeed relieved that, in principle, the Welsh Government is still committed to it. I do think it's unfortunate that, at this late stage, we've not really heard some of the substance of the main concerns, and I think all the stakeholders now need to get together and make some sort of statement about how this is going to proceed. Whilst we may not lose the BBC part of the archive, other aspects are potentially more fragile—ITV, and even S4C—and also, the BBC one is going to have to be moved somewhere and is not potentially going to be available until many years in the future if we don't see the transfer to Aberystwyth fairly soon.

Clearly, this acquisition complements the work to digitise the newspapers of Wales—a remarkable achievement, and a resource for all people in Wales, and the academic and cultural communities as well. That resource now could be redoubled by the acquisition and the access that people would have to this broadcast archive. It is so important to our national understanding and to our whole concept of Wales and how we reflect on the decisions we've made and the options we have in the future. I really want to see some answers into how this is going to be sorted, because it's a bit disappointing that we're not here celebrating this wonderful project rather than seeing this major hiccup at a late stage. So, get everyone together and the stakeholders to make a clear statement to us all so that we can then scrutinise and add our support to what, undoubtedly, is a hugely important national project.

Let me make this very clear: the discussions with the national library have gone on for a year. The exchange of correspondence has been taking place since I took this position, and I certainly agree with you that this battle should have been resolved long ago, and it would have been if we had a proper response—a timely response—to our concerns at an earlier date from the library, and that is what we're still waiting for. Speaking, as I have been today and yesterday, to officials on this matter, I am very keen that there are serious discussions as to how the concerns that we have as a Government about the viability, both of the project of the national broadcasting archive and also the viability of the library, are properly resolved.

I’m not sure if I should declare an interest here, because so much of my professional career is held in the BBC archives—[Laughter.]—but I do consider your response to this topical question to have been very positive indeed—that this funding is still potentially on the table. Can you give us an assurance that that funding is available to be released now in order to also release that HLF funding in the current window, if the assurances that you’re seeking can be provided in a timely manner by the national library?

Well, there has been a discussion with the HLF and those discussions are ongoing. I’m not in a position to say whether there will be a further extension to the timetable, but I do hope that there will be, which will give us an opportunity to resolve this issue within the next month or two. That is crucial for me, but I must make it entirely clear that I was not content to see any reduction in the provision of the national library as the National Library for Wales. And it’s a question to be asked of the BBC, and I’m not entirely clear of this situation: what’s happening and who is paying for the BBC archive in England, in Northern Ireland and in Scotland? I can’t believe that Ministers within those Governments are going to provide funds for the BBC, which receives significant funds from us all as part of the licence fee, when it is possible to resolve these issues without having additional public expenditure from a restricted budget of the devolved Governments. 

Minister, on your explanation that it has taken a year and we still haven't resolved this issue, the Culture, Welsh Language and Communications Committee is going to the national library next Thursday—I wonder if you can give us a brief so that we can come back with some clear answers to these questions so that we can just get on with this; otherwise we're going to lose the lottery funding.

The lottery funding is not going to be lost, if it is possible for the lottery to provide an extension of time, but I can't myself announce anything to that effect this afternoon. I'm glad you're going to the national library and I hope that you will be able to get further answers on this matter. You're welcome to have all the correspondence here between me and the library and any further briefing from officials in my department, in addition to what the research department of the Assembly Commission will be able to give.

Thank you, Minister. The next question to be asked is for the Cabinet Secretary for Energy, Planning and Rural Affairs, and the question is to be asked by Andrew R.T. Davies.