1. Questions to the First Minister – in the Senedd at 1:38 pm on 11 December 2018.
Questions now from the party leaders. The leader of the opposition, Paul Davies.
Diolch, Llywydd.
First Minister, in your nine years in post, what do you feel you have learnt and what advice would you give to the new First Minister?
Well, you always learn. You always learn. There is never a time when you know everything, clearly. What advice would I give to my successor? I've said it before: it's hugely important to balance the job against your life, because it's important to have time to think, and working day and night every single day is not a good way and not a sustainable way of working. But it's been a great honour to have done this job for nine years, and nine years is enough.
Thank you for that response. As you know, the Welsh Government will soon become responsible for raising a proportion of its revenue via income tax, and this is the final area of policy that I would like to raise with you in this Chamber. Thanks to the UK Government, income tax rates for working people across the UK have reduced significantly since 2010. More and more people in Wales are keeping more of what they earn with the tax-free personal allowance soon to increase to £12,500. Over 1.4 million people in Wales have benefited from the increases made to the personal allowance and higher rate threshold, and 41,000 people in Wales now pay no income tax at all. Coupled with the steady increases in the national living wage, which 81,000 people in Wales have benefited from, this has undoubtedly helped strengthen Wales's labour market and economy. Do you agree with me, First Minister, that Wales's long-term economic interests are best served by households and businesses being provided with a firm guarantee that income tax rates will remain low here in Wales?
Well, he will know, of course, that the manifesto commitment that we gave as a party in 2016 was that we would not change the rates of income tax. But, of course, we have ensured that we have pushed forward with a fairer society. He mentions the fact that fewer people pay tax, but we still have poverty, we still have people using foodbanks—we have people in paid work using foodbanks. That's as a result, of course, of the ending of child tax credits as they were. We can't, as a society, surely, be happy when, in years gone by, we used to say, 'The way out of poverty is to get a job'. That's no longer the case. Because of a lack of job security that people have and the fact that people sometimes have more than one job, we can't honestly say, with our hands on our hearts, that people, if they get a job, will inevitably find themselves in a better situation. And that is a challenge, of course, for all parties in the future.
First Minister, for all the fierce exchanges across this Chamber, no-one can be in any doubt about the efforts and sacrifices that you have made in public service in Wales. Despite our political differences, we have been bound by an unshakable commitment to the people we serve and you have carried out that duty with dedication and devotion. So, on behalf of these benches and on behalf of the Welsh Conservative Party, may I wish you and your family well and wish you every success in whatever you do in the future?
Well, that's very kind. The one thing I will say—just to pull his leg—is I think that's the first time in four FMQs that he hasn't used the word 'shambles' [Laughter.]. But I do thank him very much for his words. He will know, of course, that robust debate is necessary in this Chamber. We, all of us in this Chamber have a different view of the world and it's in this Chamber that that robust debate must be carried out and the testing of ideas must be carried out. But he will also know that it is rarely the case, if ever, that that is carried on at a personal level. For me, yes, I've been here for nine years answering questions and perhaps I'll stay after that—who knows? But, I'm grateful to him for what he has said and I wish him well for the future.
The Plaid Cymru leader, Adam Price.
Thank you, Llywydd. First Minister, in the manifesto published during your leadership election campaign in 2009, ‘Time to lead’, you said quite accurately, and I quote, that we need a culture of investment not a culture of grants in terms of our economic policy. However, some days ago, you said that the economic achievement that you’re proudest of was helping to save Tata Steel in Port Talbot and bringing Aston Martin to St Athan. Is that the major new vision, the new model, that you had in mind nine years ago?
It was crucial to secure the jobs of the Tata Steel workers, and I’m extremely proud that we did that. It’s also important that you can attract investment from abroad and from the rest of the United Kingdom, and we’ve been very successful in doing that. If I understand it, the point the Member is making is what therefore are we doing for small businesses and what are we doing to promote an entrepreneurial culture in Wales. I don’t believe that you can do one without doing the other. We have the development bank that’s been established and we see more businesses being created in Wales. Of course, the greatest challenge is to ensure that those businesses that are growing don’t sell out to major companies, but that they want to grow and are able to grow into major companies. One of the weaknesses that we have in the Welsh economy is that very few major companies or organisations that exist in Wales where they have their headquarters in Wales. That is something I would like to see changing in the future.
Nine years ago, in your manifesto you also said that child poverty continues to be a plague on too many of our communities. Do you regret, therefore, that child poverty under your tenure has increased, now affecting more than one in three children in Wales? And if so, how do you justify the fact that during your tenure as First Minister you dropped your own target for reducing child poverty by the end of this decade? Where was the decade of delivery for children in Wales? Of course, the Labour Party has a new leader now, who’s also said that child poverty is going to be a priority, and that’s to be welcomed. But isn’t that characteristic, if truth be told, of Labour administrations, going back over 20 years: making major declarations of intent, taking small steps, a lack of progress being made, and for hundreds of thousands of our children and people, no hope whatsoever?
Well, first of all, I can point to what we’ve done to secure a reduction in child and family poverty, for example, and what we're doing with with childcare. It’s very important to very many families, but, of course, we’ve no control over the welfare system or the taxation system. The period of austerity has had an impact on families, of course, and we’ve seen a change in the credits available in the taxation system. It shows, of course, that we as a Labour Government can do much, but there is a limit—that is true. That’s why it’s all-important that we have a Labour Government throughout the whole of the United Kingdom to take action.
Yes, but, First Minister, it's not enough, is it, to blame Westminster for all our woes? The Equality and Human Rights Commission report, recently, on poverty in Wales pointed out that poverty rates in Wales have risen faster in Wales than across the UK, and the United Nations rapporteur on poverty pointed out the measures that are being taken by the Scottish Government that could have been taken here in Wales to provide at least some degree of protection for our people, if you had made the case for devolution.
Now, nine years ago you also said in your manifesto, setting out your leadership aspirations—you declared that a priority would be, and I quote,
'investing in a green transport strategy' and examining the
'practicality of reopening the Carmarthen-Aberystwyth line.'
Yet, during your time in office, the one transport initiative you've been most associated with is building the 14-mile M4 relief road—a proposal that I gently suggest hardly demonstrates a green approach to transport. Nor has it proved to be one where your Government has been able to take a decision. Some thought the relief road would be your last decision in office, though we know that's not now going to be the case. So, can I offer you an alternative, First Minister? The study you promised nine years ago on the Carmarthen to Aberystwyth railway line has just been published. We saw the pictures of Aberystwyth—the town of your alma mater, of course—on the programme last night. If you don't want to make a recommendation to your successor on a road, why not do it on a railway? Wouldn't that be a legacy of which you could be justly proud?
Well, of course, mischievously, there is a temptation to commit to anything in your last FMQs, but I better not do it. [Laughter.] The Carmarthen-Aberystwyth line is a project that is close to my heart, though clearly there is an immense cost. The line itself mainly was taken up in 1975, although a section of it was out of use from the 1960s onwards, and there are significant gaps in the line as well that would need to be looked at. I'd caution against saying, 'Well, roads are not the answer.' The Llandeilo bypass is one road, of course, that I know he will support, and I don't disagree with him—[Interruption.] I don't disagree with him. I know Llandeilo and I know the traffic problems there, so I understand the point, but the question—[Interruption.] The question he asks is about green transport policy. Well, of course, the south Wales metro was something that I was particularly keen to get off the ground, if that's the—well, it's the wrong phrase. But to start, it was a project that I first mentioned many years ago in Bedwas rugby club, of all places, and now, of course, we see a map ahead for the metro. We know that the traffic problems, particularly in our urban areas, can't be resolved by roads; it's just not possible. A metro solution wouldn't be right for Llandeilo, let’s be honest about that, but for many of our communities in Wales—. The reality is that there is no way of widening the roads into Cardiff. It means making sure there are more frequent services, better services, air-conditioned trains, a decent price that people have to pay for those services to encourage more people off the roads. And that is something I look forward to seeing develop over many, many years to come.
The leader of the UKIP group—Gareth Bennett.
Diolch, Llywydd. As we know, First Minister, today is your last FMQs. I think this may not be an occasion to be too controversial, and perhaps we could both be slightly more reflective today. Now, you’ve been the First Minister for nine years, you were a Minister for almost as many years before that, so you have been at the heart of the Welsh Government for almost as long as it has existed. How many marks out of 10 would you give the Welsh Government’s performance during your time in office?
Ten. [Laughter.]
Is that the answer? [Laughter.] That's an interesting answer, but I may have a different appraisal. Are there perhaps areas where you feel the Welsh Government's performance could have been better?
I think the one challenge that is left, and I’ve said this publicly, is local government. I do think that we’re not there in terms of local government. It’s a matter, of course, for the next Government to decide how to take things forward, but we know that regional working has been hugely successful, and we cannot take a back step when it comes to that. We’ve seen the results in education; the same thing must happen in planning, it must happen in social services. That perhaps is the one area I think that is still unresolved—a known major area that, to my mind, is still unresolved and a matter, of course, for the next Government.
You were featured in a BBC Wales programme last night, Being First Minister—a very interesting show—in which you said:
'What the Welsh public want to see is delivery. They're not interested in the mechanics; all the rest of it is guff. It doesn't count as far as the Welsh public are concerned.'
End of quote. What advice would you give to your successor on how to reduce 'guff', as you term it, and how to best deliver for the Welsh public?
Well, as I said in the programme, what counts for any policy or any legislation is that they will be noticed positively by people out there. Of course, the process of honing that legislation is important, but the public don't notice it. What is important is that, when we do something here, people say, 'That's made a real difference to our lives.' Now, I'm not going to go through a list as I normally do in FMQs—[Interruption.] All right. [Laughter.] But the one piece of legislation I think we can all be proud of, and I give Dai Lloyd credit for it, because it was his idea originally, is the Human Transplantation (Wales) Act 2013. There are literally people alive today as a result of that Act. I know there were concerns and misgivings amongst some Members. Not everybody was entirely comfortable with the direction that was being taken, but I think that is something that I take pride in as a First Minister, but also I think that this institution can take pride in it in terms of leading the way across the whole of the UK and in ensuring that there is hope for people where previously there was none. I don't think there's any greater thing that we can aim for, and that is something that, as I say, this Chamber can be rightly proud of.