Group 3 is the repayment of prohibited payments. The lead amendment in this group is amendment 55, and I call on Leanne Wood to move and speak to the lead amendment and other amendments in this group. Leanne.

Amendment 55 (Leanne Wood) moved.

These amendments are to ensure that the court requires repayment of a prohibited payment from the offender directly to the person to whom it was paid. We've tabled these amendments again, because we think it's important that there is no room for debate here; any unauthorised fees must be repaid. Now, these amendments were rejected at Stage 2 because the previous Minister said, and I quote, 

'there is an important principle we need to consider here, which is to preserve the independence of the court. They will make such an order if they consider it appropriate under the circumstances'.

Our legal advice tells us that that is not the case. Our legal note says, and I quote: there are numerous examples of strict liability offences in law whereby the court has no discretion over levels of punishment if a defendant is found guilty of the offence in question.

So, it was quite clear to us at Stage 2 that the previous Minister was using technical legal arguments to reject an amendment, as is usually the case, knowing that the committee had no recourse to challenge this. So, it does suggest that we need to change the rules of this institution so that when legal arguments are made, a break is taken so that those checks can take place. So, I'd much prefer a debate today on the principle behind the amendments, which is that people should not be profiting from an unauthorised payment and that everyone knows full well you will have to repay those fees in court.

In regard to these two amendments, relating to the court ordering the repayment of prohibited fees, I already have an amendment further into this Bill in group 10, amendment 44, that will achieve this at the same point that a fixed-penalty notice is paid, whoever issues that fixed-penalty notice. Under the Government's amendments in group 9, the licensing authority, Rent Smart Wales, will inherit powers to issue fixed-penalty notices, and my later amendment includes both Rent Smart Wales and local authorities in its scope, which is to demand the repayment of prohibited fees at the point that a fixed-penalty notice is issued—very clear, and it delivers for the tenant who has been unjustly charged. Plaid Cymru's amendments in this group dictate that the repayment must be demanded by the court when an offender is convicted. So, I think that my amendments achieve a similar objective in perhaps a more efficient and less restrictive way, although obviously I accept that the Member has a different view, opposite. Whilst I do sympathise with the intent, I think I achieve that more effectively.

Thank you. I call on the Minister to—.

Thank you, Deputy Presiding Officer. Amendments 55 and 57, brought by Leanne Wood, would place a duty on the criminal court, upon conviction of an offence under sections 2 and 3 of the Bill, requiring a prohibited payment, to order a landlord or agent to pay back the prohibited payment, or where there had been partial repayment, the outstanding amount, as she rightly said. Our view has not changed from Stage 2—that repayment of a prohibited payment should be a matter for the court to decide. She is right in saying that the amendment would fetter the independence and the discretion of the court, and she's also right to say that, sometimes, courts do have their independence and discretion fettered. But, in this instance, I don't think that that's an appropriate place to be, and I do object to the amendments on that basis.

I'm confident that the court, upon conviction of an offence, will be able to weigh up the relevant factors when deciding whether or not to make the order under sections 2 and 3 of the Bill, and I cannot support the amendments, which do affect the independence of the court and its ability exercise its discretion in this matter. I continue to believe that this is a matter for the court to determine. 

Thank you. I call on Leanne Wood to reply to the debate. No? The question is that amendment 55 be agreed to. Does any Member object? [Objection.] Therefore, we proceed to an electronic vote. Open the vote. Close the vote. For the amendment 11, no abstentions, 37 against. Therefore, amendment 55 is not agreed. 

Amendment 55: For: 11, Against: 37, Abstain: 0

Amendment has been rejected