The scale of the concern, as is set out in the report and in the timeline, was made properly aware when a new head of midwifery service actually reviewed the data within the service, and those concerns led to additional Welsh Government contact with the organisation and, ultimately, because I was not satisfied with the health board response, I decided to commission this independent review that has been reported today. So, from the scale of the concern being properly highlighted, by someone doing their job as they should do, escalating those concerns, we now reach a point where a Minister makes a decision—we have this report today. And it is an undeniable fact that, without that, we wouldn't have the objectivity in the report that we have today and the lid could well still be on top of these concerns that exist within this service. [Interruption.] When it comes to understanding the range of different reports, there are reports across a range of different services and then action is normally taken to resolve those. We actually found the scale of this concern—and, as I say, I've set out for you how and when I acted to ensure that the Royal College's review was undertaken.

Now, when it comes to special measures within the service area, we have a clear set of recommendations to work to for the service to improve against. We have independent oversight of whether those recommendations will actually be achieved and we are in the fortunate position where a number of families who have met with Welsh Government officials today and have received a personal apology from the chair of the health board are still willing to continue to engage in that work to improve services, and that is hugely important for us to be able to properly learn lessons and ensure that women's voices and their families are not forgotten in this, because, actually, what we need to do is enhance their voice in the future of the service. So, I think there should be some more positivity about how long the service area will remain in special measures, but I will say the service area will remain in special measures as long as it is appropriate to do so. I'm not going to set any sort of artificial deadline for special measures to end in this service area. There must be a proper and sustained improvement that is objectively highlighted and signed off, and it's worth pointing out that, in Betsi Cadwaladr, maternity services were one of the key concerns that led to special measures for the whole organisation and the service has delivered sustained improvement in maternity services and that's why they came out of special measures more than a year ago.

Now, on your point about management, I appreciate that some of what you had to say was not about the Welsh system at all, was actually a commentary on the system in England, but, of course, many managers are themselves clinicians. If you look at most of the executive team around health board tables in the country, they're registered healthcare professionals who still maintain their professional registration, but the job they undertake as leaders and managers requires a different sort of experience to being a clinician. And, of course, we do look at the relevant qualifications and experience upon appointment, and the health boards that appoint them do that as well. This is the point about our system having the boards to properly undertake the governance, the support and the challenge required to make sure the right people are appointed and in place. Part of what is difficult about this particular service is that, up to now, Cwm Taf has been a high-performing health board, living within its budgets and doing well when it comes to performance measures. But quality and safety is a non-negotiable part of the healthcare system here in Wales, and so the accountability that Members understandably call for—there will be evidence to underpin any form of accountability and the independent processes that I have set in place are not just designed to provide assurance to the public, they are designed also to make sure we understand where accountability should lie, because our objective is to change and improve the service, and that must require significant cultural change to do so. 

So, I'm not going to set out an artificial deadline for whether anyone should leave their employment; I am interested in people who are in the health service being able to do their job properly and to do their job with the public that they serve. But we have seen a change already—there's a significant change in independent members compared to the health board in 2010. Two doctors who were in the service at the time the report was written have now left the health board. Coincidentally, we also now have a new nurse director at executive level within the health board in place within this month. They're out to recruitment for a new medical director—again, that is a matter of coincidence; that was a planned retirement in any event. And there is also now, within the last two weeks, a consultant midwife within the service as well, so there is change, and significant change, within the leadership tiers of the organisation.

The challenge now is for people to do the job that they're paid for, the job they came into the health service to do, to provide the confidence and the quality that each and every family is entitled to expect. And, of course, I will not be resigning; I will be stepping up to my responsibilities as the Minister for the national health service here in Wales and seeing through the required improvements that I recognise must take place.