Part of the debate – in the Senedd at 4:42 pm on 16 July 2019.
I must say, I'm not entirely sure where to start with this statement today. In his previous contribution to the previous statement, the Minister emeritus, Alun Davies—. I'm not sure whether you're going to contribute to this statement, Alun, but you mentioned that you were looking forward to hearing some spending commitments. I'm not sure we really did hear much about any Welsh Government spending commitments in this statement, but then it did follow on from the previous statement about priorities.
The silly season has clearly started early this year. All I can say is that it's disappointing that this statement lacks the Minister's normally constructive tone with her normally positive overtones. This statement was more about UK Government bashing rather than putting forward that positive Welsh Government vision that we all in this Chamber would like to see, that public services and those working in public services across Wales would like to see, and, of course, the public would like to see. I think that this, in that regard, is an opportunity that's been missed. In fact, it wasn't until halfway through the statement—I do thank the Minister for giving me sight of the statement in advance—but it wasn't until halfway through the statement that we got on to EU structural funds, which have been so important to the Welsh economy over so many years. Indeed, it was only at the end of your speech that you did actually then touch on priorities, but only in a very general sense as you spoke about going out to stakeholders. As for,
'Our message is clear: not a penny less, not a power lost', well, it does sound a little bit like a Jeffrey Archer novel, but I would say that I do actually agree with the sentiment myself. I think many AMs here would agree that we don't want to see a penny lost, and we've made that statement over a number of months now, and years. But I think that the message was sadly lost in some of the wider UK Government bashing that occurred.
Yes, of course, we recognise that the Welsh Government faces challenges and the UK Government is far from blameless in all of this, but rather than constantly blaming the UK Government for the nine years of austerity, Minister, have you considered laying at least some of the blame at the door of the previous UK Labour Government that built up the debts far too fast and went far too far in building up those debts? And perhaps—I used to say this to the previous finance Minister—perhaps if the Welsh Government had been running things then instead of your Labour cousins in Westminster, we might have been in a slightly better position. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt. Unfortunately, you weren't, and we do now see the result of that profligacy at that time.
Turning to some of the detail that was there on the Office for Budget Responsibility's published figures for the spring statement, you said,
'if the Wales resource budget increases in line with UK resource departmental expenditure limits and NHS growth in England is matched in Wales, then the rest of the Wales budget would fall by around 1 per cent in real terms between 2019-20 and 2020-21.'
Is that a coded way of saying that Welsh Government has no intention of matching funding increases with the NHS in England? Because if that is the case—and I recognise you say, as well, it would cause reductions elsewhere in other budgets—but if that is the case, then I think we need to be upfront with the public that the NHS budget in Wales is not being protected in the way that some people think it might be, and protection, indeed, that the Welsh Conservatives argued for back in 2011, which didn't happen back then in real terms. It happened in cash terms, not in real terms, and I think that we are still playing catch-up here in Wales from the mistakes that were made back then.
On the budget timetable, I fully agree with the Minister that three-year budgets set through a comprehensive spending review are desirable, and it's a shame that the UK Government doesn't feel able to introduce them at this point. I would point out that it was this UK Government that at least aspired to do so. And as the Welsh Government knows, and we know on the Finance Committee, three-year budgets are not easy to achieve. I would ask you: are you confident that you are delivering the sort of medium-term stability that public services in Wales are crying out for, and are you hopeful to move to commit to three-year budgets?
You finally mentioned Welsh Government priorities at the end of your contribution. I wonder if you could give us some more details on that, also on your planned visits that you mentioned over the summer. It does remind me a little of the former finance Minister Jane Hutt's budget tour. Alun Davies remembers, and this emeritus remembers the budget tour of a number of years ago, where she went out and visited stakeholders in different corners of Wales—a very comprehensive tour, actually. I remember her coming to my—I think she went everywhere, actually, but Jane Hutt, as you know, is very diligent in that respect. Is it your intention to re-invoke the spirit of that tour? Which stakeholders do you intend to meet with? Will it be, to coin a phrase, 'the usual suspects' or are you actually intending to go out and maybe take some evidence from stakeholders who aren't normally engaged with, so that we would see over the months ahead something that I think all AMs here would like to see, which is a budget that genuinely reflects not just the interests of Assembly Members here, but the interests of the people of Wales and is beneficial, indeed, to the future economy of Wales?