Llywydd, I thank Rhun ap Iorwerth very much for those questions. I agree with what he said at the start of his contribution. We are at the beginning of a journey here, and it will take time to travel the whole path, and in order to do that it is important to have cross-party working. I welcome many of the things that Paul Davies said—the constructive things that he said—about a number of things in the report. He is interested in seeing how these recommendations may be implemented, and we must also work not just internally within the Assembly, but with people outwith the Assembly in Wales, and also with people in Westminster.

I also agree with what Rhun ap Iorwerth said about the practical recommendations in the report. For a number of people here, it is a matter of principle to have the justice system in the hands of the people here in the Assembly. But, in the report, they just make a more pragmatic case. It just shows the impact that the current system has on people's everyday lives here in Wales.

To turn to the questions as regards the civil service, well, we said 200 people because there are 300 people in the Scottish Executive working on those things that the report wishes to transfer to us in Wales. Well, Lord Thomas says 10 staff members—10 people to do everything contained within this report. I agree with him and with Rhun as well that we don't just have to emulate others or do things in the way that we've always done them, and we have to work with universities and draw more people in to co-operate with us, and I am totally open to doing it in that fashion, but if we are going to run the whole system—the courts, the probation service, youth justice, the profession, everything that's contained within this report—then it's difficult for me at present to see how 10 additional people could cope with that. But it's something for us to discuss on the journey, as Rhun mentioned.

Llywydd, I have attempted to do many things for a long time and failed. I'm sure that he has campaigned for independence for a long time, and he's failed to persuade people of that as yet. He's continuing to try to persuade people, as am I, and the report is a great help for us just as an evidence base from a group of totally independent people who have brought these conclusions forward.