Questions now from the party spokespeople. The Plaid Cymru spokesperson, Rhun ap Iorwerth.

Diolch yn fawr iawn, Llywydd. One of the last things that Alun Cairns did as Secretary of State for Wales—or the Secretary of State for the west of England, as he had become to be known by many—was to establish the western gateway. Where is the western gateway a gateway to, and for whom?

Well can I first say that, obviously, Alun Cairns has resigned in the last couple of hours, and I think that was the right thing to do in the circumstances? Clearly, our Government and his Government have had significant differences over a number of issues. But I should say that both Ken Skates and myself have had cordial and professional relationships with Alun Cairns, and, especially on the city deals, we've worked well together, and we certainly wouldn't have wished his time as a Minister to come to an end in this way.

On the question directly posed, it's most unfortunate that the Severnside collaboration has been called 'west Britain' in some of its social media activity. Certainly, that's not designed to get it off to a good start. We are keen, obviously, to look at a forum that can collaborate across the border, just as we do in north Wales with the Mersey Dee Alliance. However, we are sceptical about the intentions behind the setting up of this alliance and giving it, certainly, any institutional character because we fear the UK Government are using this as a Trojan horse to undermine the Welsh Government through whatever comes of the shared prosperity fund. We look forward to seeing if anything comes of the shared prosperity fund. But we are approaching it, I think, with scepticism. The chair that's been appointed, Katherine Bennett, is a very good person and we certainly wouldn't wish to undermine her in any way. This is not a joint appointment, but we certainly would like a conversation with her about how she feels this alliance goes forward, with our concerns in mind. 

Well, Welsh Government, of course, is hailed as a partner in the western gateway project. Within minutes of the launching of the project, the chair that you mentioned referred to 'the powerhouse of the west of Britain'. How do you think that rebranding of Wales as the west of Britain or a part of the west of Britain helps with the work that needs to be done to build a genuine Welsh economy that can then work in genuine partnership with our friends to the east? 

Well, I happened to speak to Katherine Bennett on the morning that tweet went out and she made clear to me that those were not her words. I suspect the hyperactive office of the aforementioned previous Secretary of State may have had a hand in that, but, I think, putting that to one side, there remains an economic geography there that we want to explore and exploit, but we are a devolved Government, we have a boundary to respect, and we certainly are not going to be naive about the political agendas at play in Westminster around this, but we do want what's best for the people of that part of Wales and our closest neighbours.

'We remain sceptical', I don't think is good enough when it comes to some of the messaging that I have certainly heard and read around the western gateway project. What we want to see is a Welsh Government that genuinely builds a Welsh economy, and I fear that Welsh Government has been taken for a ride by the Wales Office under Alun Cairns. The Welsh Government has been far too keen, I think, to hang on to the coat-tails of Alun Cairns as Secretary of State for Wales. We know that Welsh Government agreed on the nod to the renaming of the second Severn crossing as the Prince of Wales Bridge, which we know went down like a lead balloon with people in Wales. We know that Welsh Government did have an opportunity to have its say on that issue and decided, for whatever reason, not to, and I fear that when it comes to the western gateway, as well as projects across the border between the north-east of Wales and the north-west of England, that Welsh Government isn't taking its role seriously enough in creating a genuinely strong Welsh economy.

I am a big supporter of cross-border working. Cross-border working works to the mutual benefit of neighbouring countries and regions globally. That is no different for us in Wales. But will the Minister see that as long as we have an impression of a Welsh Government that is going with a begging bowl to those partnership meetings, that doesn't seem to want to be there as a genuine partner, Wales will be undersold by this Welsh Government?

Well, I think that's a little overexcited. I think I would struggle with—[Interruption.]

I'd like you to get a bit more excited about making use of the Welsh economy. Get excited about—

And I think I would struggle—. I would struggle—[Interruption.] With respect, you've asked your question. Your question is finished. I'm trying to answer it, if you will allow me to.

Well, no, there was a snide remark. That's what I heard first. 

Well, with respect—

Allow the Minister to carry on with answering your question.

Rhun ap Iorwerth is offended I made a snide remark. He's accused us of having a begging-bowl attitude, so that's pretty snide, I would say, in respect, to that. 

And in terms of Alun Cairns' coat-tails, I'd struggle to reach them, with respect. So, there's no subservient attitude here and I think it doesn't help a calm discussion about how we can advance the economic interests of south Wales to dress it up in such hysterical language.

As I've made clear, the term of 'west Britain' was certainly not ours and it wasn't, indeed, even the chair's, and I certainly would not—and I was clear in my earlier answer—endorse that. As I've said, we're not naive about the political agendas here at play. This was not a joint appointment. This is not something we are jointly setting up. The UK Government have taken this initiative. We'll watch it with interest. If it is a forum for sharing information, we'd be happy to be part of it. If it's any more than that, we will not.

Conservative spokesperson, Russell George.

Diolch, Llywydd. Deputy Minister, has the timetable for the South East Wales Transport Commission slipped?

Not to my knowledge.

Thank you. That's good to hear. In June of this year, Deputy Minister, your boss, the Minister, said to this Chamber that transport is an area where the Welsh Government has ambitious plans for the future. He said he expected an interim report for the South East Wales Transport Commission within six months. The Minister also said, and I'm quoting here:

'I've been very keen and clear in saying to the chair and to the public that if the commission is able to bring forward viable suggestions that can be delivered' in the short term, within the next six-month period, to ease congestion on the M4, they should be done so without delay.

Since these statements back in June, can I ask a couple of questions? Can I ask why it has taken until October to establish the membership of the commission? And can I also ask: can you confirm that, by the end of this year, we will have the interim report, or will it just be an update? And can I ask, what appears to be kicking into the long grass—can you tell me if this interim report has been kicked into the long grass, or do you still anticipate the report to be delivered by the end of this year?

Both the First Minister and the economy Minister made it very clear to the chair of the commission that we expect to have early recommendations by Christmas, and that remains our expectation.

There has been some time taken to assemble a very high calibre panel of people. They've published their terms of reference and their way of working. I'm very encouraged that they are not going to be constrained, in the way that previous studies have, to simply look at road options, but will look at the full array of interventions, including behaviour change, to tackle the congestion and the car dependency in that part of Wales, and not simply the traditional approaches that have dominated this debate for many years.

So, I fully expect an exciting range of proposals, with some initial thoughts by the end of this year.

Thank you, Minister. You'll also be aware that the volume of traffic on the M4 is increasing day by day. We've had a new poll, which shows that almost twice as many people in Wales now believe that the M4 relief road should be built, contradicting the view of the First Minister and the Welsh Government. But can you confirm whether or not the option of building the M4 relief road is, or isn't, within the scope of the South East Wales Transport Commission's terms of reference? And, if so, and they recommend to you to go ahead and build it, will you do that or will you reject the findings of this independent commission?

No. Having gone through a public inquiry that looked at the black route, there'd be absolutely no point in setting up another inquiry to go and re-examine the exact same option. So, that is not an option that the commission is looking at. They're looking at alternatives, which we believe can be delivered quicker and cheaper to better effect than the road that was previously examined.

Russell George mentions a poll that was published yesterday, which—. Well, I'd say two things about that: first of all, the First Minister made his decision not because it was popular but because it was the right thing to do, because the inspector's report did not take proper recognition of the climate emergency nor the collapse in biodiversity. That was a principled decision the Government took, not one chasing popular headlines. And the poll, really, isn't worth a great deal, when you think about the way it was framed. Had the question been framed to say to people, 'Would you be willing for your hospital and your school to be cancelled for a project that's more than doubled in budget?', it might have produced a different result.

Brexit Party spokesperson, David Rowlands.

Diolch, Llywydd. Deputy Minister, the proposal to make Newport the focus for economic growth has been welcomed by all in South Wales East, and we congratulate the Welsh Government on its announcement. However, I understand there has been criticism of this move by Cardiff city council, who argue that this would take jobs and investment out of Wales and undermine Cardiff's role as the economic driver of the Welsh economy.

Does the Minister not agree with me that their argument goes against the regional development plan and the setting up of strategic development plans that actually encompass the Cardiff capital region?

Well, those are probably comments best directed to the leader of Cardiff council. The national development framework is out to consultation, and we look forward to considering all representations as part of that.

Well, I thank the Deputy Minister for that brief answer, but, Deputy Minister, the draft national framework encompasses local development plans, strategic development plans, developments of national significance, which all sit alongside 'Planning Policy Wales', and all supposedly based on a regional structure. Given this desire to move to regional centres of governance, could the Welsh Government give consideration to having just five regional centres of governance, perhaps based on the Welsh Assembly electoral regions, rather than the somewhat haphazard mix of local authorities-based economic regions that now exist or are proposed? These larger regions would have larger budgets, which would better facilitate strategic planning, particularly for infrastructure projects, thus underpinning the Government's strategic development plan for Wales.

If I've understood the Member's point correctly, the regions that exist are based, certainly in the south-east, on the Cardiff capital region, which is a city region that's now been in development for some years and has the buy-in of the local authorities. You can certainly make arguments about where the line should be drawn between the mid Wales region and the Swansea bay city region, but you can always have these judgments about which bit should be in which and so on. We are willing to keep an open mind. If there's support within the local authorities for recalibrating those, we'd look at it, of course. But we have a small capacity at play here between the local authorities and the Welsh Government, and we need to pick an optimum number where we can get some gravity together to be able to marshal our resources properly to great effect, and the more we chop them around, the more difficult it becomes to get the results we're looking for.