3. Will the First Minister make a statement on the number of people with autism who are studying in higher education in Wales? OAQ54803

I thank the Member for that question, Llywydd. There were 800 higher education students in Wales recorded in 2017-18 as having a self-declared social or communication impairment, such as Asperger's syndrome or other autistic spectrum disorders.

First Minister, you may remember the unfortunate case last year at Swansea University, where a student was allegedly suspended from her university course on health grounds. Now, I'm very pleased to see that Swansea University and Gower College Swansea have teamed up in a year-long project to support students with autism spectrum conditions as they prepare to make the transition from college to university. I think that's a very, very important transition, for, in addition to the usual concerns that any student will have about which course to enrol in and where to study, autistic students typically need to take into account other factors, such as the environment, social opportunities and special education needs support of any particular university and, indeed, a particular course at a university.

According to the National Autistic Society, education, health and care planning is key, and this is done at schools and colleges increasingly, I'm pleased to say. But it's not being taken forward into higher education. Do you agree with me that it's high time that we set the standard in Wales and insist that our universities have these plans, so that students with autistic spectrum disorders are properly supported?

I thank David Melding for those important points. I entirely agree with him about the importance of transition and that young people who are already getting help in one part of the system—that the next move that they will make within the education ladder, the work that has been invested with them in one place, is properly translated to the next place that they intend to go, so that that transition is as smooth as it possibly can be.

The Higher Education Funding Council for Wales published its position statement on well-being and health in June of this year. It has a series of actions that it proposes from the position statement that it will work on, together with NUS in Wales—the National Union of Students—to make sure that young people with autism who are studying in higher education have all of the help that they need.

I recall the Swansea incident to which David Melding refers. Within the last two weeks, I met a young woman who is studying at Swansea University today who was very positive indeed about the help that she was receiving to make sure that her autistic condition was recognised and understood. She was getting some help through the disabled student support allowance that we have here in Wales—3,400 Welsh students benefiting from that £8 million fund. But the money was a small part of what she felt she was getting. It was the understanding that she was experiencing from the university, from her tutors and others, that she felt was supporting her to make the very best of her abilities and to get everything she wanted out of her higher education experience. Better transition planning, making sure that the things that David Melding referred to are done, would be of help in any young person's experience.

Prior to this question today, I spoke to a number of people with autism. They were telling me that they're often drawn to higher education, and some of them are often overqualified because they feel safety in having that academic background, and safety in learning, as opposed to facing a job market where, potentially, they are stigmatised, and they find that job application processes don't fit with their needs.

The Office for National Statistics has recently said that there is a 12 per cent pay difference between disabled people and their non-disabled peers. So, we can talk about higher education and getting those with autism into the system, which is all well and good, but what is the Welsh Government doing to support them when they're going out into the real world, when they want to compete for jobs on a level playing field in a way that is equal to them and that respects them also?

Llywydd, I think that it's a bit more than just 'all well and good'. I think that the conversations you report are very interesting because they do reflect what I've heard from young people as well. If you have a condition that involves autism, then the period that you spend in higher education is valuable for the qualification that you might get, but it is also a really important part of your sense of being able to equip yourself to deal with the world beyond education. So, I entirely agree with what Bethan Jenkins has said about the need to make sure that the world of work is also one that understands the needs of people with autism, and that is equipped to be able to respond in a way that allows those people to make the contribution that they want to make. And there's a great deal of work that we have done, over a number of years now, to deal with mental health issues in the workplace, and with stigma that people face. But a period spent in higher education by a young person who is experiencing autism is a genuine investment, both in their own sense of qualification but also in their own sense of an ability to be able to face the world in the way that Bethan Jenkins reported people she has spoken to saying, and to be able to do that in a way that they feel confident that they will be able to deal with.