2. Business Statement and Announcement

– in the Senedd at 2:29 pm on 14 January 2020.

Alert me about debates like this

Photo of Ann Jones Ann Jones Labour 2:29, 14 January 2020

Item 2 on the agenda this afternoon is the business statement and announcement, and I call on the Minister for Finance and Trefnydd, Rebecca Evans.

Photo of Rebecca Evans Rebecca Evans Labour

There's one change to this week's business. As no amendments have been tabled, the time allocated to the Stage 3 debate on the National Health Service (Indemnities) (Wales) Bill has been reduced. Draft business for the next three weeks is set out on the business statement and announcement, which can be found amongst the meeting papers available to Members electronically.

Photo of Darren Millar Darren Millar Conservative 2:30, 14 January 2020

Can I call for two statements today, if I may, from the Welsh Government? The first is a statement request from the Minister for Health and Social Services in relation to his proposals for a new citizens' voice body for Wales. As the business manager will know, as the Trefnydd will know indeed, the Government's intention is that community health councils will be replaced with a single citizens' voice body to act as a patient watchdog in Wales, and it seems that that policy will be fully implemented by the Government. One of the things that I would like to see, if there is going to be a body like that, is for it to be located in another part of Wales, outside of Cardiff. And can I put a bid in for my own constituency, with it being centrally located along the north Wales coast, easily accessible along the A55 corridor, as a potentially suitable location? I think that it is important that, where possible, jobs should be away from this capital city, given the number of jobs that are already here in terms of Welsh Government and public sector jobs, and I do think that placing such a new body in north Wales would go a long way to recognising the importance of that region for the Welsh Government.

Can I also call for a statement from the Minister for Housing and Local Government in relation to any support that the Welsh Government may have offered to the Australian fire services as a result of the bush fires down there? We've all seen the devastating scenes of homes being destroyed, properties being destroyed, businesses being destroyed, and indeed the huge destruction of wildlife in Australia in recent weeks, and I'm sure that all of our hearts would want to go out to every one of those affected. But we've seen, of course, brave firefighters, unfortunately, struggling to cope with the challenge that's presented to them, and some, of course, have lost their lives.

I've been contacted by a number of members of staff who are firefighters for the North Wales Fire and Rescue Service, who, compassionately, want to go out and assist in a practical way. Having discussed this with them, it would appear that the response of the North Wales Fire and Rescue Service is that they don't have the resources to enable them to be released in that way. I do think that, given the links between Wales and Australia, it would be an opportunity, really, to strengthen those links and stand shoulder to shoulder with the fire service down there if Wales were able to resource a number of firefighters from each of the fire services to go and assist in that effort. And I would therefore call for a statement on whether this might be possible from the Minister for Housing and Local Government. 

Photo of Rebecca Evans Rebecca Evans Labour 2:33, 14 January 2020

I thank Darren Millar for raising those issues. On the first, which relates to the future of the patient voice in Wales for health and social services, he made a keen bid for his own constituency. I know that the Minister for Health and Social Services will be keeping the Senedd updated on this particular issue, of course. But, more widely, I can say that the Welsh Government has published, quite recently, our own location strategy, because we understand that we need to demonstrate leadership in this area in terms of ensuring that our employment footprint does stretch across Wales and that we do so in a way that promotes our efforts for decarbonisation and our 'town centre first' policy and so forth. So, I'd suggest the Member has a look at that strategy, just for the general interest that he has in that approach. 

On the issue of the Australian fires, obviously, we also send our sympathies to everybody who's been affected. It's clearly quite devastating for the country. I think that you've tabled a written question, or I've certainly seen a written question, on exactly this subject to the Minister for International Relations and the Welsh Language, and I'll be sure that you also receive that response, and, obviously, she's been here to hear that particular query regarding the fire service. 

(Translated)

The Llywydd (Elin Jones) took the Chair.

Photo of Leanne Wood Leanne Wood Plaid Cymru 2:34, 14 January 2020

I want to raise a matter that's been brought to my attention by people working in the disability support sector—that your Government is no longer funding the Wales Learning Disability Helpline. The helpline was established more than 20 years ago in the very early days of devolution, and it's supported more than 50,000 people in that time, and it's a crucial lifeline to the estimated 64,000 people in Wales with a learning disability. Last year alone, more than 2,000 people were supported through the service. Now, I've been told that the service costs around £150,000 a year to run and, up until now, it's been run by Mencap. I think that represents excellent value for money, given that it handles complex cases, such as helping parents to formally challenge decisions about support hours, helping distraught families through inquests and providing advice on accessing specialist education provision. So, on behalf of the people who rely upon this service, I would like an explanation for the withdrawal of that funding for the service, and I'd also like to know what, if anything, is scheduled to replace it after 1 April.

I want to raise the Welsh Government's support for the principle of providing paid leave for survivors of domestic abuse. I welcome the statement made by the Minister that it should happen and she called upon local councils to introduce it. But what I would like to know is when are you going to be introducing it for your own employees? So, an early statement on that matter would be welcome. 

And, then, finally, Minister, will you join me in saying llongyfarchiadau to Dafydd Iwan and all of the campaigners who have worked tirelessly over the weekend to get the 1983 classic 'Yma o Hyd' to the No. 1 slot in the UK iTunes chart? We did it. It got to No. 1—the first time a song in the medium of Welsh has ever made it to a UK No. 1. So, I'm sure that you will want to celebrate with us, on behalf of the Welsh Government. We may be in dark political times at the moment, but I think it's worth us all remembering:

Photo of Leanne Wood Leanne Wood Plaid Cymru 2:36, 14 January 2020

(Translated)

In spite of everyone and everything, we're still here.

Photo of Rebecca Evans Rebecca Evans Labour

I thank Leanne Wood for raising both of these—all three of these—issues in the Chamber this afternoon. On the first, I will certainly ask the Minister with responsibility for equalities to provide an update as to the situation regarding the disability support helpline, because I don't have that information in front of me today.FootnoteLink 

But she has also indicated that she would be keen to provide an update or a statement on the Welsh Government's approach to the issue of paid leave for survivors of domestic abuse, because I know this is something that we have indicated a keenness to make some progress on within Welsh Government. Again, it's about us demonstrating leadership in this area. So, a statement from the Minister will be forthcoming on that.FootnoteLink 

And, of course, celebrating the first Welsh language song to make it to No. 1 in the iTunes chart—I think that raised lots of eyebrows over the weekend, but it's certainly an opportunity to promote Wales and to promote our wonderful language. 

Photo of David Rowlands David Rowlands UKIP 2:38, 14 January 2020

Minister, can we have a statement from the Minister for Education on the parlous state of a number of schools in the South Wales East region? We understand that there are five schools in special measures, three in need of significant improvement, and five where progress is under review following Estyn inspections.

Could we also have a statement from the First Minister on the announcement by the chief executive of Airbus—forgive me if I don't get his name right—Guillaume Faury, that the production of wings in the UK was guaranteed to continue? And he further promised that Airbus was working with the new Government on an ambitious industrial strategy in the UK. This, of course, seems to fly in the face of prophecies of doom and gloom often heard in this Chamber.

Photo of Rebecca Evans Rebecca Evans Labour

On the first issue, regarding schools and your concern about particular individual schools within the region that you represent, I would encourage you to write to the education Minister and potentially the local authority raising the concerns you have regarding those specific schools. 

And, on the second, of course Welsh Government wants Airbus to be a great success. We've invested over the years greatly in Airbus and its workforce and we're very keen to continue to do so into the future. 

Photo of Jenny Rathbone Jenny Rathbone Labour 2:39, 14 January 2020

I'd like to raise two issues, Trefnydd. One is looking at the ways of tackling the disastrous air pollution that certainly my constituency suffers from. One of the ways we can do that is by accelerating the switch to clean cars. And we know that a shortage of charging or refuelling points make people nervous about switching to electric or hydrogen vehicles, but we know that 10 new electric charging points are being installed every day across the UK. Nevertheless, one Cardiff car dealer told me there were no hydrogen refuelling points in Wales, and the nearest one was in Swindon, when I know that that is simply inaccurate. If we have that difficulty amongst people who are supposed to be advising people on what the best buy is, I feel we need to rectify that. For example, I'm aware that we are in the vanguard on hydrogen from renewables, due to research done at the University of South Wales, and they've installed a charging point for hydrogen at Baglan. At least one company based in Llandrindod that is pioneering hydrogen vehicles has installed another one in Abergavenny. So, I wondered if we could have a statement from the Welsh Government as to how Wales is not being left behind in this revolution and how we're ensuring that we are continuing to grow a Welsh network of both electric and hydrogen vehicle refuelling/recharging points in order to build on the expertise we already have in Wales on the technologies of the future.

Secondly, I was disturbed to read yesterday that counter-terrorism police are classifying Extinction Rebellion as an extremist organisation, putting it on a par with far-right or religious extremists. So, can the Welsh Government confirm that it will instruct schools not to refer young people who are concerned about the climate emergency to the discredited Prevent programme as if they were a security risk, because I think this is absolutely the opposite to what we should be encouraging young people to do?

Photo of Rebecca Evans Rebecca Evans Labour 2:41, 14 January 2020

I thank Jenny Rathbone for raising both of those issues. On the first, obviously, Welsh Government is investing additional funding through our most recently published draft budget, which looks to support and increase the use of electric vehicles here in Wales. But, alongside this, we're also preparing for hydrogen opportunities that we expect to come forward over the next five to 10 years. Stakeholder activities include the development of the south Wales industrial cluster, National Grid and their zero 2050 innovation project, the development of activities at the Baglan energy park, to which Jenny Rathbone referred—and that's part of the south-west Wales growth deal—together with the detailed design of hybrid hydrogen solutions in Pembrokeshire. Alongside this, consultancy support is being provided to the North Wales Economic Ambition Board to help assess the hydrogen opportunities for north Wales as part of the growth deal development of programmes and projects covering both heat, power and transport. We're also working with Monmouthshire County Council and the Gwent local authorities to facilitate research on the potential opportunities to maximise the Riversimple hydrogen trials that are currently taking place in Monmouthshire as well. So, there's a good body of work being undertaken in this area to ensure that we are in the right place to be able to maximise our response to the opportunities there.

On the issue of Extinction Rebellion, the Wales extremism and counter-terrorism unit inform us that Prevent policing do not classify Extinction Rebellion as an extremist group or ideology. Clearly, it's not a proscribed organisation, and, consequently, association with it or membership of it is clearly no kind of criminal offence, and I've seen suggested in the media that it might be. We really do welcome the fact that young people are speaking out against climate change, and we want all of our children and young people to become ethical, informed members of our society, because those are the principles that are very much guiding our new curriculum as well.

But, in terms of Welsh Government's relationship with Extinction Rebellion, I know the Minister with responsibility for energy, environment and rural affairs particularly meets with them, and we have ongoing discussion with the organisation. We find those discussions very, very informative and useful.

Photo of Mohammad Asghar Mohammad Asghar Conservative 2:44, 14 January 2020

Minister, I would like to have two statements, one from the Minister for Environment, Energy and Rural Affairs about Welsh Government policy toward energy generation by biomass incinerators. Campaigners in Barry have called for an immediate stop or halt to work on the biomass incinerator there, and I'm advised another incinerator is being talked about on the Wentloog levels near Newport, which is causing local concern. May we have a statement from the Minister on what Welsh Government policy is toward biomass incinerators and whether she has any plans to impose a moratorium on approvals of such developments in Wales in future?

The second statement I would like to ask for is from the Minister for economy. Liberty Steel in Newport is shedding 72 jobs, and an announcement by Tata Steel on the Orb plant, again in Newport, could cut off another 380 jobs. Given the challenging conditions the steel industry's facing in Wales, what emergency or contingency business plans are available there to help not only the families but also the experienced workers in this industry in our country?

Photo of Rebecca Evans Rebecca Evans Labour 2:45, 14 January 2020

On the first issue, which relates to Welsh Government policy on incineration, Mike Hedges raised a similar issue within the Chamber in recent weeks, and I know that the Minister's provided him with a comprehensive background on Welsh Government policy in this area, and I know that she'd be keen to share the same with you. We are currently considering the report from WSP on the adequacy of the environment statement prior to public consultation in terms of the Barry biomass incinerator. So, that's the very latest position with regard to that.

And of course, we were very, very concerned to hear about the potential job losses in the areas you described. I know that there was a statement from the Minister Ken Skates on the Liberty Steel Newport announcement, and that statement was in the past few days. Again, I understand that he was answering some questions relating to the steel industry more widely, including Orb, within the Chamber recently as well. But he is very keen to ensure that Members have the latest updates, and when there is more to say, he will certainly share that with Members.

Photo of Bethan Sayed Bethan Sayed Plaid Cymru 2:46, 14 January 2020

I'm aware we've had many statements on steel in this Chamber, and I'm grateful for that, but over the weekend I was reliably informed that one particular contractor in Port Talbot has laid off 16 members of staff already. Basically, they were told by Tata that they would get the invoice for the goods that they bought to do a job but that they won't be carrying forth with that particular operation; that's as much detail as I can go into. But I would like for a statement to be given by the Welsh Government specifically on contractors, because it seems that they're the first to go. Many of them are employed by agencies and don't have the same rights as the formal Tata workers in Port Talbot. So, I would like to hear what the Welsh Government are doing specifically on the contractors, because this may be one company, but what will happen then with other contracting companies in the town? It will have a knock-on effect on jobs and prosperity.

The second issue that I wanted to raise with you: you have kindly written to the Office for National Statistics with regard to the census. Clearly, those like the singer Kizzy Crawford who are campaigning because there's no option on the census for a black Welsh definition option, only black British, say they want a specific option on the census—for those who haven't been following it—for Welsh and black. Now, my colleagues Leanne Wood and Liz Saville Roberts have written to the ONS and they've had a response back saying that you can complete a write-in option to define yourself as black Welsh, which I don't think is sufficient enough and doesn't go far enough. They've told Leanne Wood and Liz Saville Roberts in a letter that they've done a significant amount of surveying and questioning in Wales, which I'm totally unaware of, because otherwise I don't think we'd have this outrage. What more can you do to pressurise the ONS not to put forward this Bill to Parliament in 2020 before they consult further on those questions and options? Because I feel that the BME community here in Wales is being let down.

Photo of Rebecca Evans Rebecca Evans Labour 2:49, 14 January 2020

Again, I'm grateful for these issues being raised again this afternoon. I know, on the issue of steel, the Minister will be meting with Dr Henrik Adam, CEO of Tata Steel Europe, in the coming weeks in relation to Tata particularly. However, the points are well made about the contractors, and obviously the full supply chain that is dependent very much on Tata. So, I'll be sure to make the Minister aware of the request for the statement, and also the information more widely on those particular angles that you've identified.

On the second issue, I had the opportunity to meet the national deputy chief statistician just last week to discuss this particular issue, about how the current census isn't as inclusive as we would wish it to be, and I do hope that we are going to be able to come to a satisfactory and positive conclusion on this issue. Obviously, I'm keen to keep Members up to date on that. The ONS is currently undertaking some focus groups in different parts of Wales to look at what might be done to improve this issue, but I think that they've engaged very well with this in recent times on this particular issue, and there is a genuine will and keenness to make an improvement.

Photo of Lynne Neagle Lynne Neagle Labour 2:50, 14 January 2020

I would like to ask for a statement from the Minister for Health and Social Services on the sustainable social services grant, please. I'd also associate myself with the remarks made earlier by Leanne Wood; the learning disability helpline was funded by the sustainable social services grant. I've also received representations from the Wales Council of the Blind, who've had their funding cut under that programme, and, as committee Chair, by Adoption UK, who have also had their funding cut. It is also my understanding that Disability Wales and Wales Council for Deaf People have lost funding under this programme. Now, this to me very much plays to the concerns I have anyway about third-sector funding in Wales, which is anything but sustainable. We see organisations that health boards and local authorities are very happy to refer to who really, really struggle to get core funding, and therefore depend on the funding under the sustainable social services grant. So, I too would like to have an explanation as to what's happened here, and a general statement about the fund from the Deputy Minister. Thank you.

Photo of Rebecca Evans Rebecca Evans Labour 2:51, 14 January 2020

Well, I know that the overall amount of funding that the health Minister has put into the sustainable social services grant has been increased for the next financial year, but I also know that he and, I believe, the Deputy Minister are both attending health committee tomorrow for scrutiny. So, I think that this would be a good opportunity to get into some of that detail with them.

Photo of Russell George Russell George Conservative 2:52, 14 January 2020

Trefnydd, in the past, it's always been courteous, when a Minister visits a Member's constituency, that a notification is sent out in advance. Over recent times, I've noticed that those visit notifications do tend to be more and more last minute, often with an apology for those notifications being last minute. But I would point out that I've been aware that many of those visits have been confirmed many weeks in advance. Yesterday, a Minister visited my own constituency and I had no notification at all, although I'm aware that other AMs in that region did have a notification of that particular event. So, can I ask, Trefnydd, if you agree with me that notifications should continue, that you discuss this with your Cabinet colleagues, so that notifications are issued in a timely manner, and indeed to all AMs rather then just particular AMs?

Photo of Rebecca Evans Rebecca Evans Labour 2:53, 14 January 2020

Yes, I apologise to Russell George if he wasn't notified of a ministerial engagement within his constituency. Perhaps if he lets me have the details I will look into that, but I will certainly undertake to discuss with all private officers to ensure that we are informing all Members of those areas of visits that are undertaken in their patch. And again, apologies to Russell George.

Photo of Helen Mary Jones Helen Mary Jones Plaid Cymru

May I ask the Trefnydd if she can arrange for the appropriate Minister to make a statement about the implementation of the Public Service Vehicles Accessibility Regulations 2000? Of course, we would all very much welcome public buses becoming more accessible for disabled people, and it is of course true to say that companies have known for some time that these regulations are coming in. However, in my region, this is having an effect on children in the Tumble and Drefach areas because the spare capacity that was available on local authority buses that parents were able to buy into has been reduced because private companies have opted out of providing the service rather than adapt their buses suitably.

It seems likely to me that this is impacting in other parts of Wales, and I would like to have an opportunity to ask a Welsh Minister what can be done about this, because I'm sure this is one of those unintended consequences. I think it's true to say that the private contractors can't say that they weren't given notice, but if this does lead to a situation where children are having to walk, and sometimes having to walk quite long distances, that may have implications for Welsh Government policy going forward.

It may be that we need to reconsider the current law, which only commits us to—I think it's two miles for primary school children and three miles—. Two miles for a primary school child, when you think that primary school children are now as young as three years old—whereas they would have been almost six when these regulations first came in. I think there are implications. I would be interested to know if there are implications in other parts of my region. The concerns have come to me from Carmarthenshire, but obviously this has a bigger implication for rural areas, potentially, than for urban ones. So, if the Minister was able to make a statement so that we could discuss this further, we'd be very grateful.

Photo of Rebecca Evans Rebecca Evans Labour 2:55, 14 January 2020

The Minister with responsibility for economy and transport has this area within his portfolio, and I will make him aware of the discussion that we've had and the particular concerns you've described in your area and make him aware of that request for the statement, because the points you raise are important points.

Photo of Mark Isherwood Mark Isherwood Conservative

Can I call for a single statement on resources in Betsi Cadwaladr University Health Board? I receive many e-mails from constituents, whether that's patients, family members or staff, who, based on their own experience, wish to share suggestions for how services might be improved in the health board. I'll only quote one of those, received this month:

'Just before Christmas, my husband became ill with a serious chest infection which became pneumonia. He had a total of three admissions to the emergency department. On the third occasion, he was eventually admitted to the high-dependency unit where he received excellent care. However, the fact is on three occasions he was, in my opinion as a registered nurse, not well triaged. The matron of the unit was working extremely hard to move patients through the department and she was introducing herself to patients, however she did not seem to be getting a lot of support from junior staff. She apologised for the state of the department, which was obviously desperately overstretched. I hope that she is given the time and the resources to sort this department out. Please can you do something to help her by asking the Welsh Government to urgently put more resources into Glan Clwyd? Not just by throwing money at the problem, but by ensuring that the money available is spent on opening beds in the main hospital and also in the community hospitals, so that people are not occupying beds in the acute sector when they really need community hospital care. I'm thankful to the staff and consultants in the high-dependency unit for the fact that my husband is still alive, but I fear that he's lucky to be so after what he's been through in the emergency department. I hope that this e-mail is taken note of for the sake of all of us who live in Flintshire, Denbighshire and Conwy.'

I call for a statement in that context, not just about the totality of money spent but, in this context, responding to suggestions about how that money might be spent better.

Photo of Rebecca Evans Rebecca Evans Labour 2:57, 14 January 2020

I would ask Mark Isherwood, if I may, for him to share that correspondence that he's received with me and with the Minister for health so that we can consider it more fully. I know that the health Minister would want to consider it in the context of his efforts in north Wales as well. But I think that Mark Isherwood's point does really speak to the importance of the patient voice and the user experience within the NHS, and the fact that, by capturing that, we can certainly look to continue to make the improvements that patients and their families would expect. So, that kind of contribution, I think, will be really useful and I look forward to receiving that and any other similar contributions that Mark Isherwood has that he wants to draw to our attention.

Photo of Elin Jones Elin Jones Plaid Cymru 2:58, 14 January 2020

(Translated)

Finally, Rhun ap Iorwerth.

Photo of Rhun ap Iorwerth Rhun ap Iorwerth Plaid Cymru

(Translated)

Thank you very much, Llywydd. May I ask for a written statement as a matter of urgency from the Minister for transport on concerns around the Flybe airline? There are suggestions from Westminster that the UK Government is considering some sort of funding package for the company, which of course is very important in terms of Cardiff Airport, providing a number of flights to and from Cardiff, and of course responsible for the service between Cardiff and Anglesey, which has become important to individuals, companies, businesses and in terms of the governance of Wales, which is very important.

I understand from my colleague in Westminster Jonathan Edwards MP that he has asked the Minister for transport there whether there has been any communication from the Welsh Government over concerns on Flybe, and the transport Minister said that nothing has been heard from the Welsh Government on the issue. I'm slightly surprised by that. But given the importance of this company, can we have a written statement now explaining exactly what steps the Welsh Government is taking, and the assurances that the Welsh Government is seeking in terms of the future?  

Photo of Rebecca Evans Rebecca Evans Labour 2:59, 14 January 2020

So, we're very aware of the media speculation around Flybe. Although, certainly at the point of coming into the Chamber this afternoon, there had been no comment from the company. But we are already in discussion with Cardiff Airport on the potential impact of the airline going into administration or, indeed, reducing the number of routes out of Cardiff. Of course, air passenger duty is part of this picture, and you know that we've long campaigned—and I think this is a view shared across parties in the Chamber—for the devolution of air passenger duty to Wales so that we can make our own decisions on how we would support Cardiff Airport. 

I think it's clear from what's happening at Flybe that there is a major issue with regional connectivity, and we're keen to continue having those discussions with the UK Government, but, as I said, at the moment, we understand there only to be speculation regarding Flybe and there's been nothing formal from the company yet.