5. Statement by the Minister for Health and Social Services: A Healthier Wales Transformation Fund Progress Report

Part of the debate – in the Senedd at 4:42 pm on 14 January 2020.

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Photo of Vaughan Gething Vaughan Gething Labour 4:42, 14 January 2020

Thank you for the list of questions. In terms of the £11 million in the second stage, as I tried to indicate in my statement already, I will be targeting that in the sense that one regional partnership board area will have a larger sum than others, apart from the way that the funding formula works, which already takes in the variety of points about need and population. So, we will then publish the amount of money that each regional partnership board has potentially to bid against, but, of course, partners themselves will have budgets to add to or otherwise. And I think I want to link that to a couple of the other points you made, both about evidence of progress, the national indicators update, and the transition from one region to another and the scale of that. Because the point of the second stage is, if there are novel and new things boards want to do, about what those are, together with the design principles, with an emphasis on wanting to see people taking on board across more than one region what is working in another, and I want to see more scale as that develops. Because, when we get to the end of the transformation fund period, we'll still have choices to make, regardless of who is the Minister at that time or not, about how we take that forward.

And the point about regional partnership boards as a key building block to this is (a) they already exist. People are used to having to make more and more choices together to share information, share learning, and actually to resolve problems together as well, because none of us should pretend that, even within our own families, let alone groups and different public services, we all agree on everything all of the time. So, it's a way to resolve those differences but then to still have a plan that people sign up to for the future. And I do think, bearing in mind your reference to the confidence we can have in partnership boards, we can have real confidence, because you can see not just that they came together to agree bids, but, on a range of areas, they are starting to make more more of a difference. And, in winter, for example, the fact that every regional partnership board agreed how to use winter moneys, rather than having a big row about who had which share of it, and what the whole-system priorities were within that area. That does give us more confidence about practical choices being made. I'm hoping for more of that, and then there'll be an open question for me or a future Minister about what then happens if we end up driving that further.

So, after this next stage, the transformation fund is over. Is that about money? Is that about encouraging people? Is it about requiring people to do things? Or is it more than that? But that would be forecasting the future, ahead of the evaluations we've had on the success of the projects. And I think that does come back to your point about evidence on progress in stage one and your point about the questions that Darren Millar previously asked on whether there was going to be a split between primary care, secondary care and social care. I don't think that's helpful, so I do want to look at it more in the round about the impact across the system. That's also the point about having partners agreeing together what should make sense, because, otherwise, if it got to be what's a split between different parts of our system, you can easily see those people moving off into corners saying, 'This is my money to decide what to do with,' rather than, 'What should make a difference for the person who will need to flow through and around that whole system?'

I said in my statement that the third of the quarterly evaluations is due imminently. What I intend to do is to write to the Health, Social Care and Sport Committee after the fourth evaluation we've had, so a full year's evaluation of each of the areas, and to give an update at that point. I imagine the committee may or may not decide they want to look at it in more detail, but there'd then be a public and visible, 'Here's the progress at that point, and the progress across the system.' You could also check that off then against the national indicators. I think it'd be helpful to see that together with the context of the evaluation and progress.

We should also then have decisions made on each of the second-stage bids that I've announced. I can't give you a hard deadline as to when I'll respond to that, because, of course, I need to see what the bids are and whether there is a need to go back to people before making a decision. But I am keen to make choices sooner rather than later, so we can get on with delivering the future.