Since I was the Minister who invented these things and they've been debated a number of times, it might be useful for me to actually say what lay behind it at the time. The strategic hubs were never a way of doing anything except focusing investment in particular places, because the criticism that we'd heard and the criticism that's been made—fairly, I think, in the past—has been that the Welsh Government has a limited resource that it has then spread so thinly as to make no real impact. And the consideration was that if we are to have a serious impact and achieve the targets that have been set for us during a four or five-year term, then that demanded and required investment in particular places. 

But we used the term 'hubs' partly because everybody else uses the term and, secondly, because we tried to avoid the anchor towns debate. For example, in my constituency, that would be saying to Ebbw Vale, 'You have all of this investment', and by the same token saying to Tredegar, to Brynmawr, to Nantyglo, to Blaina, to Abertillery, 'You're not having that investment.' And it was important therefore for us to say that we want to focus investment in and around particular places that are the transport hubs of the future, and the rest of it, but which would then lead to further investment. They were never seen as the be-all and end-all of the policy.