1. What discussions has the Minister had with the UK Government regarding regional investment funding in Wales post-Brexit? OAQ54960

4. What discussions has the Minister had with the UK Government regarding the shared prosperity fund? OAQ54935

5. Will the Minister make a statement on discussions held with the UK Government regarding the shared prosperity fund? OAQ54940

Llywydd, I understand that you've given permission for questions 1, 4 and 5 to be grouped. I met with the Secretary of State for Wales on 9 January and reiterated, as I have with other UK Government Ministers, the Welsh Government's position of, 'Not a penny less, not a power lost' for replacement EU funds in Wales.

Thanks for that answer, Minister, but I think the two big questions regarding the UK shared prosperity fund are: will it match the money that Wales currently receives from Europe, as the Brexiters promised?' and 'will it be devolved?' Has the UK Government deigned to share its plans with Wales yet, or, for that matter, Scotland or Northern Ireland?

Well, I thank the Member for that further question. The UK Government has committed to replace the funds lost to Wales through European structural funds. What we have asked for is for that to be quantified and for it to be by way of adjustment to the block grant so that the expenditure of that money, a hundred per cent of that money, is in accordance with the devolution settlement and enables the Welsh Government, as it does today, to deploy those funds in Wales to the best advantage of the people of Wales and to do that in a way that it can integrate with the other sources of regional funding across Wales.

Minister, I raised an issue with your colleague, the First Minister, some weeks ago, regarding the shared prosperity fund and the First Minister gave a fairly positive answer to that. But in designing a new scheme, can you give us some information on how that new scheme will address areas that haven't previously been able to secure finance via the EU structural funds?

Well, the Member will know that the EU structural funds are designed to deal with income inequalities and so forth in particular parts of Wales that qualify for the expenditure of those funds. In designing funds that replace those, it's open to the Welsh Government to cast the net more widely geographically, within Wales. We've been mindful of that opportunity and have worked, as part of the work that Huw Irranca-Davies's steering group has been working on, well, this has been one of the issues. We are keen to make sure that there is an opportunity for all communities in different parts of Wales to benefit from those funds, and the priorities that we have set for regional funding are around healthy and fairer communities, income inequalities, productive businesses and zero carbon Wales, which are issues that all parts of Wales would, I think, regard as priorities, and indeed opportunities to benefit from subsequent funding. I hope that the UK Government will take the steps that we call on them to make, so that the work that we have been doing with stakeholders across Wales—and I thank those stakeholders for their work—is able to be put into practice in a way that can benefit all parts of Wales. 

There are a number of elements that we're needing reassurance about regarding the future of the funding that's going to take the place of structural funds. The sum of money that’s going to come in the next few years is one issue and, in one way, that’s one of the easy things for the UK Government to do: they'll want to be seen to be giving the same amount of money for the period that’s to come. But, of course, there’s this question about how the money is controlled. I don't agree with everything that’s been done with the spending of European money in Wales; there have been spending decisions that I don't agree with. But where the funding has had a real impact, that has been led by the fact that decisions are being made here in Wales by people who understand the Welsh context. Do you, as a Minister, agree with me that that is the great risk now, that the UK Government doesn't have the capacity or the understanding to decide how to spend money sensibly in Wales, and that keeping control on where to invest funding in order to ensure fairness to the Welsh economy is important now—as important, really, as the sum itself?

Well, that question of capacity and understanding is very important, and the question of constitutional powers is also relevant to this. That inevitably is the case given the fact that those decisions have been made here in Wales by the Welsh Government over the past two decades, and slightly longer than that, indeed. So I agree with the point that the Member makes, that we do need clarity and agreement on that fundamental principle from a constitutional perspective, but also—and I think this is implicit in the Member’s question—from a practical point of view, that is, the ability to spend that money in a way that does have an impact and can work with other funding sources available to the Welsh Government and other organisations in Wales. And I also think that it’s important that there is an opportunity for us here to make decisions at a regional level within Wales, as well as doing that at a national level.

David Melding.

No, sorry. 

David Rees.

Diolch, Llywydd. Minister, as has been clearly said, we haven't got a clue what the shared prosperity fund is going to be doing yet, but what we want to be able to ensure is that the money we would have received from European funding is matched by the money that comes from the shared prosperity fund to Wales, and allows the Welsh Government to make decisions on what best suits Wales. You've had discussions with the Secretary of State for Wales. The previous Secretary of State indicated that he was going to have a consultation process. Do we know if that consultation process is going to go ahead? What are they doing? When will we have a definitive statement from the UK Government as to what the shared prosperity fund will be; how we will be able to access it? Will there be any controls placed upon it to look at what they want it spent on, or will we have freedom? It's important we continue to have this detail, because without the detail, we're still talking about fresh air; we haven't got a clue what's happening. 

I share the frustration of the Member. We do welcome the broad, admittedly, but positive commitments from the UK Government to work with us in a consensual way in relation to this. But we do need that to move into practical implementation, and it's absolutely vital that the UK Government now shares with us the detail of what it proposes. We have been working up—and I've been open about this with the UK Government—we've been working up in detail what we think are well-designed proposals for consultation, as it were, but it is important now for the UK Government to come forward with a very simple commitment, I think, that the funds currently available to Wales through those funds can be deployed in Wales, and that all of them are subject to the existing powers the Welsh Government has on behalf of the people of Wales, and that they form, effectively, an adjustment to the block grant, so that those can be deployed effectively on behalf of people in Wales. But I share the frustration of the Member: we don't yet have the detail and the thinking that we should have at this point, and I hope that will be remedied sooner rather than later.