Part of the debate – in the Senedd at 6:27 pm on 25 February 2020.
Can I just add my support to the Counsel General for the approach he's taken? I think it's fair to say, despite our occasional disagreements, that the Welsh Government, in trying to strengthen the British constitution under devolution, usually ends up in the right place. I sometimes have arguments about how you eventually got there, but I do think the work you've done with the Sewel convention is important, given that it obviously was breached, because there was not a normal circumstance. And I've never thought the word 'normal' was very helpful, and at least we now have language from the UK Government—'singular' and 'exceptional', and I think you used another adjective as well—which I do think is helpful.
But what I do support is that we move to some sort of expanded convention or codify somehow around the phrasing that you chose, in terms of it would be denied only in the most exceptional circumstances. I do think that would be a better description of the position we're in where we have to acknowledge ultimate parliamentary sovereignty in Westminster, but obviously devolution is just made a nonsense if Sewel really is in a fairly casual way defied. So, I think that's important.
I think you're right: there doesn't seem a need for a Senedd Bill to keep pace with EU legislation in the transition period. I'm completely satisfied that you can do that through the various technical powers you have and, should something major come along, then the proper thing is to bring a Bill in. I can't see anyone finding an objection to that.
If you permit me the indulgence, Presiding Officer, I do want to congratulate my colleague Darren Millar on his conversion or avowal now of federalism. [Laughter.] I have to say it's been a lonely—[Interruption.]—it's been a lonely—[Interruption.] I do apologise, it must have been a bit of a whisper and I didn't pick it up. [Laughter.] But I'm delighted to have such a distinguished ally. I do recommend to you, Darren, and indeed to the Counsel General, if you've not already read it, my e-book available at the IWA, The Reformed Union—. Now, where did we hear that phrase? Who pinched that later? The Reformed Union: The UK as a Federation.