15. Statement by the Minister for Health and Social Services: Update on Local Coronavirus Restrictions

– in the Senedd at 6:21 pm on 29 September 2020.

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Photo of Elin Jones Elin Jones Plaid Cymru 6:21, 29 September 2020

(Translated)

The next item is a statement by the Minister for Health and Social Services, an update on local coronavirus restrictions, and I call on the Minister to make the statement. Vaughan Gething.

Photo of Vaughan Gething Vaughan Gething Labour

Thank you, Llywydd, for the opportunity to update Members today about the latest situation across Wales. The First Minister, myself and the Minister for north Wales have just come from a meeting with local authority leaders, the police, the NHS and public health experts to discuss the rise of coronavirus infections in parts of north Wales. Unfortunately, we are seeing a similar pattern of transmission in coronavirus in Wrexham, Denbighshire, Flintshire and Conwy as we have already seen in parts of south Wales. Rates remain low in Anglesey and Gwynedd at present.

After extensive discussions and taking into account the local incident management teams, it was agreed by everyone in that meeting that urgent action is needed now to control the spread of the virus in north Wales and to protect people’s health. The Welsh Government will, therefore, be introducing local restrictions—the same local restriction measures that are in place in parts of south Wales—in Wrexham, Denbighshire, Flintshire and Conwy from 6.00 p.m. on Thursday 1 October.

Llywydd, over the last few weeks, we have seen a significant rise in the number of new coronavirus cases across Wales overall. Nationally, in those areas that are not within extra local restrictions, we must remember that people are not allowed to meet socially indoors with people that they do not live with and who are not part of their extended household or bubble. If people have formed an extended household, they can meet indoors in a group of up to six people from that extended household at any one time. Under-11s are not included when counting the six, as long as they are part of that extended household. Of course, indoors includes people's homes and hospitality venues. People must not gather outdoors in groups of more than 30; face coverings are mandatory in indoor public spaces and, of course, on public transport, subject to certain exemptions and exceptions; and licensed premises must not sell alcohol after 10.00 p.m. That includes pubs and restaurants as well as off-licences, supermarkets and other retail outlets.

Whilst case numbers continue to rise nationally, we do not have immediate plans for any further national restrictions. We will, of course, act if we feel that further national restrictions are needed to help prevent the spread of coronavirus and outweigh the wider harms that such restrictions can cause. Any decisions will continue to be based upon medical and scientific evidence and advice.

We've seen spikes in case numbers across a number of local authority areas and, as a result, a large part of the population of south Wales are now living in areas with local restrictions in place to protect their health and prevent the spread of coronavirus. Areas under local restrictions at present are Caerphilly, Rhondda Cynon Taf, Blaenau Gwent, Bridgend, Merthyr Tydfil, Newport, Llanelli, Cardiff, Swansea, Neath Port Talbot, the Vale of Glamorgan and Torfaen. The local restrictions are the same in each designated area. People are not allowed to enter or leave the area without a reasonable excuse and people are not allowed to meet indoors with anyone they do not live with for the time being. This includes extended households, sometimes called a bubble; they have unfortunately had to be suspended for the time being. All licensed premises have to stop serving alcohol at 10.00 p.m. in line with national restrictions and everyone must work from home wherever possible.

To be clear, a reasonable excuse to leave or enter an area includes going to work where people cannot work from home or using public services that are not available locally. It also includes visiting family or close friends on compassionate grounds if necessary. So, of course, people who have urgent hospital appointments, for example, can leave or enter an area. For those who share parental responsibility, they can continue existing arrangements for access and contact for their child or children, including leaving or entering a local area if needed. Similarly, essential childcare arrangements can continue. That includes where this is provided by, for example, grandparents, although clearly there are increased risks with older people and we recommend that alternative care arrangements are found if possible.

As a minimum, everyone should ensure that they are regularly washing their hands and the wider guidance on managing the virus is followed. Routine visits to care homes in areas under local restrictions have been suspended by those local authorities at the present time. Visits to care homes may still take place within those areas in exceptional circumstances, such as end of life, however this should be discussed with the individual care home before travelling. Children, providing they are well, should continue to go to school. Keeping schools open remains our top priority.

This is not a regional lockdown. We have introduced a series of local restrictions in these local authority areas to respond to a specific rise in cases within each area. All of them have distinct and unique chains of transmission. The local measures have been selected to maximise the impacts on reducing coronavirus transmission and to minimise the wider harm that such restrictions can cause as we know. The measures are designed to supplement and enhance local responses from the local authority, local health boards and the police, and those are already under way.

We will keep these measures under constant review and we'll continue to hold meetings with public health experts, local authority leaders, the NHS, police and police and crime commissioners to assess the latest position in each of these areas. In Caerphilly and Newport, we're seeing real falls in case numbers and we are hopeful that we will be able to take action to relax these restrictions in these areas if those case numbers continue to fall. It is important that everyone follows the rules for where they live. We need everyone's help to bring coronavirus under control. It is only by working together that we will be able to reduce coronavirus infections, the harm that they cause and to protect ourselves and our loved ones, and together, we can keep Wales safe. Thank you, Llywydd.

Photo of Andrew RT Davies Andrew RT Davies Conservative 6:28, 29 September 2020

Thank you, Minister, for your statement. Can I first of all put on record the Conservatives' thanks to all the public officials and everyone connected to trying to suppress the virus in the outbreak areas? No-one wants to be under restriction, but obviously these restrictions place a particular obligation on certain public officials and also the public at large to adhere to them, and I put my thanks on the record and that of the Welsh Conservatives to each and every one who is battling the fight to suppress the virus.

I put a series of questions to the Minister in relation to his statement, which I appreciate didn't arrive as it usually does, but I have had a brief sight of it, so I'd like to ask the Minister in the first instance: how is the decision arrived at when infection rates go over a certain threshold that the Minister responds and puts the restrictions in place? Because on Sunday, the Vale of Glamorgan, for example, was put into the bracket of restrictions on the Monday night, yet it had a lower infection rate than the counties that he's announced this evening that won't go under restriction until Thursday. Flintshire, Denbighshire and Conwy all had higher infection rates on Sunday as opposed to the Vale of Glamorgan, so I'd be interested to understand how the Government reads into those infection rates and responds accordingly.

I'd also like to try and understand, after asking him some two weeks ago, what progress is being made in trying to develop a local information campaign, so that, as in other parts of the United Kingdom, a ward-by-ward understanding of infection rates can be understood by the Government, and, where possible, the hyperlocal lockdowns rather than countywide or regionwide lockdowns are achieved. At the moment, I disagree with the Minister when he says these aren't regional lockdowns. In the south, some 2 million people are now under lockdown; I'd hazard a guess—with my understanding of the north—that this most probably affects approximately half a million people in north-east Wales. In effect, the whole of north-east Wales is now under lockdown as of Thursday night with these announcements. So, I do think that the Minister does need to try and develop a strategy where there is better use of local information to try and support hyperlocal lockdowns, as opposed to countywide lockdowns, where the information supports that.

I'd also like to hear from the Minister what action he is taking in response to the older persons' commissioner's concerns raised yesterday about visits to care homes. I understand there has been some movement in those restrictions and that guidance issued yesterday, but I think the concerns from the older persons' commissioner going forward—in particular as we go into the winter months—are worthy of movement from the Government where they can, to facilitate such visits into care homes, because of the mental well-being of the residents concerned.

I'd also like to understand from the Minister in particular what action his Government is taking in relation to student returns to many of the counties that are under lockdown. The mental well-being and health of the students, as well as those associated with universities, has to be a critical priority, and I'd like to understand what discussions have gone on between the Government and the institutions, to know that there is a comprehensive plan of support and help when it comes to mental health and well-being.

I'd also like to understand from the Minister how he is taking forward the next review—I'd like to see action now, but I understand the review process that the Welsh Government works to—around trying to facilitate greater access for people living on their own. Because at the moment, obviously, they are going to have little or no contact with other individuals, and again, that has serious implications for mental health and well-being. I do hear what the First Minister said this afternoon about wanting to make progress in this area; I understand progress has been made in other parts of the United Kingdom, namely Scotland, and I would urge the Minister, if he feels able under the current evidence that he has, to try and make progress on this area quicker than just the 21-day review that is currently undertaken.

And finally, the Minister issued a written statement this morning in relation to capacity of Nightingale hospitals going down from 19 across Wales to ten. Obviously, the national lockdown back in the spring was all about suppressing the virus so that ultimately, there wouldn't be a huge burden on the NHS, and this capacity was introduced to try and alleviate such a burden. With the spike in infection rates, with the predictions that I presume the Minister's had sight of, can he gave us confidence that it is prudent to reduce the bed capacity that is available via the Nightingale hospital operation and that he does have confidence that if—and we hope that this won't be the case, but if—it is the case that there is a surge in hospital admissions, the current configuration that he has available to him, and the Welsh NHS has available to him on beds, would be able to cope with a surge in numbers of patients entering the health service across Wales? Thank you, Presiding Officer.

Photo of Vaughan Gething Vaughan Gething Labour 6:33, 29 September 2020

Thank you for those comments and questions; I'll try and deal with all of them as quickly as I can. In terms of how the decision making works and the example of the Vale of Glamorgan and others, well, we of course look at the figures and the statistics, so we look at figures on the number of positive cases per 100,000. We have to take into account the fact that we understand that those figures are slightly behind the time, because we still have a challenge in some of the lighthouse lab results coming in later than was the case some weeks ago. So, we always know the figures on the day are somewhat behind the situation. We also look at positivity rates as well, and the testing that is taking place. It's not particularly difficult to see the move in both the number of positive cases, but also the positivity rates. That's the number of new cases per 100 tests being carried out, and so we can understand what's happening in the direction of travel in each area.

We're also looking to act in a way that is not waiting until significant harm has been caused. That means that we have taken action where we can see authorities in, if you like, our amber category, before they get to red and 50 and above. That also takes account of not just the figures, not the just pattern and direction of travel, but the local circumstances, so we understand the spread and the nature of infection rates, how dispersed those are, whether we have clusters that are not explained about where they started. And in that pattern of infections—all of this is set out in the coronavirus control plan that I'm sure the Member has had the opportunity to read following publication of it in the summer. And that also sets out our approach in terms of whether we can undertake local restrictions, not countywide ones. In each and every choice we have made, we have rehearsed and considered the possibility of not taking measures across a whole county borough area, and apart from Llanelli within Carmarthenshire, the case hasn't been made that the pattern of spread is such that we could and should take a local measure in that way—whereas in Carmarthenshire, it was very clear the pattern of spread in Llanelli was not made out in the rest of county. Rural Carmarthenshire has a much lower rate of spread, and if it was just rural Carmarthenshire, we wouldn't have taken additional measures at this point in time at least. So, that's the position that we've taken; it is a regular consideration for us.

Photo of Vaughan Gething Vaughan Gething Labour 6:35, 29 September 2020

And on his point about these are really not local measures, the Member is quite simply wrong. These are local restrictions within a local authority area. That is where the measures apply; that is where the point about the reasonable excuse and the travel measures apply. It is the case that if local authorities move at different rates and different paces in terms of their recovery and their suppression of the virus, then we will make choices about that local authority. We won't, for the sake of argument, hold up if progress is made in Caerphilly and Newport, and say that no progress can be made on restoring some of the freedoms we have had to suspend to protect people from harm from coronavirus until other parts of south Wales have made progress too. So, that simply isn't a reasonable measure at all.

In terms of the older persons' commissioner's regular view about the importance of care home visits, we take on board the comments the older persons' commissioner made previously, and the approach of this Government in protecting people from harm, and the concern that action wasn't taken early enough to protect care home residents from the potential harm that community transmission could cause within that area. We produced Welsh Government guidance last week that the Deputy Minister, Julie Morgan, issued. Now, that sets out some assistance for decision making, but these are ultimately local authority choices about whether to end visits within their local authority area for their direct provision, and their direct relationship with providers who they commission care from. So, it's a matter for local authorities, taking account of the guidance we have provided, the regular conversations that take place between the Government and social service directors, and, indeed, the note that the older persons' commissioner, which I think was helpfully provided at the start of this week.

On student returns, the education Minister has set out much of the information, as did the First Minister earlier. He'll be aware that there are measures that each university has in place, about not just teaching and learning, but how to undertake control measures. And, more than that, if we do see spikes in infection rates, we're looking to have a conversation that takes account of the community we're dealing with—whether that's students or people in the non-student population. We're not looking to take additional measures around the students that we would not apply to other parts of the community. Now, it may be that the circumstances in which students live and operate in are slightly different, but it's just about the pattern that we see, rather than looking to take extra or extraordinary measures because students may be seeing a rise or fall in infection rates. It's also worth pointing out, as I said before, that the leadership of every university institution and the National Union of Students, at an NUS Wales level and locally, I think have been very responsible in their messaging and leadership on this issue. 

In terms of living alone, you've heard what the First Minister had to say: it's a matter of active consideration within the Government, we're looking to see what we can do, and that's in accordance with our 21-day review process. We'll be reporting on Friday. If we could make a decision before then, then it is, of course, open for us to do so, but this is not a matter where we're looking to take weeks and weeks of consideration and avoid making a decision. The First Minister set that out in some detail earlier on today. 

On field hospitals in Wales, we are learning from the first wave. You will recall, being a member of the Health, Social Care and Sport Committee, the briefing we provided to that committee on the reasonable worst-case scenario models and information we're getting from actual data and information here in Wales. That's the basis on which we're planning and the basis on which we're expecting health boards to plan. The field hospital choice that I have made should provide us with the capacity that the Member indicates for that level of assurance. And if we do see a surge, then we should be able to make sure that people are treated appropriately within our system here in Wales, either in expanded direct provision within a national health service hospital, or indeed in one of the newer NHS field hospitals that we have within Wales. But, as ever, we'll need to continue to review the position as the spread of coronavirus impacts all the choices that we make. But, I hope that we can intervene early enough not to need the full extent of that capacity and the harm that would mean many, many citizens in Wales will be suffering.

Photo of Rhun ap Iorwerth Rhun ap Iorwerth Plaid Cymru 6:40, 29 September 2020

(Translated)

Thank you for the statement from the Minister. For those who have been keeping an eye on the spread of the virus and the statistics shared with us, unfortunately, today's statement will come as no surprise, perhaps. But, certainly, I feel for those who live within these newly identified areas, in Conwy, Denbighshire, Flintshire and Wrexham, which are being added to the list of counties under additional restrictions. They are very harsh restrictions that do remove freedoms, and we do hope that this will apply for only a brief period. The message for my constituency in Anglesey, and Gwynedd and other parts of Wales that aren't under restrictions, is that the risk is there. If the figures do rise, and if steps aren't taken by Government and the local population to safeguard themselves, they could be next, as it were. 

The Minister will be fully aware that I support taking action as locally as possible. Perhaps he could tell us, in the context of north Wales particularly, how we can have confidence that rural Denbighshire, for example, perhaps doesn't need to face these restrictions. Why take action at a local authority level in this way? I would appeal that they should share that data, as they do in England, which would identify the cases from one area to another in very great detail.

Also, of course, as more areas are included, we are including more and more of the population, and my concern is increasing in terms of the impact on people's well-being and mental health, particularly people living alone. Is the Minister forming any thoughts on a strategy that could reach out to those people who are under the greatest threat of suffering those pressures in terms of mental health and so on? I would be interested to hear how the Government is thinking along those lines.

Photo of Rhun ap Iorwerth Rhun ap Iorwerth Plaid Cymru 6:42, 29 September 2020

I want to turn to testing also. We're asking people to behave in a particular way, but the Government has to get its house in order too. It was your call, of course, to depend on the lighthouse labs, instead of controlling our own capacity. The First Minister said earlier today that Wales's in-house capacity would hit 8,000 a day in a few weeks; 5,000 next week, 8,000 a week or two after that. But, I remind you of the promise that we'd be up to 9,000 a day by the end of April within Wales. If we had stuck to that trajectory, I think we'd probably be in a better place than having stuck with lighthouse. This needs resolving, of course, because we need fast testing, fast results, in order to instigate the fast tracing that will help isolate cases. So, your response on that too. 

Finally, if I may, to hospital transmission. Now, there's desperate concern, at the Royal Glamorgan Hospital in particular, about a lack of preparation, it seems, for the second wave, despite warnings—not least from over 100 clinicians, I'm told, signing a letter during the summer calling for the establishment of a green site. There are a number of COVID-positive wards at the Royal Glam now, ITU has been operating at capacity and, despite knowing the dangers of hospital transmission, I'm told that they only last week began testing patients as they were admitted to the Royal Glam, other than elective patients. There's still no routine testing of staff, I understand.

So, can the Minister say why this hospital has such high transmission rates, just as in the last wave, why so little seems to have changed, what's been done to protect it and other hospitals and those who work in them and those who are cared for in them? I understand that changes might be about to be introduced to that hospital and how it admits patients and so on, but, if so, why only now, given the long-standing warnings?

Photo of Vaughan Gething Vaughan Gething Labour 6:45, 29 September 2020

In terms of your point about local action as opposed to countywide action, I think I've dealt with that in response to Andrew R.T. Davies. It's a regular part of consideration, and you'll see that we've made that choice within Carmarthenshire. We regularly consider the advice that we get from the local incident management teams on the pattern of infection that exists, and we then have to make choices based on the local evidence and intelligence of that. If we're in a position to have a different pattern of measures coming into force, then we would do so. This is all about how we keep Wales safe and how we keep individual communities and groups of communities safe across the country as well.

In terms of your point about loneliness and isolation and the mental health and well-being of people, this is something that we have regularly considered throughout. It's part of the reason why the household bubbles or extended households have been introduced, to make sure that there's a predictable pattern of people meeting each other indoors, because the greatest risk of infection is from your family and your friends. You'll have heard from Rob Orford, the chief scientific adviser on health, last week in the health committee that they are the people who you are most likely to give coronavirus to or to acquire coronavirus from. It's a very, very difficult measure to break apart those household bubble arrangements and its one of the more difficult parts of decision making that we have to confront, so we don't do it lightly.

We are looking, as you know, at individual measures to see whether we can do more, because, certainly, as I've recognised in the statement, I recognise that the measures we take to protect people's lives come with a cost, and, as I say, that is not something that we do lightly at all.

In terms of your regular commentary about testing, you'll be aware that there was no consequential on offer in terms of the lighthouse lab programme. It was a programme for us either to take part in or not, and much of the commentary at the outset was why we weren't taking part in the programme, and you'll recall that I indicated previously that that was because we weren't able to have the data flowing in to us. We are now. We've been able to do it in a consistent way in Wales throughout that period of time. It's why we haven't had some of the challenges that England had recently for a couple of days on the NHS COVID app, because we've managed to arrange our system to have all of that information flowing into the Welsh system and going to our contact tracers and more broadly.

It's also the case, of course, that we're not the only Government that has taken part in the lighthouse lab testing programme. The SNP Government in Scotland took part much earlier than we did, as did the multiparty Government in Northern Ireland. We have, alongside that, built up our own capacity and now we regularly have 3,000 to 4,000 Public Health Wales lab tests being run each day. We expect to see that expanded in the coming days as a regular part and feature of our system. So, we're actually in a place where that is helping to sustain the Welsh testing process at present, whilst we look for lighthouse labs to recover, and we're building into it the expected increase in demand.

On your point on the speed of tracing and not just the success of it, this is a genuine good-news story for Wales. We should be very proud of what our public servants have done across health and local government working together. In the last week when we've published figures, 94 per cent of new cases were successfully traced, and in terms of their contacts, 86 per cent of their contacts were successfully traced and 73 per cent of those contacts were traced within 24 hours. So, we're getting to high numbers of people and we're getting to them very quickly as well. What we want, though, is more information provided to us more quickly to allow our contact tracers to do their job, because that is an essential part of keeping all the other forms of activity open for business across Wales, whether in high or low prevalence areas. But I generally think that people on all political sides and shades can take a share of credit for what NHS Wales test, trace and protect is delivering right across the country.

In terms of the Royal Glamorgan Hospital, the CMO's office has sent out a reminder to all parts of the service about testing patients before they come in. Staff are being tested within the Royal Glamorgan, and any decisions that are made about any further control measures will take place following consideration by the local management team and the local public health agency, together with the local authority as a key partner. Because we will need to think about who needs to be in that hospital and how the red and green zones that are in place in the Royal Glamorgan and in other hospitals—to make sure they're functioning effectively. We understand that some of this is about transmission within the hospital and some of it also comes from the reality that there is a community reservoir of coronavirus that has risen over the last few weeks, which is why Rhondda Cynon Taf is part of the local restrictions regime that we have in place across a number of authorities in Wales. But as and when there is a decision to be made, it'll be a matter for the local health board to take some of these steps, but if I need to make a decision, then I'll make sure that I communicate that to Members and the public as soon as possible.

Photo of Rhianon Passmore Rhianon Passmore Labour 6:49, 29 September 2020

Health Minister, the COVID-19 pandemic has now claimed over a million people's lives across the world, according to researchers at Johns Hopkins University. In the United Kingdom, the current death toll with coronavirus is 57,860, and in Wales, our death toll is 1,612. These numbers represent human beings—someone's mother, someone's father, someone's brother and someone's sister. As the Member of the Senedd for Islwyn, with its large cluster of Valleys communities that sit within the Caerphilly County Borough Council authority, I welcome the very prompt action the Welsh Government has taken in September, when we saw the number of positive tests rise rapidly. The localised coronavirus restrictions are tough for us all. Humans need to socialise and to live our precious lives in freedom. However, we face a public health crisis not seen in a century. We are our brothers and sisters' keepers, and I want to thank all those across Islwyn who diligently follow the restrictions and who make daily sacrifices to do so.

Health Minister, would you agree with me that Islwyn residents, who are going the distance, obeying the restrictions and making those sacrifices are, firstly, making a difference? Prior to these restrictions, Caerphilly county borough had the highest rate in case rises in Wales, and now has one of the fastest falling, throughout the United Kingdom, down to 50.3 cases per 100,000 people, after more than two weeks in lockdown, and this matters. And to those deniers who think it does not, I refer you to the health professionals invested in your health, your well-being, those who you go to on matters of life and death. And I know that the health Minister—

Photo of Elin Jones Elin Jones Plaid Cymru 6:51, 29 September 2020

Rhianon Passmore, this is a statement, and you'll need to ask your question now, please.

Photo of Rhianon Passmore Rhianon Passmore Labour 6:52, 29 September 2020

Thank you. So, to summarise, health Minister, what message, now, would you give to the people of Islwyn about how they can influence the next six months, and what message of hope would you give them that these regulations are needed and work? Thank you, Llywydd.

Photo of Vaughan Gething Vaughan Gething Labour

Thank you to the Member for Islwyn, and I'm happy to confirm that Islwyn residents are indeed making a difference. Caerphilly county borough had, as you say, the highest rate in Wales only a few weeks ago; it's now falling—it's hovering around 50 per 100,000. We want to see that fall, and be a sustained fall, under 50 per 100,000, to allow us to consider returning freedoms that we have had to take away. And, as I say, that is not a light or an easy thing to do; it is a significant intrusion into how people live their lives. I am keen to see that return, but the measures that we have taken in breaking apart extended households, in introducing the restrictions on travel—. We know that there are fewer people travelling within and outside the Caerphilly county borough, we know that, because the infection rates are falling, we can be confident that the measures that people are taking are making a difference, and the hope is, and the expectation is, that if in Caerphilly it can work, then it can work in any and every other part of the country too. So, my thanks are to the team within the Caerphilly county borough, not just at the health board and at the council level, led by Philippa Marsden, but, actually, the residents themselves as well. And that, of course, includes the other constituencies of Caerphilly and the Rhymney part of Merthyr Tydfil and Rhymney.

And I think that the hope for the future is that it is not inevitable that restrictions have to be a one-way escalator to further and further additional measures and intrusions into people's liberty. I think it is possible to see a reduction and it's up to all of us to do our part—to understand the rules and to follow the rules, and not to look for a way to break the rules, but to recognise they are there for all of us for the benefit of all of us. And if we follow them, it'll be the most effective thing we can do, together with good hand hygiene and social distancing, to reduce the amount of harm that you correctly point out has taken place already within Wales and the rest of the UK.

Photo of Darren Millar Darren Millar Conservative 6:54, 29 September 2020

Thank you, Minister, for your statement. Many people in north Wales will obviously be quite concerned about the new restrictions that they will now face. Reference has already been made to the need for more localised data, and, of course, this information is published on a ward-by-ward basis in England, but, unfortunately, not so here in terms of the number of cases in immediate localities. And, of course, it's our job to make sure that we scrutinise the Welsh Government's actions, and one of the things that you have consistently said is something that you have to abide by is that the measures that you take have to be proportionate. Well, how do we know whether countywide lockdowns are proportionate if we can't see the data on which you're basing your decisions? I think it's incumbent upon you to publish that information, because I fail to understand and fail to see how, if infection rates are high in one part of a county, the whole of the county and all of those people who live there should face additional restrictions as a result. In Conwy and Denbighshire, there are urban coasts with very rural hinterlands, and we know that the evidence seems to suggest that where there is significant rural sparsity, the infection rates are lower.

The other thing that is very different in north Wales versus those parts of south Wales that currently face these additional restrictions is the fact that north Wales relies heavily on the visitor economy. Around one in seven jobs in my own constituency is reliant on the tourism industry, and they are not just businesses in the tourism industry that employ, but, of course, those other businesses that are non-directly tourism related that also rely on the visitors who come and spend money. The tourism businesses have only had two months' worth of visitors this year, and, generally speaking, it's the fat of the summer months that keeps many of these businesses alive in town centres like Colwyn Bay, Towyn, Kinmel Bay and Ruthin. So, can I ask what additional support you might be able to ensure is available to those businesses, given that they have been particularly hard hit? I heard the statement from the economy Minister earlier, but I don't think that that goes far enough for those businesses that are being hit very hard by the pandemic.

One final question, if I may—

Photo of Darren Millar Darren Millar Conservative

I note that the restrictions on travel in and out of these counties also affect people of faith in a significant way. As I understand it, it's not considered to be a reasonable excuse to travel beyond your local authority border to attend a place of worship of your choice. Now, there are many people of faith who travel across their county borders in order to access services in churches and synagogues of denominations or places of worship of their particular faith. This is not something that I believe is acceptable, and I would urge you, Minister, to look at this again. You've been very considerate of faith communities generally throughout this lockdown, but spiritual well-being is just as important as mental health and physical well-being, and therefore I urge you to look again at that particular restriction to see whether there's some way that that can be addressed.

Photo of Vaughan Gething Vaughan Gething Labour 6:57, 29 September 2020

On your final point, I'll look again at the issue, because we do have regular conversations with faith leaders, but this is about keeping people alive in the first instance and how we then try to keep them well, and these are significant intrusions into how people live their lives. I have recognised that not just today, but on many other occasions. What we want to do is to try to take an approach that balances the harm that we know coronavirus causes and to see how we can suppress the virus to allow a different and a more normal, in these certainly not normal times, way for people to go about living their lives. But the starting point has to be how we keep people alive in the first instance.

Look, I understand the point that you've made, not just today, on data, and I have committed to look at it, and I will and I'll come back, not just to Darren Millar, but it's something that I think will probably get taken up in the health committee tomorrow about the data we have and how that's provided, published and made available, not just to Members, but the wider public as well.

But it is important to point out this is not simply a data-driven exercise. The intelligence and evidence we get from our local test, trace and protect teams always plays a role, and the intelligence and evidence we get from local partners working together in the incident management teams that we set out and described clearly within the coronavirus control plan all have a part to play in the choices that we make. And they are always difficult choices as well. The balance of this is not straightforward in what we choose to do and how we choose to try to protect people now and for the future.

Turning to your point about coastal communities and the rural spread, that is a point that we recognise in other parts of the country as well, and I think parts of south Wales have recognised they've got populations along their coast and a rural hinterland as well. It's worth pointing out, of course, that many of the coastal communities in north Wales are particularly vulnerable, because there is a significant number of people who have retired and live in north Wales coastal communities. So, actually, the harm that a significant upswing in coronavirus could cause potentially has the opportunity to cause even greater harm than in other populations.

On your point about tourism, I recognise that tourism is a significant part of the economy in north Wales. I had the opportunity in better times to visit the Llŷn peninsula with my family this year for a week, and I was very impressed with the measures that were in place in that part of Wales to look after residents and tourists alike. The attractions are very clear, and in better times we would all be encouraging people to sample them. It's not the case, though, that there isn’t the same sort of impact within south Wales. I think your characterisation that tourism isn't a significant part of the decision making we have to take account of in the south simply isn't correct. It's not just the Gower or Barry Island that have a tourism impact, and we've had to think about that in each choice that we've made. As I say, they're not simple or straightforward. Ken Skates's announcement has confirmed a significant amount of support that's available for businesses in these areas of local restrictions and a fund specifically targeted at businesses in the tourism sector. We would want to do more and to go further, but it is the reality of our budget position that we can't spend money that we don't have.

We have engaged with the UK Government and other Governments across the UK to look for a more significant support package, because similar arguments are, of course, played out in those 10 million and more people in England who are also having to live with a measure of local restrictions—the impact on businesses there. I certainly hope that the Chancellor will look again at the measures he is able to take to support parts of the economy that are going to be directly affected because of the efforts that every Government will have to take to keep people safe and well.

Photo of Janet Finch-Saunders Janet Finch-Saunders Conservative

Diolch, Llywydd. Thank you for your statement, Minister. You're quite right to point out the difficulties for, particularly, retired people, and you'll be aware that, of course, Aberconwy, in terms of demographic, has one of the older populations. Now, I can tell you that a lot of my constituents in that sort of bracket really suffered during the last lockdown, and we had the lighter nights, we had the better weather, so, as we go into the much shorter days and bad weather, I really do fear. So, what support network will you be considering putting in place for those who do live alone? Because, in the midst of the last lockdown, Age UK highlighted research showing that over two fifths of people aged 70 and over said that their mental health had been affected badly by coronavirus. So, I really do fear for this category of people who live alone, often not having any family members around. What support can they have? Can they have even friends—a particular friend—visiting? These are the questions that I will be asked when contacted by my constituents.

What consideration have you given to ensuring that the local lockdown rules are in line with article 8 of the European Convention on Human Rights, and that is the right to respect for private and family life? What extra resources will you be putting in place for our local authorities? Let's be honest, during the last lockdown, I've got to be honest with you, Conwy County Borough Council stood up and they did provide a strong net of support for our local communities, but that came at a cost to our local authorities, and they are still reeling from the pressures that those—you know, the lack of funding from your Government.

Darren Millar was quite right to mention the economic benefit of tourism to our county—around £900 million. Already this afternoon, in fear of what you may be announcing today, our hospitality businesses are really concerned. Now, last time the UK Government stepped up very well for our businesses. Will you now pledge—I know there's been an announcement today, but will you now pledge your Government will step up and support those businesses? Will they be able to still welcome visitors from within and outside the county?

And finally—[Interruption.]—yes, thank you, Llywydd—finally, currently, care home residents in Conwy are now only tested if showing symptoms. Will you now—given the fiasco that we all witnessed in the last lockdown, will you now be advocating weekly testing for all care home, nursing home, residents and staff? Thank you. Thank you, Llywydd.

Photo of Vaughan Gething Vaughan Gething Labour 7:04, 29 September 2020

Thank you for the questions, which I'll deal with in turn. In terms of lone adult households, we have to consider the balance of harm and benefit, and I've answered two questions in this set of questions already on exactly that point, and the First Minister answered questions as well, so the Member will be familiar with the fact that it's a whole-Government consideration, it's under active consideration, and we want to be able to make a decision within this week, and we'll be clear with people whatever that choice is. It's worth pointing out, of course, that it's not only older adults who sometimes live as lone-adult households; there are individual young and middle-aged adults who live on their own; there are individual parents who live with dependent children who we know have also had some challenges in terms of the loneliness and isolation they have felt. So, we recognise this is a wider challenge. 

It's interesting to hear Janet Finch-Saunders talk about human rights and the European convention. The impact on human rights is recognised within the explanatory memorandum for all the regulations that we publish, and it is a recognition that this is an intrusion into a range of rights. And it's the balance in rights and it's recognising that there is a balanced approach to be taken. It's the same challenge that we face every time we introduce regulations in this pandemic, just as every other Government, whether in England, Scotland and Northern Ireland, has to do as well. 

In terms of your broader calls for spending, I simply don't accept the characterisation the Member tries to paint of funding support for local government. It isn't just that, frankly, local government in Wales has a better funding deal overall than colleagues in England; we have provided a significant upfront funding for local government that was welcomed across the political spectrum within local government. And I think that her comments simply don't reflect the people actually doing the job in local government and the very constructive relationship that we have with them. The meetings that we have had for every set of local restrictions have involved political leaders, regardless of what party they represent. It is a deliberate attempt to work in a very grown-up, mature and constructive way, and the tone of the Member's comments don't really follow the actual business that we're doing with people in positions of responsibility in local government across Wales. 

In terms of money for businesses, I think I've dealt with that previously, and Ken Skates has already indicated where we are in terms of support, and of course we want to be able to do more, but the reality of our budget is that, whilst we have powers to do a range of things, we need more money to be able to do so. We're not the only Government in that position and I think there'll be a demand from businesses in every part of the UK for more support, because the pandemic is far from over. 

On regular testing, we are providing a regular testing service for staff within the residential care sector. The Member will notice that we have regularly reported on that. I assume that may have slipped attention, in the comments that have been made, but that programme continues—regular testing for our care home staff. There are challenges in the turnaround that are affected by the lighthouse lab testing programme, but we've been more successful than other countries, including England, in delivering a whole-country testing programme. That's been recognised within the sector itself, and we certainly aim to continue that as we move into this next and very difficult phase in the pandemic.