Thank you, Delyth. I'm afraid that report on the BBC rather underestimated the scale of the effort that's gone on across Wales. I don't know if you caught a slightly later radio programme on the BBC, where I had the opportunity to put the record straight. What had been done there was a number—which was a spot-check of rough-sleepers in March, of 407—had been taken to be the number of people that had been helped through the pandemic. We did have 101 rough-sleepers at a spot-count again in August back on the streets, and one person is too many, so I'll come on to that in a minute. But actually, we have 3,533 at the last count of people who've been helped, so the scale is rather different to the BBC report. So it's nowhere a quarter, although I will say that any of them, that's a real problem.

I really do want to be able to get across to people in Wales the real scale of what's been achieved in Wales during the pandemic, by everybody who's been working in this sector. We had many more rough-sleepers than we originally thought. We always knew the spot-check was likely to be an underestimate. We always knew it didn't pick up young people or women particularly well, for example, and, as you know, it was always a rough-and-ready way of doing it over two set nights across the UK. So we always knew it was an underestimate. I think we were quite shocked at how much of an underestimate it really was. And also of course, we've picked up all the people who, whilst they're not actually on the streets, are pretty near it—so all the people who were sofa surfing, or sleeping in cars or in other very, very unsuitable places to be. So, it's not just about the absolute sharp end of rough-sleeping, it's about all of those people who are in insecure, unsuitable accommodation where they couldn't be kept safe throughout the pandemic. So, I really do pay tribute to all of the third sector organisations and local authorities, Government officials—absolutely everybody—who've worked their socks off to get as many people in as possible.

We do know that when the immediate restrictions of the lockdown were eased in the summer, people who had been experiencing homelessness before felt the liberation that quite a few of us felt to get out there into the fresh air and so on, and these are people with complex and complicated needs for support. And, so, we knew that there was a draw back onto the streets for people who hadn't yet been in support services for long enough and who perhaps were not in accommodation that was ideal for them. Necessarily, we had to house people with similar problems in particular areas, and that can be counter-productive. So, we do know that those problems exist. They continue to exist. I've never made any secret of the fact that this isn't a solution to the long-term problem.

We have, however, managed to get assertive outreach to every single person in Wales who's rough-sleeping, including the ones who'd fallen out of services temporarily over the summer. It will be really interesting to see what the next count looks like, in terms of who's in services and who isn't. In that same month, for example, in August, where the 101 count occurred, we also had near 1,000 new presentations for homelessness, all of whom were found accommodation, and we also moved on—I can't remember now—many hundreds of people into permanent accommodation out of the temporary. I can supply that figure. It's gone out of my head, just for a moment, but it's 500/600 people.

So, the throughput is really important, and, Delyth, you'll know that we've discussed many times that this is not some sort of linear progression. There's a phase 1 for people presenting as homeless and we need to sort that out for them—the temporary security that they have to be made safe and so on. And then the phase 2, which is to get those people into their permanent secure home—rapid rehousing—with all of the support mechanisms around them. So, this isn't just about walls. This is about the mental health support, substance abuse support, relationship breakdown, fleeing domestic violence—the myriad of problems that people have exacerbated by any amount of time out of permanent accommodation, of course.

So, I'm really glad to have the chance to put that record straight. We have complained to the BBC that they underestimate the problem by doing that and actually disrespect both the people involved in the system and the homeless people themselves.