2. Will the First Minister make a statement in relation to Wales’s constitutional status within the United Kingdom? OQ56293

Dirprwy Lywydd, Wales is a devolved nation, participating voluntarily in the union of the United Kingdom. 

Thanks for that statement. We are going through a very serious health crisis and now also a mass vaccination programme. The procurement of the vaccines has been led by the UK Government, and I think most sensible people would agree that it has been a great success and that the procurement of the vaccines is a good example of the UK union working at its best. The Welsh Conservatives now seem to be belatedly coming over to the benefits of the UK-led approach, even though they failed to support amendments in favour of precisely that approach that were put forward by my party, the Abolish the Welsh Assembly Party, here in this Chamber only three weeks ago, but better late than never. I wonder, First Minister, if you agree that it is perhaps time that you now stopped flying your kite about the UK becoming a federation and actually noted the very great benefits that can and did accrue from a UK-wide response to the COVID crisis. 

Well, Llywydd, I'm not responsible for the confusions of the Welsh Conservative Party, but what I am responsible for is reaching an agreement with other nations in the United Kingdom when I think it is in Wales's interests to do so. That is why we have a UK-wide procurement of supply of the vaccine, because, from the outset, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland all agreed that that was the best way forward. That is what I mean by a voluntary association in the union of the United Kingdom. 

First Minister, do you agree with me that, for the future of the union, the best resource is our citizens, and that it's time for citizens throughout the United Kingdom to be involved in citizens' assemblies to help develop proposals that will lead to a new Act of union that will see a United Kingdom coherent constitutionally, I hope, for another 300 years?

I definitely agree with Mr Melding that, in something as important as the future of the country in which we all live, the involvement of citizens in the reshaping of the United Kingdom is vital. I heard the Member being interviewed not that long ago, in which he said—and I very much agreed with him—that the current union is over. There's no point in us trying to keep something that no longer has the support it once did going in that way. We need to reshape it in the way the Member has just described, and, in order to do that, the involvement and the support of citizens is of course essential.

First Minister, do you share my despair listening to people like Gareth Bennett and some in the Conservative Party who wish for Wales to have no existence at all? They want to wipe Wales off the map, and all because they can't get elected to Government in Wales. Democracy is fine for them as long as they win. First Minister, would you join me in condemning their strong dislike of our land and continue to oppose their feeble attempts to turn our country into a county?

I absolutely agree with that, Dirprwy Lywydd. Wales is not a branch line of anybody else's Government. The Welsh Conservative policy is clear these days: it is a 'for Wales, see England' policy. It's a craven policy, Dirprwy Lywydd. It lets down the people of Wales, and my party in this Government will never put ourselves in that position.

First Minister, since being returned to the Senedd and working on various committees, including the Constitutional and Legislative Affairs Committee, my view on devolution has evolved, and I'm leaning towards a more grown-up relationship between the UK nations and a move to a more federal structure. I'm interested to know, after hearing your thoughts on the future direction for devolution, is there actually a middle ground between abolish and independence? Thank you.

Dirprwy Lywydd, I thank the Member for that question and I congratulate her on the evolution of her views. I think it's genuinely encouraging when people use the experience that they have to think through these really important issues. And of course there is: my view is there's always been a middle ground between those who wish to separate us off from the United Kingdom and those who wish to hand us back to Westminster and Whitehall, and that is the policy of devolution, which gives us so much independence of action here in the Senedd to take decisions that affect only people who live in Wales, and those decisions should be made only by people in Wales. But at the same time, when we choose to do so, to pool our voluntary association and to be part of a UK-wide set of arrangements, that, I think, is the best of both worlds for people in Wales and a position that has been supported by Welsh people now for well over 20 years.