3. Statement by the Minister for Health and Social Services: Update on COVID-19 Vaccinations

Part of the debate – in the Senedd at 3:21 pm on 23 February 2021.

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Photo of Vaughan Gething Vaughan Gething Labour 3:21, 23 February 2021

In respect of the questions about the next phase after we've completed priority groups 5 to 9, I think I've dealt with those at some length in response to both Angela Burns and Rhun ap Iorwerth, including the point about at-risk professions and people with learning disabilities that I've committed to dealing with in the very near future. I certainly hope that I will have dealt with people with learning disabilities and how that advice will be effected prior to answering questions in the Chamber tomorrow. Members will then get an opportunity to ask me questions about a choice that I hope will be made public by then.

On vaccine refusal, I think this is rather more difficult. I understand the point that the Member makes about whether people who have refused a vaccine or not had a vaccine, whether they should be prevented from going into certain patient-facing areas. This is what we get into going back into a debate about whether the vaccine is, essentially, compulsory. That would, essentially, make the vaccine compulsory for front-line members of staff in health and social care. It's an issue we're working through with not just leaders in those areas but trade unions and others about what the ethical interplay is between this, because there isn't a requirement, a legal requirement, for people to take the vaccine. We do, then, need to think through what that means and it's not a straightforward point.

It's also a broader question not just for health and care, but for a range of other professions, where if people are returning to work and social distancing isn't possible, then what does that mean? To give you an example, one of the occupational groups that has had significant mortality from COVID is chefs and kitchen workers. If you remember the time when we were able to eat out, you'd often see people in a kitchen and social distancing wasn't always possible. Yet, actually, if we get back to being able to reopen that part of hospitality, some employers will be thinking through what they're going to do if people are not going to take the vaccine.

It's a difficult question, where people will express a degree of keenness or reluctance to work with others. This is not straightforward in terms of people disclosing the form of treatment they have and haven't had, and the vaccination is very much part of it. So, I recognise the point the Member is making, but I don't think it's quite as simple as, 'You can't undertake duties unless you prove that you've had the vaccine.' I think this is a debate that we're a long way from concluding.