5. Statement by the Minister for Health and Social Services: Update on the work of the Inter-Ministerial Group on Paying for Social Care

Part of the debate – in the Senedd at 3:58 pm on 16 March 2021.

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Photo of Vaughan Gething Vaughan Gething Labour 3:58, 16 March 2021

Well, I think in my statement I've indicated that there is action that we propose to take. There is action to take, but there are challenges that you can't avoid or ignore. If we're not going to have a UK-wide answer, we need to think about the resources we have available, how we use them, and how we set out what are achievable objectives to take matters forward. Now, we've indicated the cost for the real living wage. We've indicated that we would want, as a further immediate priority, to see progress made on housing. And it's worth pointing out that I think, in the conclusion that we reached, we thought we'd need at least an extra 1,500 care facilities in Wales by 2025, against a backdrop where we delivered 500 across Wales in the last five years. So, it would be a significant scaling up to deliver improved housing options that would deliver better care, and again allow people to stay within their own homes. That would help us on the broader preventative and well-being agenda, and actually this is not something that is instead of making progress on the preventative agenda, it's not something instead of the transformation in the way that we deliver health and care. This is not something instead of moving to a genuinely sustainable healthcare system that works alongside as a proper integrated partner with social care.

And I just turn my mind back to the meeting that I had with Welsh Local Government Association social care cabinet members, and the briefing that I gave them, with WLGA officials, literally just before we then had to start to take extraordinary measures in last spring, because we were just on the cusp of publishing the national conversation documents, and I was telling them when that was likely to happen and what they could expect to see within them. And then all of that had to be paused and stopped. So, the work has been stopped. This isn't a deliberate choice of leaving this right up until the cusp of an election; it's the reality of where we are. But I was keen, as indeed were ministerial colleagues, to make sure we published and made available this information, so it's available before people make their final choices, and helps, I think, to guide whoever the next Government is, although I don't share the Member's view that that will be a Plaid Cymru Government—I think that's one of the less likely options—but let us see what the voters decide.

When it comes to the potential challenges, though, we do know that, the things that we'd like to do, there's a cost attached to each of those. So, we know that—and this comes from the work that's been done by civil servants and external advice as well—free care and support in the style of the NHS would cost about £700 million a year. Moving to all the same terms and conditions as 'Agenda for Change' will be likely to cost about £135 million in addition to that £700 million as well. So, there are big price tags to improve conditions in this area, and those conditions don't then deal with some of those other challenges we have as well. So, that's why, I think, the cross-party consensus we'll need will need to be pragmatic and honest about what's achievable, how we stage each of those improvements, and how we continue to move the dial further forward.

So, I look forward to a conversation with the public, and, indeed, however the next Senedd is made up, I look forward to being part of a conversation, and, hopefully, decision making, about how we do exactly what I think all of us would say we want to do, which is to improve the quality of care, about outcomes for people and, indeed, the way in which our staff are rewarded and recognised.