Questions now from the party spokespeople. Conservative spokesperson, Russell George. 

Diolch, Llywydd. Minister, in my new role, I would like to first of all just say congratulations on your appointment, and I hope to work constructively with you, particularly with regards to the challenges ahead, which we have to face together as a country.

My colleagues and I have very much welcomed the announcement of £1 billion to help the NHS recover from the pandemic, and the first tranche of £100 million announced for new technology and staff. It's been several months now since the publication of the Welsh Government's NHS recovery framework and we're still waiting to see where the other £900 million is due to be spent. Can you tell us today how and where this money is going to be targeted in Welsh primary and secondary care?

Well, thanks very much, and can I also congratulate Russell George once again? I think I congratulated prematurely last time. First of all, I'm sure you, like me, welcome that £1 billion extra that we are going to be putting in specifically to try and tackle the issues that have arisen as a result of the pandemic. There is, as the Member knows, a significant backlog of work that needs to be tackled, and, let's face it, we're still not out of the COVID pandemic at the moment. So, there are still some severe restrictions on our ability to get back to a normal service.

We have already announced that £100 million. That has been distributed throughout all the health boards in Wales. I have asked the health authorities now to come forward with their proposals for how they think we should be addressing the backlog. So, those proposals are being analysed by my officials at the moment. We'll be drawing up annual plans with them, and, on the back of that, we will be making a request to the finance Minister for the additional funding to be released. So, we've got to get the balance right between being very specific about what it is we're going to do, how we're going to make sure that there's a geographic coverage, but also that we're actually getting to the most difficult and clinical priority cases as soon as we can as well. So, that additional funding, I'm very keen to get spending, as you can imagine, but we have to work in partnership with the health boards and make sure we understand what their priorities are as well.

Thank you, Minister. I appreciate your answer. I suppose it's not just health authorities, but it's other health professionals that you need to work with as well, and many of those I've spoken to over the last couple of weeks just feel disappointed that they haven't yet had that funding allocated and announced. I appreciate the process that you've mentioned and outlined, but I think their concern is that as time ticks on, waiting lists continue to spiral. As I mentioned to you yesterday, Wales is now looking at a waiting list of one in three waiting over a year, compared to one in 11 in England, and this is not just COVID-19 at play here: before the pandemic, the number of those waiting over a year for treatment was triple that of the whole of England.

So, whilst I appreciate what you said, Minister—I understand, to a part, what you said—you'll obviously be aware of your predecessor's commitments as well that it would take a full parliamentary term to clear the backlog of patients. You mentioned in your first response to me that it's going take time to do this, and I think we all acknowledge and understand that. So, can you give any timescales for the NHS providers to know when they will receive this financial support, so that they can plan where to target it? I appreciate the process you've outlined, but can we have some dates potentially attached to that?

Thanks very much. Well, the process is this: the health boards put forward their annual plans, we're not expecting to receive those annual plans until the end of this week, and as soon as that's been done we'll obviously be analysing those. We'll be looking at where we think the priorities should be and then we will be making a submission to the finance Minister to see if it may be possible, perhaps, even to get it into a supplementary budget later this year, so that we can start that process of spending money. We're very aware that if we want to clear the backlog that we need to get things in place, and the best way to do that is to spend the money upfront at the beginning of the year. Also, of course, one of the things that they're anxious to know is whether this is going to be one-off funding or multi-annual funding, and that makes a big difference as to whether and to what extent they're willing to commit. So, all of those conversations are ongoing.

Thank you, Minister. I appreciate that you've given a little bit more detail about the timescale. You referred to having that information back from the health boards by, I think you said, next week. And I suppose the question then is timescales about the process of when you'll be making those commitments, bringing forward those proposals to the finance Minister, and when you believe the finance Minister will be in a position to tell the Chamber how that £900 million is going to be allocated.

I also raised concerns yesterday about the workforce, and how it's vital to have a workforce strategy to underpin the critical shortages in our NHS workforce, so we don't face burnout whilst trying to tackle the mounting treatment backlog, and I know you appreciate and agree with that concern. Now, I know in the Labour Party manifesto that you referred to 12,000 doctors, nurses and allied healthcare professionals, but what it didn't say in the manifesto, so I'm hoping you can tell us this today, it didn't give us much detail about the breakdown of who you were intending to recruit to tackle the backlog. So, I think it is critical for the very safety of patients and, of course, for legal requirements as well under the Nurse Staffing Levels (Wales) Act 2016 that we have adequate staffing on our wards, of course, as well. I know you'll agree with that.

So, can you outline today, Minister, how many doctors and nurses you will recruit, how long you believe it will take to achieve, and how much of the £900 million you will specifically be spending on recruitment? Now, I appreciate that some of this answer might relate to that information that you're waiting to receive, but if you can give us any insight into that, that would be appreciated, Minister.

Well, I'm sure the Member will be aware that the Welsh Government has already produced a workforce strategy on health, working closely with Health Education and Improvement Wales to identify where the gaps are in relation to where we really need to focus our efforts, and there's been a huge amount of work done with that organisation over recent months. On the 12,000 people that we will be recruiting in terms of training, some of that work is already in place and I'm happy to write to the Member with a further breakdown of precisely where we think those are going to be held.FootnoteLink There's a big difference—. There's no point in saying we're going to appoint x number of new doctors—if you haven't got them in the training process, it's all a bit of a waste of time. So, the first thing to happen is that you've got to get them trained and then make the financial commitment to make sure that they can be given a job at the end of that process. 

Obviously, we're very concerned about making sure that we stick to the staffing levels that we've set down in law, of course, and you will be aware that we have done a lot in this Government to ensure that we are doing all we can to produce our own local people. So, the nurse bursary, for example, is something that we kept in the Labour Party in Wales, and I'm afraid that the Westminster Parliament under, I'm afraid, your Government, the Conservative Party, decided to withdraw that support.

Information further to Plenary

The Plaid Cymru spokesperson, Rhun ap Iorwerth.

Thank you very much, Llywydd. Minister, I asked you yesterday in responding to the statement on the coronavirus update what plans were in the pipeline in order to hasten vaccination or provide surge vaccination in high-infection areas, particularly where the delta variant is a cause for concern. I don't feel that I got the response I wanted to that question, so let me put it in this way: if a health board in an area where there is concern—we're talking here about Betsti Cadwaladr University Health Board at the moment—can demonstrate that they have the capacity to do more in terms of vaccination, would you as a Government ensure that they can get an increased supply of vaccines in order to hasten the process?

Thank you very much. Of course, what we've done is given much more freedom to the health boards to have the flexibility that they need to make some of those decisions if they need to make them. We've already given consent to them if they see that they do need to increase their vaccinations and where they vaccinate, and so they have the flexibility to respond in that way. At present, there's no supply problem. I've just come from a meeting with the Minister in London who's responsible for vaccine supply, and we foresee no problem at present. So, we are confident that we are in a situation where, if the health board needs to accelerate that process—. And, of course, we're in a very extraordinary situation in Wales where nearly everyone over 18 has been offered the first vaccine, which means that we can focus on the second vaccine, which is so important to protect people from the new delta variant.

Thank you for that response. I think you're still missing the point somewhat. I'm asking not how we accelerate the second vaccination generally—things are going very well in terms of that—but how we can focus more supply in those areas where we need surge vaccination. And if that request is made by a health board, I hope that you, as a Government, can ensure additional supplies to them. The growth of the delta variant reminds us that this is a pandemic that is still very much with us. We must continue to find ways of responding to it and of protecting lives.

Now, I mentioned to you a fortnight ago the potential of investing in the use of ultraviolet-C light—UVC—in order to disinfect against COVID. I understand that the Irish Government has now agreed to provide and ensure clean air in schools in Ireland through UVC and air filtering. Here in Wales, I know that Carmarthenshire is prepared to pilot this in schools. I know also that Anglesey council are very eager to trial this—a great deal of work has been done there—but they will need the support of Government. So, will you look at approving such pilot schemes urgently, and then ensure that the funding is allocated so that we can look towards using UVC, which isn't new technology but has a new usage that has been very important in terms of the pandemic? 

Thank you very much. We've already given funding to hospitals that need more help in terms of ventilation. So, for example, in Llandough hospital, we have invested £830,000 of additional funding to help them with their systems, and, of course, it's important that we do understand the importance of ventilation. Now, as to this idea of UVC, I'm not aware that we've looked into it in any detail yet, but I'm happy to go away and look at that.

It's also important that we consider schools. Now is the time to ensure that schools open their windows and use those opportunities. Things will be very different by the winter, and who knows what situation we will be in at that time. So, it is something that is worth looking at in terms of how we're going to improve the situation, because we have to learn to live with this virus, as you said.  

I'm grateful for that positive commitment, and, for information, Anglesey is looking at introducing UVC in rooms where it's difficult to provide adequate ventilation by opening windows. 

Finally, this week is Carers Week, and I want to take this opportunity to pay tribute and to thank carers the length and breadth of Wales who work so hard quietly to care for loved ones and family members, and, through their work, ensure that the NHS can operate and, in so doing, save billions of pounds. Something carers have mentioned to me is that they want one point of contact. Carers have to speak to health boards, different departments within those boards, social services, the third sector even, and that places additional stresses upon them. Can I ask you what steps you, working with the Deputy Minister, can take in order to co-ordinate services and to create one point of contact in order to support those people who truly deserve that support?

Thank you very much, and I also want to thank carers for the extraordinary work that they do across the country, in safeguarding our elderly people, and also young people who have serious problems. I do understand that what we need to do is do everything that we can to make the lives of these carers easier. I do understand the point that having to contact a range of different institutions or organisations can make things complicated. I'm happy to have a word with the Deputy Minister to see whether there are any steps we can take in that area. I'm sure that she is far more aware of what's already available, but also to see whether we can simplify the system.