Part of the debate – in the Senedd at 5:46 pm on 11 January 2022.
Diolch yn fawr. Thank you for that interesting debate. It's really important that we focus on the detail of some of the points that Members have set out today.
On the issue of outdoor sports, I just want to make it clear that we have heard very clearly the views of people in relation to outdoor sports, and I'm sure you heard me earlier on today suggest that we will, obviously, try and dismantle those rules as soon as it is safe to do so. Clearly, as we're heading towards the peak, this is not the time to do that.
I want to focus my response, if you don't mind, on regulation 23. I think it is important that Members understand that, as a Labour Government, we are absolutely keen to make sure that we've set measures in place that protect workers within our communities. It is important that Members note that, if there is no support for this particular regulation today, then those rules that have been in place for a month now will cease to have effect from the end of today. So, tomorrow there would be no explicit requirement to support people to work from home, and there will be fewer protections for workers in Wales. I hope that Members will reflect very carefully on this before casting their vote.
To answer specifically Jane Dodds's question, that fine for employers would also be removed from tomorrow. I think it is important to note again that this was a mitigating measure that has been set out repeatedly by both SAGE and TAG, and has been a baseline measure in guidance since we've moved to alert level 0. I want to emphasise that we've heard the concerns of Members about the fines on individual employees, but I would like to note that I believe that the way to resolve this is not to defeat the regulations today—it is to allow the regulations to pass and for discussions on these matters to continue. I'd like to make a commitment that, if the regulations go through, we will discuss further whether there should be further amendments to these points.
Having a specific duty on an individual is intended to support employees. I just want to make that point. That's why we've put them in place. It provides that reference in law should there be a dispute with an employer who is making people return to the workplace when it's not necessary nor reasonable.