The Winter Fuel Support Scheme

3. Topical Questions – in the Senedd on 2 February 2022.

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Photo of Mark Isherwood Mark Isherwood Conservative

(Translated)

1. Will the Minister make a statement on the winter fuel support scheme payment? TQ594

Photo of Jane Hutt Jane Hutt Labour 3:03, 2 February 2022

Thank you very much, Mark Isherwood. The Welsh Government winter fuel support scheme payment is being doubled from £100 to £200 as the cost-of-living crisis intensifies. A written statement has been published to accompany my announcement.

Photo of Mark Isherwood Mark Isherwood Conservative

Thank you, and I read that a few moments ago. But after yesterday's Welsh Government announcement that the Welsh Government has doubled the winter fuel support scheme payment to £200 and extended the deadline to apply to 28 February, Fuel Poverty Coalition Cymru representatives contacted me as chair of the cross-party group on fuel poverty and energy efficiency, welcoming the news for those who are eligible. However, they recognise that it won't help or reach everyone in need, including those in fuel poverty not in receipt of means-tested benefits, and stated it is vital that as many eligible households receive it as possible. They therefore asked me to ask: how will the Welsh Government be using the extended deadline to boost promotion of the support available? How many of the approximately 350,000 eligible households have successfully applied to date? What proportion is this of all those estimated to be eligible overall? How does take-up compare across local authority areas in Wales, where we want to avoid any postcode lottery? And of those who've successfully applied thus far, how many and what proportion were in receipt of council tax reduction and therefore contacted directly by the council?

Age Cymru has also called for the eligibility criteria for the scheme to be extended to include older people in receipt of pension credit, where basic household bills are fast becoming unaffordable for many pensioners living on a low fixed income, and a constituent e-mailed yesterday asking me to remind the Welsh Government about the problems especially faced by those with conditions such as post-polio syndrome. How will the Minister therefore respond to these legitimate questions from relevant bodies? Again, I emphasise I'm asking this as chair of the cross-party group, not to score any party political points. 

Photo of Jane Hutt Jane Hutt Labour 3:05, 2 February 2022

Well, thank you very much, Mark Isherwood. We are in the middle of, as the Resolution Foundation calls it, a cost-of-living catastrophe, and this winter fuel support scheme was launched as part of the household support fund to target families and those who are most vulnerable in terms of the questions that are now facing many families about whether to heat or eat. We find that shocking, don't we, in this rich country we live in. So, it will go some way to supporting low-income households with rising energy bills and the increasing cost of everyday essentials. 

As for answering your questions, as of the end of January, data from 22 local authorities shows over 146,000 applications have been received, 105,785 applications have been paid, and local authorities are working hard not just to promote it; they've contacted all those they deem to be eligible. Three hundred and fifty thousand are deemed to be eligible in Wales, so we need to do all we can, and the cross-party group plays its part with its partners to promote this.

As I said, it is about supporting working-age households, and I will say this is also about not just the increasing fuel costs and food costs, but those who suffered an income shock when the UK Government ended their £20 a week uplift for universal credit, and we want it to support those households who receive one of the earnings replacement means-tested benefits that the UK refused to increase by £20 per week. 

But I will say, in terms of the representations, and particularly I've seen that from Age Cymru, I hope you as chair of the cross-party group, Mark Isherwood, and Conservative spokesperson, will be urging the UK Government to do what they should be doing in terms of increasing their winter fuel payment and also extending the eligibility for the Warm Homes discount. We've heard nothing from the UK Government. Those are the payments whereby eligible older people can get help with their energy bills and also—and I'll finish with this point, to be succinct, Llywydd—we are of course delivering a take-up campaign to ensure that older people and pensioners get the entitlements that they need and are right to receive, and that includes pension credit. You know that there is a lower take-up of pension credit than there should be. In fact, two in five people eligible for pension credit in Wales don't claim it, and those in receipt of pension credit could then get access to the Warm Homes discount.

So, we're playing our part. I won't say more now about this, but I'm sure you will be aware that the single advice fund is working across Wales with a welfare benefit take-up group, including older people's representatives. And finally, of course, older people can also apply for our discretionary assistance fund, which has been extended as well. But please can we call on the UK Government to increase their winter fuel payment and their Warm Homes discount, and also, as we face this fuel cap rise, can we get support for the social tariff for energy users?

Photo of Sioned Williams Sioned Williams Plaid Cymru 3:09, 2 February 2022

(Translated)

Thousands of households in Wales, a number corresponding to the whole of Swansea, are already having problems paying for everyday items, and, as we've heard, the increasing energy costs and tax rises are approaching, and therefore those additional costs of over £1,000 will be a step too far for those already facing social and economic disadvantage. I welcome the Government's steps to tackle the poverty and cost-of-living crisis, especially this new payment announced this week. However, problems exist in terms of delivering these measures as a result of the fact that local authorities are responsible for their implementation, and there is evidence that this is creating inconsistencies in terms of the support actually reaching families on the ground in various parts of Wales. So, what is the Government doing to ensure that the level of take-up in terms of these payments is consistent across Wales, as well as promoting the fact that they are available? And, as we face such a crisis, which will be extended, with just a few months before the lifting of the cap on energy prices, will the Government introduce a cost-of-living crisis action plan as a matter of urgency? I agree with the Minister's comments in terms of the powers in the hands of the Tory Government in Westminster, but does the Minister agree that it's up to us in Wales to safeguard our own people from this economic storm?

Photo of Jane Hutt Jane Hutt Labour 3:10, 2 February 2022

Diolch yn fawr, Sioned Williams, and thank you for highlighting the pressures on your constituents, the cost-of-living pressures that are so real and are so vivid and coming through every day in terms of reports from the Resolution Foundation, the Bevan Foundation. Local authorities are playing their role. I think the take-up, given the time we've had—. We've extended the timing for this, extended the deadline, as Mark Isherwood said, to the end of February. Payments will be issued by local authorities. I have to say that I've had some very strong support coming back from constituents with real examples of what this has meant for them. And I'll just quote one from north Wales, who said he would like me to share this with the Senedd:

'Of course, the first £100 alleviated my hard poverty for this month and will also keep me warm for at least a month and a bit. Another £100 will mean I can keep warm in March, April and up to mid May, by which time my heating will be off until at least the start of October, hopefully later.'

He was saying that he has to consume the cheapest, poorest quality food. This £200 is what we are doing as a Welsh Government to try and reach out to our constituents.

Now, as you know, following the debate that you led very recently, we are organising a round-table summit on 17 February, cross-Government, with all our partners, and it will include many of the partners in the cross-party group, in terms of tackling the cost-of-living crisis. But I will say again, not just in terms of the entitlements we've got and our discretionary assistance fund, can I also appeal to people who are off-grid in terms of oil—and I know this affects many Senedd Members here—the discretionary assistance fund is available to help with those costs in terms of access to oil as a key energy source? This is where we have got to address this. But it's not just in terms of support from us, it has to be from the UK Government as well, who are silent on this—silent—when we see these energy price costs rising. But also to say that this is a real opportunity for the UK Government to show that they are actually dealing with the cost-of-living crisis, which is affecting people so adversely and cruelly at this time.

Photo of Jenny Rathbone Jenny Rathbone Labour 3:12, 2 February 2022

Thank you very much. I appreciate all the work that the Welsh Government is doing to try to ensure that everybody is taking up the benefits they're entitled to. But, as you said earlier, mainly, the levers are with the UK Government. And I appreciate it must be very difficult to get anybody to answer the phone when the UK Government is in the grip of a leadership crisis, but I wondered if you could put to them the point that other European countries are all taking action to use Government taxes to reduce the cost of energy bills. So, the Dutch Cabinet has cut energy taxes and put more money into insulation; in France, they're putting pressure on EDF, which is state owned, to reduce the cost to French households; in Spain, there's a windfall tax on utilities; in Germany, they're cutting the green energy scheme; in Italy, the same; and, in Sweden, nearly £500 million equivalent, as well as Norway. So, is there any possibility that we can get anything out of the UK Government about changing the way in which we collect the green taxes so that they are part of the mainstream income tax collection, or indeed a windfall tax—either way—so that it doesn't fall on those who are most deeply affected by this huge rise in energy prices?

Photo of Jane Hutt Jane Hutt Labour 3:14, 2 February 2022

Thank you very much, Jenny Rathbone. You will know from the work that you're doing as Chair of the Equality and Social Justice Committee that the Minister for Climate Change, Julie James, and I wrote to the Secretary of State for Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy way back in early January. I shared that letter with Senedd Members. So, many calls, some of which I've mentioned already in terms of winter fuel payments, the Warm Homes discount scheme, but also looking at the ways in which they could—. And saying that they should take those green and social policy costs out of people's household bills and into general taxation. It's great that you've quoted all those other countries that are actually taking action to both support people who are in fuel poverty and facing deeper crisis, but also that they're recognising that they've got to fund this through general taxation. And, of course, in terms of a windfall tax, there are calls for value added tax holidays, et cetera. But, we have made these points.

We've put these points to the UK Government and this is an opportunity now for us to unite, I hope, in this Senedd to make sure that they play their part. They have the levers. You've heard National Energy Action. They make it clear that this is where we expect the UK Government to respond and ensure that they support people who are falling deeper and deeper into poverty in terms of cost of living, and also they do it the right way in terms of a social energy tariff as well.

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