Part of the debate – in the Senedd at 5:15 pm on 15 February 2022.
Diolch, Llywydd. If I respond first of all to the comments of the Chair of the Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee, and also to inform him—. I'm sure that Members are aware that, of course, within these particular clauses 114 and 115—and, of course, the reference to clause 16—there is no support in any of the devolved Governments for these particular clauses, and the same concerns and observations have actually been made in that respect. And the point that you make also in terms of the scrutiny aspect, I think, is absolutely right. It is a concern. It is an issue that arises when we deal with legislation in this particular way. You make valid points in respect of the Henry VIII powers, and you are right also that there have been very extensive—and on this and on many others—incredibly tortuous negotiations that go through clause by clause. It's important to understand the actual scale of those discussions and negotiations that take place.
It is, of course, of concern that, when you have those issues that are raised and negotiations take place, and when one of the parties refused to give any evidential base for the position they're taking—that does, of course, cause considerable concern. You're right, of course, that clause 16 is effectively anomalous in some ways, and the point that you make about the assurances are I think, again, valid. This is, of course, an LCM where we are recommending rejection, or not granting consent.
If I can just take us further on to the—