The next item, therefore, is the debate on the police settlement 2022-23. I call on the Minister for finance to move this motion—Rebecca Evans.

Motion NDM7916 Lesley Griffiths

To propose that the Senedd, under Section 84H of the Local Government Finance Act 1988, approves the Local Government Finance Report (No. 2) 2022-23 (Final Settlement - Police and Crime Commissioners), which was laid in the Table Office on 2 February 2022.

Motion moved.

Diolch, Llywydd. Today I'm presenting to this Senedd, for its approval, details of the Welsh Government's contribution to the core revenue funding for the four police and crime commissioners in Wales for 2022-23. First, and particularly given the events of the past two years, I'd like to record my gratitude to the police for the role they've played in keep our communities safe whilst maintaining the highest standards of duty and dedication.

The core funding for the police in Wales is delivered through a three-way arrangement involving the Home Office, the Welsh Government and council tax. As policing policy and operational matters are non-devolved, the overall funding picture is determined and driven by Home Office decisions. We have maintained the established approach to setting and distributing the Welsh Government component based on the principle of ensuring consistency and fairness across England and Wales.

There are three technical and administrative changes to the funding arrangements this year. These result largely from Home Office decisions and have minimal practical implications for PCCs in Wales. Since the 2015 comprehensive spending review, the Home Office has made an annual transfer of funding to the Welsh Government in order for us to deliver our agreed contribution to police funding. From 2022-23 onwards, this transfer will end and the funding will be delivered by the Home Office through the police grant and top-up grant. This will result in the Welsh Government contribution to policing reducing by just under £30 million to £113.5 million, although there is no impact on the overall level of funding for police forces as a result.

Secondly, in order to facilitate a smoother transition towards partial non-domestic rates retention for city and growth deal regions, a technical adjustment has been made to the composition of the Welsh Government's contribution to police funding. This amendment sees the proportion of NDR that police forces receive reducing from 5 per cent to 0.1 per cent, with the revenue support grant increasing to offset this reduction. Again, this is a technical change that will not result in any loss of funding for any police force.

Finally, the Home Office has taken the decision to transfer funding for special branch to transfer funding for special branch out of the police main grant to the counter-terrorism policing grant in line with the 2021-22 budget. As the total amount being transferred is based on forces' 2021-22 budget, and will remain at that level for 2022-23, the transfer will have a zero net impact for police forces.

As outlined in my announcement of 2 February, the total unhypothecated revenue support for the police service in Wales for 2022-23 stands at £432 million before the adjustment made for the special branch transfer. The Welsh Government's contribution to this amount is £113.5 million, and it is this spending that you're being asked to approve today. As in previous years, the Home Office has overlaid its needs-based formula with a floor mechanism. This means that, for 2022-23, PCCs across England and Wales will all receive an increase in funding of 5.9 per cent when compared with 2021-22 before the adjustment made for the special branch transfer. The Home Office will provide top-up grant totalling £62.9 million to ensure all four Welsh police forces meet the floor level.

The motion for today's debate is to agree the local government finance report for PCCs, which has been laid before the Senedd. If approved, this will allow the commissioners to confirm their budgets for the next financial year, and I ask Senedd Members to support this motion. Diolch.

As we've heard, funding for the four Welsh police forces is delivered through a three-way arrangement involving Home Office, Welsh Government and council tax, with the Home Office operating a common needs-based formula to distribute funding across Welsh and English police forces, and a Welsh Government component based on consistency across Wales and England. Police budget cuts to 2014 were first announced in Labour's March 2010 UK budget statement, which stated that the scale of the deficit meant that the UK didn't have enough money. I think that was Mr Darling's quote.

Since 2015, the UK Government has raised its contribution to overall police funding in line with inflation, and, since 2019, the UK Government's announced the investment of over £1.1 billion to increase police officer numbers and provide forces with resources to tackle crime. The UK Government has now announced an overall £1.1 billion police funding increase compared to the 2021-22 funding settlement, bringing the total up to £16.9 billion, and confirmed three-year total grant funding for our police forces. This provides an extra £540 million by 2024-25 to recruit the final 8,000 police officers to meet the UK Government's commitment of 20,000 additional officers across Wales and England by 2023. All forces are receiving a 5.9 per cent core funding increase, and overall the funding package for Wales and England represents a 7 per cent cash increase on last year, with north Wales, for example, receiving an 8.4 per cent increase. Wales has also benefited from other UK Government programmes, with North Wales Police, for example, receiving over £0.5 million from the UK Government's safer streets and safety of women at night funds.

Funding to police and crime commissioners will increase by up to an additional £796 million, assuming full take-up of council tax precept flexibility, with council tax increasing in Wales this year by 5.5 per cent in south Wales and Gwent, 5.3 per cent in Dyfed-Powys, and 5.14 per cent in north Wales. Across Wales, this equates to a band E property paying below 30 per cent extra a week.

According to the crime survey for England and Wales, the best indicator of long-term trends in crime, overall annual crime increased 14 per cent, but this included a 47 per cent increase in fraud and computer misuse, and crime excluding this decreased by 14 per cent, largely driven by an 18 per cent decrease in theft offences. Further overall crime rates in Wales, as we know, are fairly low compared with the rest of the UK on average.

As I learned when I visited Titan, the north-west regional organised crime unit, an estimated 95 per cent or more of crime in north Wales operates on a cross-border east-west basis, and almost none on an all-Wales basis. North Wales Police therefore collaborates with five north-west England police forces to tackle serious organised crime. Devolution of policing would therefore be operational insanity and financial lunacy. Diolch yn fawr.

May I also echo the Minister's thanks to the police for the work that they have done and do, particularly during the very challenging circumstances over the past year or two? We won't be opposing the motion before us today, but I do have a few comments to make, mainly around the fact that we do feel that the formula doesn't deliver for Wales as it should. The formula, for example, discriminates against council tax payers in Wales. In some areas, like north Wales, it's local taxpayers who fund 50 per cent of the police budget, but that compares with only 30 per cent in some areas such as the west midlands and Northumbria, where local taxpayers contribute only 30 per cent of those costs. So, there are questions about an imbalance or an unfairness in that regard.

The Home Office doesn't, either, provide any additional funding to police Cardiff as a capital city. We know that it attracts major national and international events, and that brings additional financial pressures, but there is nothing provided from the Home Office to cover those costs, although provision is made for London, although provision is made for Edinburgh, and provision is also made for Belfast. So, again, there is a disparity there in terms of how we are funded here in Wales. 

I would strongly argue, too, that the funding formula doesn't sufficiently recognise the specific challenges posed in policing rural communities. We regularly hear in this Chamber the concerns around theft from farms in rural areas, we hear about attacks by dogs on livestock, and those unique challenges in that rural context aren't sufficiently recognised, in our view. So, we do need to look at the formula, and it would be good to hear some support from the Welsh Government for that in responding to this debate. 

Now, over and above the formula and this funding, of course, we mustn't simply look at this settlement in isolation. 

We mustn't look at it in isolation. We need to look, of course, more broadly beyond the settlement at the wider role that Welsh Government has in tackling some of the root causes of crime, and the core budgets from Welsh Government really need to make sure that we do provide sufficiently for youth services, for substance misuse programmes, and for better career pathways for those who might be susceptible to certain issues around breaking the law, and making sure that people have the prospects and the support that they need to make the best that they can from the opportunities that are available.

We need to make sure that, of course, we see this in the round. And, I'd argue, obviously, that devolving policing to Wales would be a positive step to help address many of these issues. It's the only emergency service that isn't devolved, and of course it is devolved in other parts of the United Kingdom. So, it would be much more pragmatic and logical to devolve the justice system and policing to Wales so that we can be afforded the same advantages that are enjoyed by other parts of the United Kingdom. Diolch.  

I would very much like to welcome this afternoon's debate, particularly as it gives us an opportunity to recognise the steps that the UK Government has taken to protect our communities and make our neighbourhoods safer. Indeed, in my own constituency of Carmarthen West and South Pembrokeshire, I have seen first hand how important this funding is to our local communities. The UK Government has committed an extra 60 policy officers to the streets of Dyfed-Powys, and, from speaking to local officers on the force, I know just how valuable the 60 extra police officers will be in helping to tackle crime and anti-social behaviour across my constituency and those of my colleagues represented by Dyfed-Powys Police.

However, I do wish to use this opportunity to draw Members' attention to the scourge of rural crime, and in particular the role of Wales's rural and wildlife crime co-ordinator, Rob Taylor. Rob is currently seven months into a 12-month position, which is funded by the Welsh Government. And Members will be aware that I have raised this position in the Siambr before, numerous times. Crime in the countryside causes serious distress to our rural communities, from agricultural vehicle thefts and sheep worrying to the vandalism of wildlife nesting, rural crime has often gone underreported while its victims continue to feel its terrible effects and impacts. Having worked with Rob and witnessed first hand his infectious passion and determination, it is clear that he will leave no stone unturned in his fight to slash rural crime.

I recently invited Rob to my own constituency to meet local farmers as part of a breakfast event to discuss his work and priorities. Local farmers were able to quiz Rob and ask the probing questions. The farmers were also able to meet their local rural crime police officers. However, I and those attending the event were disappointed to learn that Rob has yet to receive a firm commitment from the Welsh Government that the funding for his role will surpass the original one-year term, bringing into doubt the ability for Rob to complete his work and really make that material impact. I'm sure you will agree with me that if we are to get buy-in from Welsh police forces, it is vital that we make this role a permanent position, thus removing the uncertainty that surrounds the need to bid for funding year on year. 

Would you take an intervention? 

I'll happily take an intervention.

I'm just wondering whether you feel that if the police were properly funded by the UK Government, then the Welsh Government wouldn't need to bail them out and provide that? 

Well, this is the point that I was going to come on to. One suggestion that has been offered to me by local police officers in Dyfed-Powys Police is that the rural crime commissioners themselves, or the police and crime commissioners themselves, are able to contribute to the funding of this position to secure its long-term future. And that's something that I would like to explore—seeing the four police and crime commissioners of Wales coming together, working together to support Rob in his work and that future funding. 

Therefore, in conclusion, Llywydd, I would like to ask and be interested to learn if the Minister has  had any discussions with the UK Government or her Cabinet colleagues to secure the long-term future of this important position. Diolch. 

I call on the Minister for Finance now to reply to the debate—Rebecca Evans. 

Diolch, Llywydd, and I thank Members for their interest and their contributions today, and it's very clear the respect that we all have for the work of the police and what they do in our communities across Wales, clearly being an absolutely key part of our public service family, working with health boards, local councils and other partners. 

I'll respond to some of the specific points relating to the motion in front of us today. First of all, the point was raised in terms of the devolution of policing. Of course, Welsh Government made clear our support for policing to be devolved. It is the only emergency service that isn't devolved, and I think that remedying this would enable stronger joint working with the other emergency services in Wales. And it would also enable future legislation affecting policing and community safety in Wales to be properly tailored to our Welsh circumstance, and it would be a safeguard against legislative changes being made that the Senedd does not agree with. 

The point about a review of the formula is very important, and there is currently a review of that formula in progress, with UK Government Ministers having confirmed their intention to complete this work before the next general election. The Home Office does recognise that the current police funding formula is out of date and no longer accurately reflects the demands on policing, and it is committed to introducing a new formula that fairly and transparently distributes the core grant funding to the 43 police forces in England and Wales. So, there's a technical phase of the review that's now under way, and that will deliver proposals for new funding arrangements, and a senior sector group and technical reference group has been convened with representation from the policing sector and relevant experts to lead on the development of the formula. The Home Office will work closely with the sector throughout the review, and any proposals will obviously be subject to a full consultation. But it's important to us that the views of this Senedd and the Welsh Government are taken to the heart of that review. 

We do continue to work with the police to identify and take forward any opportunities that we see here in Wales, as identified by our commitment to increasing our 500 community support officers to 600 officers. And we continue to make clear our support for policing to be devolved, as I said, so that we can deliver against the needs, priorities and values of Wales.  

Will the Minister take an intervention? 

Yes, of course.

I appreciate that, Minister, and I welcome the Welsh Government's work to support additional PCSOs. But do you agree with me it's a bit rich for the Welsh Conservative benches to be claiming that Welsh Government is not doing enough, when Prime Minister Johnson came to Deeside in 2019 and promised 96 additional officers for Deeside, and we've received none?  

Absolutely. I think that Jack Sargeant said it very well in terms of how you can't just have it both ways. You can't call for Welsh Government to be doing more in the area of policing and oppose the devolution of policing whilst at the same time not delivering on UK Government promises for policing in our Welsh communities.

While the settlement does, on the face of it, seem to be a good one, I think it's fair to say that some police and crime commissioners have expressed concern that when you take into account the national insurance contribution increases, and the final phase of the UK Government's police uplift programme, essentially they are looking at a cash-flat settlement. Of course, this is a matter for the Home Office. Nevertheless, we are committed to—[Interruption.] Yes, I'll take the intervention.

Would you recognise, in terms of the extra officers, that the promised number is on track to be met by 2023, that Wales has had its full share of that, and that where police forces place those officers is an operational matter for those forces? 

The Welsh Government absolutely wants Wales to have its fair share of additional officers, but let's consider what 'additional' means in this sense. The police force across England and Wales has been decimated in numbers throughout the period of austerity, so the UK Government is only seeking to make good on some of the decreasing numbers of police officers that we have seen over the years anyway. And our communities have felt their loss as well.

I will move on to just completing my contribution today, Llywydd—just reiterating our commitment to working with PCCs and chief constables, to ensure that any changes are managed in ways that limit the impact on community safety and front-line policing in Wales.

The final element of police funding, of course, is raised through the council tax precept. Unlike in England, we have retained the freedom for our Welsh PCCs to make their own decisions about council tax increases. Setting the precept is a key part of the PCCs' role, which demonstrates accountability to the local electorate. I know that in a period of increasing pressure on local households, commissioners will be considering this carefully. Llywydd, I commend this settlement to the Senedd. 

The proposal now, therefore, is to agree the motion. Does any Member object? Any objection? No, I don't see any objection. Therefore, the motion is agreed in accordance with Standing Order 12.36.

Motion agreed in accordance with Standing Order 12.36.

We will now take a short break to prepare for voting time this evening. So, a short break.

Plenary was suspended at 18:17.

The Senedd reconvened at 18:21, with the Llywydd in the Chair.