2. Business Statement and Announcement

– in the Senedd at 2:35 pm on 8 March 2022.

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Photo of Elin Jones Elin Jones Plaid Cymru 2:35, 8 March 2022

(Translated)

The next item is the business statement and announcement. I call on the Trefnydd to make that statement, Lesley Griffiths.

Photo of Lesley Griffiths Lesley Griffiths Labour

Diolch, Llywydd. There is one change to this week's business: a motion to suspend Standing Orders is required to enable us to debate the LCM on the Commercial Rent (Coronavirus) Bill. Draft business for the next three weeks is set out in the business statement and announcement, which can be found amongst the meeting papers, available to Members electronically.

Photo of Andrew RT Davies Andrew RT Davies Conservative 2:36, 8 March 2022

Minister, you will have heard the exchanges that the First Minister and I had in relation to food security. I'm obviously questioning you today as leader of the house, but, obviously, you wear the other hat of rural affairs Minister, and you are the sponsoring Minister for the agricultural Bill that you will be bringing in in April, I believe. I cannot overstate the dilemma that we face with what is going on in Ukraine. We've heard about the refugee crisis, we see the brutality of the scenes on tv, every night, every morning, every waking hour, really. But coming down the tracks at us in the next two, three, four months, and indeed, two, three, four years, is this issue of the complete destabilisation of that region and its ability to produce food, not just for this part of Europe but for the world. It has changed the fundamental gravity, I would suggest, of where this Bill needs to sit in our food security requirements. As I've said, wheat has doubled in price, and going forward on the futures market, for November, it will be far higher than even today—it might be over £300 a tonne. Other commodities are going north when it comes to food production as well, as well as the fertilisers, herbicides and pesticides that are required to grow these crops. A farmer can only make that decision once in a year, and if that decision isn't made then, then that year is lost, and it takes two years to catch up.

Could we have a statement on what your officials and, in particular, you as Minister believe are the actions that the Welsh Government now need to take to reactivate the mentality within the Welsh agricultural community to grow for food security? Because I know they're up for that challenge and they want to play their part, albeit, and I acknowledge, the relatively small agricultural land base that we have in Wales. But there is an opportunity here that we need to grasp and make sure that we play our part in making sure that, whilst Ukraine remains destabilised, we are doing our bit to feed the nation and feed the world.

Photo of Lesley Griffiths Lesley Griffiths Labour 2:38, 8 March 2022

Thank you very much. I don't disagree with anything that you said about the heartbreaking situation unfolding in Ukraine. You will have heard the First Minister say that I have asked for food security to be put on the inter-ministerial group agenda when we meet a week on Monday. Because, obviously, food security has to be integral across the UK—we all have to work together around that. And you're quite right about wheat prices. I will be meeting with the National Farmers Union and the Farmers Union of Wales on Monday—part of my regular meetings—and, obviously, that's something that we will continue to discuss.

In relation to the specific points you make about the agricultural Bill, I think, again, the First Minister referred to a lot of things that have changed since we had the White Paper in the last term of Government, which, obviously, will then feed into the agricultural Bill. So, these are all things that my officials are looking at, including the cumulative impact of the trade deals that the UK Government have brought forward.

Photo of Delyth Jewell Delyth Jewell Plaid Cymru 2:39, 8 March 2022

Trefnydd, I'd like a statement, please, outlining the Welsh Government's justification for going ahead with spending £1.4 billion to dual 11 miles of road on the A465. The Western Mail expressed the view yesterday that this hugely expensive project was no longer justifiable, given the rationale behind the decision to cancel two less-carbon-intensive projects in the north. Now, I note that the Government hasn't denied that pressing ahead with the project does contradict its climate change policies, but you'll know that I've been raising concerns for some years now about the funding of the project, because it will lock future decades into a debt that they'll have to pay back. The Western Mail has questioned if contractual obligations are the reason that the project perhaps can't be cancelled, and, as we're talking about such a huge sum of money, not just now, but for decades to come, I would ask for an oral statement, please, to help us determine why this vastly expensive project is going ahead.

Photo of Lesley Griffiths Lesley Griffiths Labour 2:40, 8 March 2022

Thank you. You will be aware of the significant work that's been undertaken in relation to road reviews, both in south Wales and, now, north Wales, with the Deputy Minister for Climate Change recently announcing the chair for the north Wales road review. So, I would think it's probably more beneficial to bring forward a statement when we've got the pan-Wales approach, rather than at the current time about one road.

Photo of Huw Irranca-Davies Huw Irranca-Davies Labour

Could I ask for one statement and one debate? The statement is one I know that the Trefnydd will be familiar with in her departmental role as well. Back in autumn 2019—. Sorry, I do declare my interest as the Atlantic salmon champion for the Senedd. [Laughter.] But in autumn 2019, the salmon and sea trout plan for action was introduced. It had a series of actions that flowed from it. I suspect that some of them may have been hit by recent factors, including the pandemic and the ability to get out there and monitor and evaluate on the ground. So, it would be good to have an update through a statement on the floor of the Senedd on the actions and the outcomes of that plan, and where we are, bearing in mind that it was brought forward, and I quote, recognising, 

'the serious declines...in early-running "spring salmon" and now...all sea age components of salmon and, more recently, sea trout', as well. The health of those migratory fish stocks is an indicator of the health not only of our rivers, but also of our marine environment around the UK and globally as well. So, I'd welcome a statement.

It would also be an opportunity to test the views of people, here within this Chamber, on the issue of the cage farming of salmon. Major questions have been raised over the sustainability of this, and it is not only a question for Scotland; it's wherever this takes place. Because there is the issue of parasites and the effects of parasites on wild salmon and migrating salmon, the issue of pesticides discharged from caged salmon and the effect on wild salmon and other wild species, and also of protein foodstuff—the scandal that we have recently heard of 460,000 tons of wild fish being harvested to feed caged farm salmon. Heaven help us with what's going on there and the question of sustainability around this, and we need assurance that this is never going to be seen in Wales in the warmer waters that we have here. 

I'd also like to seek a debate, if I could—

Photo of Elin Jones Elin Jones Plaid Cymru 2:42, 8 March 2022

I think you've spent two minutes calling for your first statement. I think you'll have to wait until next week to call for your debate.

Photo of Huw Irranca-Davies Huw Irranca-Davies Labour

My apologies. I'll wait until next week. [Laughter.]

Photo of Elin Jones Elin Jones Plaid Cymru

James Evans. No, Minister to respond. Yes, sorry, I forgot about that bit of it. [Laughter.]

Photo of Lesley Griffiths Lesley Griffiths Labour

I'll be slightly more succinct. So, the first thing to say, and I'm really pleased to be able to say this and to reassure not just Huw Irranca-Davies, the Atlantic salmon champion, but all Members, that this type of industrial fishing does not take place in Welsh waters. We don't have industrial fin fish aquaculture here in Wales either, but I will—. You heard me say, in an earlier answer to the leader of the opposition, that we've got an IMG DEFRA meeting a week on Monday, so I will raise it with the other administrations at that time.

Photo of James Evans James Evans Conservative 2:43, 8 March 2022

What the Minister said, Huw.

Minister, can I ask for a statement, please, on why Welsh Government are removing the rural broadband scheme top-up? This is vitally important for rural communities in getting superfast broadband right across our communities, and I'd like to know exactly what that scheme is going to be replaced with, because I do worry that some of our communities will be left behind, if that top-up isn't available, which makes a lot of these schemes viable. Thank you. 

Photo of Lesley Griffiths Lesley Griffiths Labour 2:44, 8 March 2022

Well, you will have heard the First Minister say, in an earlier answer around broadband, that actually it's the responsibility of the UK Government. So, maybe, if they'd have kept to their promise of 'not a penny less' we would have had more money to continue with that rural broadband scheme.

Photo of Luke Fletcher Luke Fletcher Plaid Cymru

I wish to call for two statements, and I'll try and keep it within two minutes. 

Photo of Elin Jones Elin Jones Plaid Cymru

No, one minute, actually.

Photo of Luke Fletcher Luke Fletcher Plaid Cymru

One minute, then. [Laughter.]

Photo of Elin Jones Elin Jones Plaid Cymru

I was far too lenient.

Photo of Luke Fletcher Luke Fletcher Plaid Cymru

Firstly, I would like to ask for a statement from the Deputy Minister for Mental Health and Well-being on residential mental health facilities in Wales. I've recently been contacted by a constituent who is under the care of a mental health team in south Wales who, due to lack of local facilities, was referred to a residential unit based in London. After a resident at that unit tested positive for COVID, she was sent home after only 10 days of treatment. As you can imagine, this has been a very stressful experience for someone who had to travel so far for the treatment they needed. So, I would appreciate if the Deputy Minister could provide an update as to whether there are any developments in providing suitable residential mental health facilities in Wales.

Secondly, I would appreciate a statement from the Minister for Finance and Local Government on recent claims that councillors on Bridgend County Borough Council were threatened by statutory officers with breaching the code of conduct if they were to vote down a recent budget proposal. As we all know, elected members, whether it be to Westminster, council chambers across Wales or to this very Senedd, are all elected to act in the best interests of their constituents. Therefore, I would appreciate it if the Minister could offer some clarity on the situation and confirm whether any investigation into these claims will be taking place so that we can get to the bottom of the issue.

Photo of Lesley Griffiths Lesley Griffiths Labour 2:45, 8 March 2022

Thank you. In relation to your first point, around suitable residential placements for people suffering with mental health issues, I will ask the Deputy Minister for mental health to bring forward a written statement.

The Minister for Finance and Local Government has heard your request. I'm not aware of the situation that you spoke about, and I'm sure, if the Minister does have anything further to say, she'll write to you.

Photo of Janet Finch-Saunders Janet Finch-Saunders Conservative 2:46, 8 March 2022

Trefnydd, I was just wondering, given the awful situation in Ukraine, as another sign of our solidarity, whether you do have on site within the Welsh Government offices and things a book of remembrance where staff and Members or Ministers can send their thoughts across. I have also raised this with the Llywydd and had a positive response, but I just wondered whether any books have yet been placed in any of the Welsh Government buildings. 

Photo of Elin Jones Elin Jones Plaid Cymru

Before the Minister responds, I think you've put words in my mouth there. My response to you was to say that I would want us as a Senedd to think about our actions rather than our words, and that I was investigating whether it would be possible for us to set up a collection point for money to be given in support of those suffering in Ukraine. I very much believe, and I hope I reflect the Chamber on this, that it is our actions not our words that are most important at this point. I'm sorry if my message to you didn't get to you in time for you to have raised that, but I didn't want my words to be misinterpreted in any way.

Photo of Elin Jones Elin Jones Plaid Cymru

No, this is not a—. This is not—.

Photo of Janet Finch-Saunders Janet Finch-Saunders Conservative

Just for clarity, are you saying we cannot have a book here, then?

Photo of Elin Jones Elin Jones Plaid Cymru

I've said actions not words, yes, and there will be a collection point. I'm very, very sorry, Janet, that you've chosen to raise this in this most inappropriate way at this point. The Minister, to respond.

Photo of Lesley Griffiths Lesley Griffiths Labour

So, I would think that this is more of a matter for the Senedd Commission rather than Welsh Government. But I absolutely agree with what the Llywydd has said—I think it's really important that our actions speak far louder than words.

Photo of Peredur Owen Griffiths Peredur Owen Griffiths Plaid Cymru

I'd like to request a Government statement on day-care provision for disabled people during the pandemic. I raise this with you again because there seems to be a big contrast between what is provided, with some local authorities, such as Gwynedd and Blaenau Gwent, retaining day-care centre provision for the most profoundly disabled, and other local authorities, such as Caerphilly County Borough Council, have slashed provision, leaving many parents and carers of disabled people with little or no respite. It seems that local authority interpretation of Government COVID regulations and guidance has led to a postcode lottery whereby somebody profoundly disabled in Crumlin, for instance, which is in Caerphilly County Borough Council area, would not receive day-care centre provision, whereas somebody living in Sofrydd, a few yards away in Blaenau Gwent, would. I've raised this matter a number of times in this Siambr since my election. I was hoping that, with things opening up and this Government's commitment to the importance of day-care centres, we would see some change in disabled day-care provision, but that hasn't happened in many parts of the country yet. Can the Government look at this as a matter of urgency? I don't think it's good enough just to say that it's a matter for local authorities.

Photo of Lesley Griffiths Lesley Griffiths Labour 2:49, 8 March 2022

Well, it might not be good enough, but it is a fact that provision of services for the people to whom you refer is a matter for each local authority. I think the Welsh Government's guidance is very clear in this area and it is up to local authorities to ensure for their local population those services are provided. Clearly, there have been issues during the COVID pandemic—I know from my own constituency—with staff who've unfortunately been off sick with COVID, et cetera. There's been a shortage of that provision. But, as you say, we are now opening up. I would hope that each local authority is able to put the importance that this absolutely requires on these services. 

Photo of Llyr Gruffydd Llyr Gruffydd Plaid Cymru 2:50, 8 March 2022

(Translated)

We are hearing now, of course, that there is humanitarian aid that is meant to go to Ukraine stuck on the UK border because of the additional red tape to export goods as a result of Brexit. Now, according to the charities affected, they say that there is additional paperwork needed because it's gifts that are being transported rather than products that will be sold on after crossing the border. You might be aware that Llyr Jones and Rhys Jones from Denbighshire are driving to Ukraine this week, but, because of the circumstances, they are being forced to cross the border to France and then they have to buy the humanitarian aid to transport it. Now, I would like to have a written statement or some kind of update from the Government to explain what you're doing to make the case to the UK Government to get to grips with this problem, because one is concerned about the fate of hundreds of thousands of items that have been given in collections—in Wrexham, in Rhug, and across Wales—that could be stuck in ports and not reaching Ukraine, where they are very much needed.

Photo of Lesley Griffiths Lesley Griffiths Labour 2:51, 8 March 2022

I think the Member raises a very important point, because there's been such an outpouring, hasn't there, from the people of Wales in relation to this horrendous situation in Ukraine. And, as you say, significant donations have been given, and I know there are many lorries going this week.

I think the Minister for Social Justice has been working with the UK Government to try and find a way forward. I mean, the Welsh Government—. We were thinking about bringing forward an oral statement today, but because, obviously, the Welsh Conservatives have got a debate tomorrow, we've decided that the Minister's response will be the appropriate place for this. So, I will make sure that she refers to the work that's been going on in answer to your question. Diolch.

Photo of Elin Jones Elin Jones Plaid Cymru

(Translated)

Thank you, Trefnydd.