The next item, therefore, is the statement by the Minister for Economy on border controls, and I call on the Minister to make his statement. Vaughan Gething.

Thank you, Llywydd. I'd like to update Members on the future of border controls in Great Britain.

Following my written statement recently on 28 April, last week, Members will recall that I made a previous statement to the Senedd in January of this year on the UK Government’s plans for documentary, identity and physical checks on goods at border control posts from 1 July this year and how we planned to implement them here in Wales. 

A very short meeting, called at short notice by the UK Government to meet with other devolved Governments, took place on 27 April. The meeting lasted no more than half an hour. At this meeting, I was informed that the further introduction of border controls would be suspended until the end of 2023 and that the UK Government would be accelerating its programme to digitise Britain’s borders. I’m disappointed to say that this is something that was not discussed beforehand at ministerial level with devolved Governments.

The Deputy Presiding Officer (David Rees) took the Chair.

The UK Government Minister for Brexit Opportunities, Jacob Rees-Mogg, stated in his written statement to the UK Parliament on 28 April that the introduction of border controls threatened to increase pressure on already hard-pressed businesses and consumers, who are dealing with the rising cost of living and increased energy prices. It also risked causing disruption at our ports and to supply chains, increasing food and commodity prices for consumers and businesses even further, at the very worst possible time.

Whilst I agree these changes will go some way to easing those pressures, I am sure the majority of Members will agree with me that the UK Government should be doing far more to deal with the cost-of-living crisis. I repeat our calls from the Welsh Government for the UK Government to bring forward practical measures without delay to support people, businesses and communities.

Deputy Llywydd, I've made it clear to UK Ministers that the Welsh Government would need time to consider the full implications of the UK Government’s very recent decision and its impact upon Wales. Specifically, we need to understand the UK Government's detailed proposals on how to treat goods from the island of Ireland. Just as importantly, we need to work together on how to ensure biosecurity. We know, of course, of the dreadful consequences of an outbreak of animal or plant disease. 

In addition, the Welsh Government needs urgent sight of draft legislation that the UK Government plan to bring forward, which must come into force before 30 June. This is key to determining whether we will need to introduce our own legislation for Wales, and there is now very little time left in order to do so. I call again on the UK Government to work with us urgently to end this uncertainty. This is essential for the Welsh Government and this Senedd to discharge our responsibilities in line with our established democratic procedures.

Until we understand more detailed proposals, I am unable to comment on the impact of the announcement on our work programme, expenditure or other commitments for the future. I have already set out to Members that this Government believes that any expenditure on border controls, following our exit from the European Union, should be funded by the UK Treasury. If anything, this new announcement adds to the strength of our position. UK Government decisions have determined the form of our departure from the European Union. UK Government decisions continue to directly affect devolved responsibilities with cost consequences. I am afraid that we do not yet know whether this latest policy shift will affect the UK Government's existing commitment to fund the necessary costs of building border control posts. 

Dirprwy Lywydd, the last few months has been incredibly frustrating for the Welsh Government, for our ports and for Welsh businesses. I'm afraid to say that whilst we have been planning for the introduction of border controls, we've been hampered throughout due to a vacuum of information. There have been repeated postponements of joint meetings with the UK Government and the other devolved Governments in this area, whilst UK Ministers have still failed to respond to my most recent letter, from March this year.

I remind Members that the Welsh Government inherited the UK Government's policy commitment to develop inland border control posts where ports could not accommodate them, and we were getting on with the job of trying to be ready by 1 July. This has taken up hundreds of hours of civil servants' time and a great deal of ministerial time. It doesn't just involve me; it involves Ministers across the board, including, in particular, the Minister for Rural Affairs and North Wales, and, indeed, the Minister for Finance and Local Government. And we have spent £6 million of public money on this programme of work so far.

The UK Government's engagement with the devolved Governments in terms of decision making has been completely unacceptable. It is wholly at odds with the ways of working envisaged in the inter-governmental relations review and the common frameworks. Dirprwy Lywydd, this is, frankly, disrespectful to a devolved Government, and to this Senedd that needs to scrutinise us and hold us to account.

Moving forward, I do want to work collaboratively with the UK Government to ensure we have the right system in place for importing goods—a system that is safe, secure and efficient. To do that requires a genuine change in attitude and engagement. If a safe, secure and efficient import system can be achieved through harnessing innovative new technologies to streamline processes and reduce friction, then this is something that the Welsh Government can, of course, support. But equally, we will want to be assured that our long‑term strategic responsibilities to protect the health of people, animals and plants in this country are given proper and sufficient weight.

And finally, I want to apologise in advance to Members that I'm unlikely to be able to respond to requests for detailed additional information at this stage, as we simply do not know the answers to some very obvious questions. Nevertheless, it is important that Members have the opportunity to comment and to ask questions, and I will take on board the comments and questions from Members in my follow-up correspondence with the UK Government, and what I hope will be a good deal more regular and useful engagement with them. As I say, I'll be writing to UK Ministers shortly to make some of these points, and I will, of course, keep Members updated on developments.

On behalf of the Conservatives, Paul Davies.

Diolch, Dirprwy Lywydd. Can I thank the Minister for his statement this afternoon? I appreciate that the decision to introduce import control checks has been scrapped quickly and without meaningful dialogue with Governments across the UK, and so, as a result, the Welsh Government has not had a huge amount of time to really consider the implications for Wales. Nevertheless, I'm grateful to the Minister for bringing this statement forward so that Members can attempt to better understand the situation and what it means, going forward. And for the record, Dirprwy Lywydd, I believe that there should be appropriate checks at our borders, and I hope that this matter can be progressed as soon as possible by the UK Government. But as I understand it, the UK Government has decided that now is not the right time to make further changes to import control checks at the border, following a consultation with industry, in order to alleviate the increased pressure on already hard-pressed businesses and consumers. I'd be very interested to know what representations, though, were made by the Welsh Government over the last few months regarding this matter. Today's statement, of course, refers to the rising cost of living and increased energy prices, so perhaps the Minister could tell us what specific representations he has made to the UK Government ahead of its decision to scrap import control checks.

Now, as today's statement notes, the UK Government is intending to publish a target operating model in the autumn, and that model will be subject to consultation with industry and devolved administrations. This means that there is time to make representations to the UK Government about what the future system should look like and how it should operate. Therefore, perhaps the Minister could tell us what the Welsh Government believes the model should look like, and could he confirm what discussions he is holding with stakeholders in Wales about what they want to see from the new model?

The Minister will be aware that the UK Government's decision has been welcomed by some. For example, SEF Langdon's has said that the change in policy towards a smarter digital border by the UK Government will allow the free flow of safe food products into Great Britain and that the decision may lead to a return of more EU companies exporting to the GB market, increasing competition and ultimately lowering prices for the consumer. And so, I suppose that there is an opportunity right now to shape longer term policy and get this model right in a way that works with businesses and ensures a good deal for consumers too. Naturally, there have been costs incurred as a result of the work done to date to establish border control posts in Wales, most notably in Holyhead, and today's statement estimates that, to date, £6 million has already been spent. However, if import control checks are introduced at a later date and prices have increased, it may be that more costs could be incurred in the future. Therefore, can the Minister tell us the Welsh Government's approach to budgeting for this in the future, given that a decision to reintroduce them later down the line could be made just as quickly as the decision was made to scrap them?

Now, it's clear that the UK Government is looking to digitise British borders, and today's statement refers to those new technologies to streamline processes and reduce frictions. The UK Government has referred to the single trade window that will come into play next year, which centralises data entry to one point and would allow for better data sharing amongst Government agencies and lead to reduced costs of importing and exporting goods for businesses, and I'd be very interested to learn a bit more about the new technologies that are being used to ease the flow of trade. So, perhaps the Minister can share with us any additional information that he has received regarding the use of any new technologies and data, and the role that this new technology will play in the future.

The Minister has touched upon animal diseases in his statement and he will also be aware of the threat of African swine fever brought into the UK via infected stocks sourced from Europe, or travellers bringing contaminated pork products into the country. It's an issue that has been raised by the Scottish Association of Meat Wholesalers, who believe that the UK may be exposing our domestic industry, and I know that the British Veterinary Association has raised similar concerns as well. Therefore, can he tell us what discussions he's had with the Minister for rural affairs, as well as the chief veterinary officer and farming unions, about the impact of unchecked imports and how it could affect Welsh farming, as well as what their views are on any new models in the future?

And finally, Dirprwy Lywydd, it would be remiss of me not to ask about the future of sites that were being considered by the Welsh Government, given that Johnston is in my constituency. I appreciate that it's early days, but perhaps the Minister could tell us what impact the changes could have on potential sites and whether the Welsh Government will now consider alternative sites, going forward, now that it has decided to scrap the Johnston location in my constituency. Therefore, in closing, can I thank the Minister for his statement today? I do hope that a much more open and meaningful dialogue can take place between both Governments, going forward, in this area, and I look forward to hearing more about the new plans as and when they are developed. Diolch.

I thank the Member for the series of questions, which I'll try to answer as rapidly as possible. In terms of the representation the Welsh Government has made to the UK Government on the cost of living, and border policy on the cost of living, we've run through this several times in the Chamber. In direct conversation that has taken place within this Government, but also representations made to the UK Government, you'll have heard the regular calls for a windfall levy on the excess profits in privatised utilities, and much of the First Minister's questions today were taken up with the points around the cost-of-living crisis.

On borders, my frustration is that we have tried to engage with UK Ministers on the rapidly evolving situation, and we have not made progress because there has not been a willingness to engage with us, as the Member recognised in his opening, and recognised that meaningful dialogue has not taken place with devolved Governments. I've indicated that my recent letter was to the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs on 24 March, and I still haven't had the courtesy of a response.

In terms of what the future model should look like, well, we're really, in many ways, interested, with, of course, devolved responsibilities, around sanitary and phytosanitary checks—essentially, plant and animal health, and products based on them. Now, the difficulty, in terms of what the future model will look like, is that that's all been put off. We were going to have a model, we were looking to spend money on creating border control posts, and in many ways it was worse than in England, with more money having been spent on both recruiting staff and also creating physical facilities. We were due to be letting a contract to Kier construction, which I've announced publicly before, to create permanent facilities in Holyhead in spring 2023. We're now not sure if we're going to go ahead with those, because we don't have the certainty on what we're going to need to create to maintain what should be an effective and coherent system across Britain for imports. So, I can't honestly tell you what the new model will look like because we haven't had those discussions and the UK Government haven't given us a clear idea what they think a new model should look like, other than it will be technology based. That's why we can't engage in detail with stakeholders following the announcement. It's also why I can't tell you about your further question about the new technology to ease the flow of goods, and an update on it. We've only been told it will be technology, not what the technology is, not how far advanced it is, nor even how it could be procured, nor even what the cost would be for nations within the UK for a new form of system. Because, actually, we have devolved responsibilities, but there's a great deal of sense in having a common approach in each part of the UK. And it goes on to the point you made about African swine fever that I'll come to. So, we want to be collaborative, but it does require people to talk with us, to share information and for there to be genuine engagement on what a technology answer will be and how much it can do. It could speed up the flow of some goods, but, actually, there may well be limits.

And it comes to some of the points that you have made on swine fever, for example. We currently have destination checks on 5 per cent of livestock coming in. That means 19 out of 20 aren't checked at destination. There have, though, in conversation—you asked me about conversation with the chief vet and with Lesley Griffiths, in her role as Minister for rural affairs—. I had a conversation last week with Lesley Griffiths and I spoke with the chief vet this morning, and, indeed, we are aware that some of those destination checks are revealing challenges. Now, the challenge is that, actually, currently in continental Europe, there are more risks. The destination checks pick up some of those but not all of them. So, actually, from a biosecurity point of view, having checks at borders is more important because we have left the European Union. And, as the British Veterinary Association have pointed out, we now no longer have access to the early surveillance and warning system that EU member states have; they have an integrated and highly responsive surveillance system that we're not part of. And we don't then have the border control checks to try to add to our own protections now we're not part of that system—we don't have a line of sight in it. So, we actually have a worsened position in not being part of that without, then, creating the import infrastructure to provide greater protection for farming communities. I know the Member will be aware of that from his own constituency.

When it comes to challenges for import and export businesses—and not just for the farming community, but it's an obvious example, which is why the NFU have been so clear and critical on the decision—goods that come in from the European Union are not going to be subject to checks, whereas, actually, British farmers looking to export their produce will be subject to those checks. So, there's an uneven playing field that has been extended for a range of businesses, and it's understandable why the NFU have been sharply critical of the move that has taken place at very short notice.

I'll deal with your final points about border control sites. Well, Johnston is off the agenda. We've explained why that is, previously, in the statement that I've made. We will of course need to look at alternative sites, but, to do that, we need to understand what the future infrastructure is going to be. I can hardly set out and direct officials to go and look at those without there being an understanding of what future border controls are going to look like, how much physical infrastructure will be needed and where it would need to be and how close to our ports.

That also goes to your point about future costs. The UK Treasury will need to take a view on future costs. We want them to properly fund the costs of border controls that come directly from the UK  decision to introduce any form of leaving the European Union with the new checks that we are required to undertake. It is entirely likely that construction costs will rise. I'm not sure we'll need to retender for the exercise we've already undertaken, but all of these uncertainties do neatly encapsulate the challenge in a very short notice and late decision and an entirely new policy direction with an end date in mind without a clear understanding on how to get there. 

Plaid Cymru spokesperson, Rhun ap Iorwerth.

Diolch yn fawr iawn, Dirprwy Lywydd. I couldn't quite believe that I was being given that briefing by the Minister and his officials last week, and I'm very grateful for that briefing. But to be fair, I don't think the Minister could believe that he was giving the briefing on such a sudden change of heart when it came to border facilities. I happen to represent the second busiest roll-on, roll-off ferry port in the UK, a major, major Welsh exporting hub, so I've followed pretty closely the development of border infrastructure.

Even where we have seen infrastructure being set up already, with the HMRC post, it comes with new problems in its wake. Of course, new jobs are always welcome, and supporters of Brexit will hail the jobs that have been created in Holyhead at the HMRC border post, ignoring the loss of jobs, including in Holyhead, due to our departure from the European Union. I get visions of that Brexit bus when here we see again the truth about Brexit savings really becoming so clear.

The Minister mentions the £6 million spent by Government, maybe he can tell us how much has been spent by local government, which has even less resource and is having to develop port health authorities as a result of our departure from the European Union. As a result of this last-minute change of heart by UK Government, without warning, without discussion, it too has its plans up in the air and is unsure what happens next. As I was saying, even with the HMRC post, we've lost a truck stop that was such an important part of the port's infrastructure. So, we are seeing problem after problem.

We have a specific issue now, though, regarding animal health, biosecurity, and it's no wonder that farming unions and the British Veterinary Association are so strong in their condemnation of the actions of UK Government in recent days. As the Minister has made clear, our farmers are having to go through checks on exports. This is not a level playing field. I wonder if the Minister can tell us what discussions are already taking place on supporting our farmers now that the uneven playing field has become even more uneven.

We have now lost the protection that came from being part of those very, very tight European surveillance systems on biosecurity. Gaps were going to be filled by the new checks that were going to be introduced. I wonder if the Minister can tell us now what precautionary measures will need to be put in place immediately now that we are falling between two stools, neither the European surveillance systems that we were a part of before or the new checks that were going to be put in place due to these new border posts. I realise the Minister is unable to give precise answers, perhaps, at this point, but I urge him to seek answers as quickly as possible.

In closing, I would like to offer my complete support to the Minister, as he strives to persuade UK Government to give Wales, the people of Wales, the ports of Wales and the farmers and those interested in biosecurity the respect that they deserve, because, once more, we have seen a distinct lack of respect in the actions of UK Government in recent days.

Thank you for the comments and the questions. I'll again try to deal with all of them.

On council spend, I've given an undertaking, following discussions with ministerial colleagues, to both councils, Pembrokeshire and the Isle of Anglesey County Council, that the cost for recruitment that they were undertaking would be covered. A handful of job offers have been made on Ynys Môn, and so we'll make sure that those costs aren't passed on to council tax payers. Recruitment will be paused given the new choice that's been made. If the import controls aren't coming in, it's difficult to justify then going ahead and recruiting. So, again, that's a bigger problem for DEFRA in England, where they have recruited substantially more people. It's also a challenge for HMRC, given the people they had previously recruited and have been redeployed as well.

When it comes to the challenges around exporting businesses, not just farming but a range of others where you do know that it is not a level playing field, it's one thing to tolerate that for a period of time, and to now have it extended for nearly two years it's very easy to understand why people are upset. And, indeed, port organisations in England in particular that have spent lots of their own money, not just public money, on getting ready for checks are now unhappy that they've spent that money and that may well be passed on to people using those port facilities as well.

When we think about the way that trade flows across the island of Ireland, from Wales and across the land bridge and into continental Europe, you can see that this is a consequence that goes beyond Wales as well. That also, though, highlights the points that you make about biosecurity, about the fact that once plants and livestock are in the UK, regardless of where they have come from, they will likely travel to other parts too. Goats that may come in from continental Europe won't necessarily stay in the south-east of England. So, that's why the destination checks are a real issue.

And there's a cost point here as well. There's the point about biosecurity and about whether it is more sensible to undertake those checks at the point of import rather than at destination. I've already indicated to Paul Davies that my understanding is that about 5 per cent of those are checked at destination, so it's a sample, not every single one. It's also much more expensive to run that system as well because you need more vets going around, and greater inconvenience to go around and check at point of destination rather than being able to do that in a way that would be easier to manage for port authorities at one particular place. There's also, of course, the very practical reason that we don't have a surplus of vets. So, having enough vets to actually staff the system properly—. And I do know a thing or two about veterinary medicine, given that my father was a vet for a long period of time as well. So, I understand there's a very practical issue here about running a system effectively to deal with biosecurity and then having the people to do it effectively as well.

Now, those are all issues that I've discussed with Lesley Griffiths and with our chief vet, and we've given a steer that we want chief vets to have a conversation to try to give us some form of understanding about what a next-level risk-based system would look like—the best system possible given where we are. But, actually, our bigger concern is about the future of technology in this. My understanding is that livestock is notoriously uncooperative when it comes to answering questions about whether it's got an infectious disease. So, actually, you're going to need to undertake some form of physical check. I've yet to see in any credible way how you could have technology assessing the risk of animals, of live animals or plants coming into the country, to assess the biosecurity risk. So, it's possible that you can use technology for some of what's required, but I don't think it's going to be the complete answer.

Minister, I too am concerned about the cost of the delay for Ynys Môn council, who may have built up employment costs and income revenue in their business plans going forward for the year, and for the construction company who, under procurement rules, will have factored in much needed local employment and apprenticeships to build the site.

If one of the reasons for delay is that the UK Government is looking at a streamlined digital border, why have they not returned the e-mails from FibreSpeed, which I and other politicians have been copied into, including the local MP? They have been informing UK Government officials that at Holyhead there is an existing Welsh Government-owned European-funded high-fibre network connection that could be utilised by any telecoms carrier or internet service provider to provide high broadband bandwidth. It will avoid any expensive installation and will allow immediate access to any data, mobile and telecom requirements. I've also raised this several times. Please, could your officials follow this up with UK Government officials because we seem to be getting nowhere with it?

And, Minister, what you've informed us today is that Jacob Rees-Mogg has made the decision to keep frictionless imports, helping foreign businesses while Welsh and British farmers and businesses that need to export are now faced with continued bureaucracy of paperwork and cost. And do you agree that this is not a level playing field, and should have been handled much better by the UK Government? And what compensation will they receive? Thank you.

Yes, I think the Member makes a number of important points, both about council staff that have already been recruited and about making sure that those contracts are honoured and those people have work to do. It's also about there having been a good bit of wasted time, energy and effort in both local authorities as well, and I doubt that the staff at Pembrokeshire authority or, indeed, in Ynys Môn are going to welcome the fact that the time that they have expended appears to have been wasted and without any certainty about when it's going to come to an end or when there's going to be a definite answer.

And also the potential for some jobs that would have been created in the construction of both temporary and permanent facilities, there's no way of giving anyone any certainty about that. But we do need to know, within a relatively brief period of time, what we are going to need to do, because if we're not going to have permanent posts in place by spring next year in Holyhead as we were planning to do, we'll need to know what the plan is for the future, what the alternative facilities are going to look like, whether we need to relet our procurement itself, which would cost more public money that the Treasury would normally be undertaking and supporting, and the inevitable point that Paul Davies has made as well about the fact that the costs would likely rise in that time.

It's my understanding that inflation tends not to stand still and, at this point in time, inflation is definitely going to increase the costs in a range of construction projects, but also the availability of the labour and the skills to undertake the build project in time, and having that time to be able to not just get facilities ready or systems ready, but crucially for businesses to be ready themselves as well. They'll need to plan for any new system too, and that takes on board your point about FibreSpeed and the infrastructure that is there already, and I'll certainly make sure that my officials do follow up with the UK Government. It comes to your point about needing to understand, in following that up, what the new system is going to be, making sure we don't duplicate and create an additional set of infrastructure that is not necessary, but actually we need to understand what the plan is going to be for the future in any event.

Without a hint of irony, Jacob Rees-Mogg talked about introducing border controls as being akin to an act of self-harm. Well, there are alternatives to the position we find ourselves in, but it was the choice that was made in the treaty that was negotiated with the European Union for how trade would work, and if there is to be an alternative choice, we all need to understand what that's going to be, when it's going to take place, and there's got to be a proper and respectful conversation with the Welsh Government so that we can properly account to this Welsh Parliament for the choices that we need to make on behalf of the people of Wales.

I thank the Minister.