7. Statement by the Deputy Minister for Arts and Sport, and Chief Whip: Culture and Heritage Update: Black, Asian and Minority Ethnic History, Culture and Heritage

Part of the debate – in the Senedd at 4:25 pm on 7 June 2022.

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Photo of Tom Giffard Tom Giffard Conservative 4:25, 7 June 2022

Can I thank the Deputy Minister for her statement this afternoon in highlighting how important it is that our cultural sector and our heritage sector is as welcoming as possible for as many people as possible? It's important that the work the Minister for Social Justice mentioned and that review is carried out, and I'm pleased to see it happening in your portfolio too, because as the Minister for Social Justice said, it's not just her responsibility as the Minister for Social Justice, but something that cuts right across Welsh Government, so I'm glad to see this piece of work is happening. I'm also thankful to hear from your statement about that cultural change you mentioned in organisations that's taking place, and I think that's really welcome too.

Can I also start by welcoming the £4.2 million in additional funding announced over the next three years, which will give funding for grass-roots organisations? I'm hopeful it'll deliver change, building on our rich and diverse culture and heritage in Wales. You do however also mention a new grant scheme that couples this, so I'd be grateful for further details on this and wonder whether you can provide clear expectations on what you would expect from those organisations. What in your view does success look like? What metric can we used to hold you accountable to ensure that this new funding is providing value for money? I'd also like to focus on some of the points in the 'Anti-racist Wales Action Plan' published by the Welsh Government earlier today as it relates to your portfolio. Under the culture, heritage and sport section, it states that one of the goals is to

'Review and decolonise our public spaces and collections by appropriately addressing the way in which people and events with known historical associations to slavery and colonialism are commemorated, acknowledging the harm done by their actions and reframing the presentation of their legacy to fully recognise this.'

I agree with that, and what I think is important here is that the public at large buy into that as well. I think most people would agree with the sentiment of that part of the plan, but what the statement, I feel, lacks is a definitiveness about where that line is being drawn. It is a line that differs depending on your perspective, and it's a live debate that is happening all the time. We've seen some people say that figures with perhaps tenuous links at best to the slave trade are dragged into this debate years after they've passed away. I've seen some commentators mention the likes of Winston Churchill in this sort of space, which I hope we would both agree is not the intention of this proposal. This, in my view, comes down to accountability as to who will be making such decisions and what perspectives they'll be considering, because we know, as I said, those perspectives can differ and we don't want people who agree with the sentiment of the action plan disagreeing with the outcome of what is actually achieved by it.

A good example would be the decision by National Museum Wales a few months ago to review a replica of the first steam-powered locomotive in Wales by Richard Trevithick over claims it was linked to the slave trade. Officials at the museum admitted there were no direct links between the Trevithick locomotive and the slave trade, but they said the use of the invention is rooted in colonialism and racism. A review is fine, but we need to be careful about where we draw those distinctions about our past to ensure that people are not deleted from our past simply because they existed in the past. So, an understanding on that kind of threshold would be quite important, I think.

The action plan also states that it will

'Identify a specific ring-fenced resource to support grassroots cultural, creative and sporting activities among Black, Asian and Minority Ethnic groups and promote this to encourage applications, taking account of intersectional disadvantages and specific issues relating to community languages.'

Can you, Deputy Minister, confirm exactly how that will work? How much will this pot be? it wasn't really clear from your statement whether this would form part of the new funding announced in your statement or whether this is a separate element of funding again.

Another point I'd like to mention was one of your actions to work with black, Asian, and minority ethnic communities to identify and lift barriers to accessing heritage and cultural collections. Given this, what impact assessment has the Welsh Government done in the sorts of ways that diverse communities are facing barriers to accessing heritage sites, and can you share the findings with the Senedd? Another point to note in the action plan was to ask Sport Wales and its partners to increase the participation in active lifestyles of women and girls from diverse groups, taking into account intersectional disadvantages, languages and the most disadvantaged groups. How will you be measuring that progress, Deputy Minister? And, again, what does success look like, and also what tangible targets will you be setting to reach, whilst working with stakeholders? 

You also mentioned the over 100 local museums across the country—they're expected to play quite a big role, actually, in many of these schemes, such as the charter for decolonising the collection. It's crucial we get that right as well. Many involved with local museums perhaps don't necessarily come into regular contact with structures of Welsh Government, and many involved are volunteers. So, how are you ensuring we're not placing unintentional, additional bureaucratic work on their vital volunteering work in local museums across Wales, and work out ways that we can continue to attract and enhance volunteering experiences within our museums? And how also will you make sure that there's a consistent understanding within groups like this, so we don't have different museums interpreting this in different ways?

And finally, one of the first things you said was about the lived experience, and I think that's really important. There is no single diverse experience. So, how are you using this strategy to ensure that plurality is recognised and accounted for in this strategy? Thank you.