2. Business Statement and Announcement

– in the Senedd at 2:29 pm on 14 June 2022.

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Photo of Elin Jones Elin Jones Plaid Cymru 2:29, 14 June 2022

(Translated)

The next item is the business statement and announcement, and I call on the Trefnydd to make that statement. Lesley Griffiths.

Photo of Lesley Griffiths Lesley Griffiths Labour

Diolch, Llywydd. I have two changes to today's agenda: the Minister for Social Justice will shortly make a statement on the cost of living, and the statement on building safety has been withdrawn. Draft business for the next three weeks is set out on the business statement and announcement, which can be found amongst the meeting papers available to Members electronically.

Photo of Natasha Asghar Natasha Asghar Conservative 2:30, 14 June 2022

Minister, unfortunately, late last week, I had to go to A&E at the Grange hospital after taking advice from my doctor. Let me be clear that what I'm about to share with the Senedd is not at all a criticism of the staff, because every single person I spoke to, from the receptionist to the hardworking nurses, was absolutely fantastic, and I cannot fault them at all. Prior to my election last year, I had heard the news, like many people outside this Chamber, and read in the papers, and after being elected here, more and more residents of south-east Wales have come to me and spoken about their disenchantment with the Grange hospital. And I stand in front of you today to agree with all of them that the Grange hospital is, without a doubt, in shambles.

For background, I just want to make you aware that I filmed my entire experience whilst there—you can call it my own version of my Panorama exposé—and even posted it on social media yesterday. I did not tell anyone that I was going to the hospital, and I wore a mask the entire time so that no-one would recognise me, as I did not want to be treated differently to anyone else due to being a Member of the Senedd. It became very clear very quickly that the problems started before you even reached the hospital. Firstly, as someone who's foot was double the size, and in pain, I had to park a very, very long way away from the main building in an offshoot car park as there was nothing even close to the doors to park a car. Fortunately, I was able to hobble to the entrance, but how can any of us expect someone who's severely ill, disabled or elderly to walk all the way that I did? One woman I'd spoken to, who was there with severe chest pains, was forced to battle with public transport to get to the hospital because she was told there were no ambulances available.

Simply trying to find A&E is like trying to walk through a maze that even Harry Potter would find difficult, because there was just clearly no signposting from the entrance to the actual A&E section. I walked through the main entrance, then wandered around various corridors and departments, spoke to various members of staff before being guided to the right place. The highlight after walking through what I felt was the entire hospital was that I was sent outside again to take my temperature, only to walk back in again to be told with a slip that I could now go in and make my appointment. The friend who I was with, who walked by my side the entire time, did not have to take any of the tests.

This was my first time at the Grange hospital, and for anyone who's not been there before, when you arrive at A&E, you're greeted with a shockingly small waiting room, which is clearly not fit for a hospital covering an area such as south-east Wales. After being checked by a lovely receptionist, I was forced to sit on the doorstep because there just weren't enough chairs inside. I sat there watching an ever-growing number of ambulances waiting with patients inside and onboard for a very long time. Thankfully, I didn't have to wait a long time to be seen, but one gentleman had been waiting for 17 hours before finally giving up and going home with another elderly lady who was waiting there for five hours. 

I have an elderly mother, Minister, a disabled mother, and like her, many people who are diabetic or weak naturally get hungry after waiting for so long for an appointment. What are the options if you want a bite to eat at the Grange hospital? Let me tell you. One of your options—

Photo of Elin Jones Elin Jones Plaid Cymru 2:32, 14 June 2022

I think I have been very, very generous in allowing you to explain your situation. 

Photo of Natasha Asghar Natasha Asghar Conservative

So, my question, Minister, after going through all of this, and my issues and concerns are—and they have been raised by numerous patients—that I'd like the Minister to make a statement in this Chamber, as soon as possible, about what the Welsh Government is going to do now to make the Grange hospital fit for purpose as a matter of urgency. Because with the footflow heading its way from the Royal Gwent and other hospitals in the area, I'm sincerely worried that we're heading towards a disaster. Thank you very much. 

Photo of Lesley Griffiths Lesley Griffiths Labour 2:33, 14 June 2022

That was certainly a very long question to ask for a statement. I'm sorry to hear you had to attend the Grange hospital. Obviously, you set out many issues that will have raised concerns, particularly with the Minister for Health and Social Services, who will have heard your question. I think it's really important that people attend the correct health setting when they have a problem. I think that is something that many of us should reiterate whenever we get the opportunity to do so. I know that there is ongoing work to improve the spaces at the emergency department at the Grange and the majors area. Unfortunately, they've got to install cameras for safety reasons, but also, they're installing screens, and you'll be aware that there was a Healthcare Inspectorate Wales unannounced visit that made recommendations. I know all these things are being addressed by the health board. 

Photo of Peredur Owen Griffiths Peredur Owen Griffiths Plaid Cymru 2:34, 14 June 2022

Trefnydd, there are serious question marks about the future of peer mentoring services for people with drug, alcohol and mental health issues in Wales. Some in the sector believe that services could collapse over the summer as the new contract is yet to be put out to tender and may not be in place until October or November of this year. This means that peer mentoring services will not be able to accept new clients from the beginning of next month, and that mentors, many of whom will have had personal experience of addiction, and are therefore vulnerable themselves, will be out of work at the end of August. 

Your Government's response to this matter has been to call on service providers to run the service without funding until it is eventually tendered out later this year. I've been told that this could well be illegal as it would mean that charities are subsidising the Welsh Government. I raised the matter with the Deputy Minister—and I see the Deputy Minister is here as well—in correspondence at the end of last week, but the situation is so pressing, it needs dealing with urgently. Can we therefore have an urgent Government statement on this issue, with a view to providing a solution to the problem that does not imperil vulnerable clients, vulnerable staff, and risk the sustainability of charities that have worked so diligently and effectively over the length of the current contract? 

Photo of Lesley Griffiths Lesley Griffiths Labour 2:35, 14 June 2022

Thank you. You've done absolutely the right thing writing to the Deputy Minister, who, as you say, is listening to your question, and I'm sure she will respond as soon as she's able to do so. I am aware there was an out-of-work peer mentoring service that was provided by ESF funding. Unfortunately, that funding will be coming to a close, and the Deputy Minister has announced, I think, about £8 million of funding, from memory, for extending that peer mentoring service. But I'm sure the Minister will address those points in her response to you.

Photo of Mike Hedges Mike Hedges Labour

First of all, I'm requesting a Welsh Government statement on this year's A-level, AS-level and GCSE examinations, and in particular, GCSE Welsh second language; French GCSE, which included a question on a topic that schools had been told had been removed; AS-level pure mathematics; A-level physics, which the teachers were told would be non-synoptic, but was synoptic; and AS-level chemistry, where the actual exam paper was very different to any previous practice papers or past papers. Can we have the statement as a matter of urgency rather than when the results come out?

Also, I'm requesting a statement on the provision of 3G and 4G sports pitches in Wales. The biggest problem we have is finding places for children to play throughout winter. It is no good for them being enthused by Aaron Ramsey, Joe Allen, Gareth Bale and others if there aren't enough quality pitches for them to use. Will the Welsh Government make a statement on how many new 3G and 4G full-sized football pitches they expect to be built during this term and the sport being provided?

Finally, I'm requesting either a written or oral statement on the result of the meeting of the steel council, which I believe took place this week.

Photo of Lesley Griffiths Lesley Griffiths Labour 2:37, 14 June 2022

Thank you. There were three issues that Mike Hedges raised, the first one around examinations that will be taking place this summer. Obviously, it has been quite a difficult time for our learners over the past two years. I think learners have really had to adapt and cope with new and often challenging arrangements as a result of that significant disruption we've had to both teaching and learning. I know that the Minister for Education and Welsh Language is aware of the concern around a number of exam papers. I'm not quite sure of all the subjects, but I'm sure Mike Hedges covered many of them. He meets regularly with the WJEC and Qualifications Wales, not only about concerns around the examinations you referred to, but to make sure that learners are fully supported throughout this examination series this year.

In relation to 3G and 4G pitches, the Welsh Government has committed, as I'm sure Mike is aware, £24 million of capital funding over the next three years for our sporting facilities. You're quite right in saying that, if we are going to unleash the benefits of sport for everyone, we need to ensure that we have those facilities for both sport and physical activity accessible to absolutely everyone. I know the Deputy Minister for culture and sport continues to work very closely with Sport Wales. She's had some very positive and constructive dialogue with some of our national partners also about delivering those facilities going forward. Sport Wales has recently established a strategic capital investments group, so that they do have a strategic plan for directing the funding and prioritising capital investment in facilities.

In relation to your question around the steel council, I will certainly ask the Minister for Economy, who I assume undertook that, to provide a written statement.

Photo of Janet Finch-Saunders Janet Finch-Saunders Conservative 2:39, 14 June 2022

Trefnydd, could I have a statement, please, from the Deputy Minister for transport regarding the shocking state of the rail service in Wales? It's not that long ago since I was stood here, Llywydd, after we'd had a horrendous journey down from north to south—it took quite a few hours. But only last Monday, coming down here, I had a terrible journey. I was told the reason was that the mark 5 train that was scheduled to operate on this journey on 6 June developed a serious fault with its brakes and was unable to be used for this service. Going back—I was unwell last week; I was taken ill, actually—it took me five and a quarter hours, door to door, and there wasn't a trolley on there. I asked, I begged for a bottle of water, because I'd been quite unwell. Again, that's not satisfactory on a four- or five-hour journey.

But more importantly, last Saturday morning, passengers in Wales saw further chaos on Transport for Wales trains. A train running from Holyhead to Cardiff had only two carriages and was already full by 11.10 a.m. at Bangor. It was all kicking off on Twitter, and I have to say I do believe I saw the Deputy Minister get involved. There were questions raised with TfW, and TfW came back and stated, and I quote:

'there are no upper limits on the number of customers permitted to travel on board a train, unlike other modes of transport, such as bus and aircraft.'

For me, now that the air link has stopped from Cardiff—I have to say I've never used it, but because the train service is getting so bad, it's something I would have contemplated—when is the rail service going to improve? And would the Deputy Minister, instead of tweeting, come in here and make a statement? Because, if any Members here have heard a statement from the Deputy Minister in months, then I must have missed something. I do believe it's time he came here and made a statement on the shocking state of our rail service in Wales. Thank you. 

Photo of Lesley Griffiths Lesley Griffiths Labour 2:41, 14 June 2022

It was certainly very disappointing to see the overcrowding on Transport for Wales services in north Wales over the weekend. I know the Deputy Minister has certainly told Transport for Wales to make every effort to focus resource to the busier services. Of course, there was an international football match on Saturday, so far more people I'm sure were travelling down from north Wales. I too saw people getting very frustrated on social media and I absolutely understand that frustration. It wasn't good enough, and, as I say, we do understand passengers' frustrations.

You'll be aware of the incident that happened at Craven Arms recently, where a Transport for Wales train hit a stolen mini digger that had been abandoned on the line, so that took some carriages out. So, unfortunately, they do have fewer trains. You mentioned why a train wasn't used last week, and, of course, if there is a serious fault, we would not want it to be used. You will be aware that we have got new trains coming in later this year. They are currently being tested. They're not ready at the moment, but they will be later this year. But, please be assured that the Deputy Minister is in regular discussions with Transport for Wales. 

Photo of Joyce Watson Joyce Watson Labour 2:42, 14 June 2022

Minister, we're waiting to see what happens today with the scheduled flight of asylum seekers to Rwanda. But I would be grateful for a Welsh Government update on its discussion with the UK Government on this particular matter. The Counsel General provided a useful account last week, but it would be good to have an oral statement that Members might have an opportunity to speak to. It's an ugly policy. It's an insult to our country's reputation, as is the mess over the Northern Ireland protocol. It's stupid, it's expensive and it's ineffective. There may be as few as seven people on today's first flight. That is a massive waste of taxpayers' money, and it won't work. Even the Home Office says there's no evidence of a deterrent effect. It's a cynical attempt to distract from the Tories' cost-of-living failures and their own infighting. That's my opinion. Conservative Senedd Members here might disagree with that. So, I think it would be a good time to timetable a discussion to get the real feeling on this horrendous policy from all Members that want to participate in it in this Chamber. 

Photo of Lesley Griffiths Lesley Griffiths Labour 2:43, 14 June 2022

Thank you. I don't disagree with anything that Joyce Watson says. I think it's cruel, I think it's immoral, I think it's ineffective, I think it's expensive, and I know that the Minister made those views very clear in the letter jointly with the Scottish Government on 19 May. It's diametrically opposite to our nation of sanctuary approach that we have here in Wales, and we're very proud to be a nation of sanctuary.

I agree with you as well about the effect it will have. I think absolutely it will lead to more trafficking of people, rather than less. If you look at those who are going to be transported to Rwanda, they're going to be very vulnerable to criminal gangs who will be seeking to exploit the situation. It's not that long ago, I'm sure, that we had refugees from Rwanda as well. Suddenly, the UK Government believe that it's okay to transport refugees and asylum seekers there. I think it really will make it more challenging for people to seek safety from war and persecution going forward, and lead to longer delays—and they're already far too long—in the asylum system.

Photo of Rhys ab Owen Rhys ab Owen Plaid Cymru 2:45, 14 June 2022

Two statements, please, Trefnydd. As the leader of the opposition reminded us earlier, our minds are turning towards Grenfell Tower today, five years or half a decade after that tragic incident. I heard the reasoning of the First Minister on why the statement was pulled, but the residents that I've spoken to were actually offended by the fact that it was pulled on this day, and they saw it as an insult. I heard the First Minister say that the statement will be done at the end of this month. I've tried to look online to find when, because there's a vigil on the Senedd steps today and it will be asked of us when, so can you tell us exactly what day the statement will be heard?

And following on from my friend Joyce Watson on Rwanda, I'd also echo her request for a debate. When we have famous left-wing activists such as the heir to the English throne, the archbishops of Canterbury and York and all the bishops of the House of Lords coming our against this cruel policy, and also Councillor Joel Williams, and a Conservative staffer, I think, also coming out in the Western Mail against this policy, surely they need to wake up? So, can we please have a debate on that, as Joyce Watson requested? Diolch yn fawr, Trefnydd.

Photo of Lesley Griffiths Lesley Griffiths Labour 2:46, 14 June 2022

So, just to add to what I said to Joyce Watson, I mentioned that the Minister had written to the UK Government. One of the things that was asked for was a four-nations meeting to discuss the Rwandan policy. I'm sure you won't be surprised to hear no response has been received to date. So, I will ask the Minister to follow up with that letter to see if it's possible, and then that, I think, would be the appropriate time for Members to be updated. 

In relation to the building safety oral statement being withdrawn, I just want to reassure everyone no insult was intended at all. As the First Minister said, there was work that we had hoped would be done ahead of the oral statement today that hasn't, but as soon as that work has been done, the Minister will be making a statement. I'm unable to give you a date, but clearly it will be before the summer recess. 

Photo of Altaf Hussain Altaf Hussain Conservative 2:47, 14 June 2022

Minister, last week, BBC Wales carried a story featuring a range of concerns from the Bevan Foundation about the roll-out of the Welsh Government's free-school-meals option for all primary schools, which is to be commenced in September. Many schools simply don't have the infrastructure to offer a meal to all pupils. There will be limitations on kitchens, seating and staffing capacity. Before the end of the summer term, we really do need an update from the education Minister setting out the key challenges, whether they have been overcome, and what steps he and local authorities are going to take to meet the expectation among parents that you have created. Thank you, Minister.

Photo of Lesley Griffiths Lesley Griffiths Labour 2:48, 14 June 2022

Thank you. Well, I'm very proud the Welsh Government, along with Plaid Cymru as part of our co-operation agreement, are bringing forward free school meals. Clearly, there are issues to be addressed, and I think capacity within schools is one. There are other issues that are being worked through. It's very much a cross-Government piece of work. The Minister for Social Justice is involved, and I am from a food point of view, as well as the Minister for Education and the Welsh Language. So, that work is being done at pace ahead of the introduction of what I think is a fantastic policy in September.

(Translated)

The Deputy Presiding Officer (David Rees) took the Chair.

Photo of Buffy Williams Buffy Williams Labour 2:49, 14 June 2022

We know that the pandemic has had a profound effect on our health service, with waiting times proving a real problem. I welcome the announcement made by the health Minister earlier this year ensuring that, by 2025, no-one will be waiting more than a year for treatment in more specialities, but we need to see more urgent action on cancer waiting times. A constituent contacted my office this month. They were told they had an urgent cancer referral following a visit to their GP, only to find out that urgent referrals are now 16 weeks or more. The worry and angst caused over these four months has an astronomically detrimental affect not only on the individuals, but their families and friends too. Will the Minister make a statement please on how the Welsh Government will reduce the number of weeks and months people are waiting for cancer referrals?

Photo of Lesley Griffiths Lesley Griffiths Labour 2:50, 14 June 2022

Thank you. I absolutely accept what a worrying time it is for anyone who is referred with the possibility of having cancer and, as you say, the impact it has not just on them, but on the wider family and friends. You'll be aware that the Minister did launch the programme for transforming our NHS, as you referred to, earlier this year. The pandemic has, inevitably, had a significant impact on cancer care. We saw back in the early days of the pandemic people not going forward for investigation, some of our screening programmes were suspended and some people didn't want to attend their appointments, and therapies had to be altered to reduce their risk. The Minister has set out her expectations, and you'll be aware, again, I'm sure, that, prior to the pandemic, we'd invested heavily in radiotherapy equipment and we'd introduced the UK's first complete overhaul of cancer waiting times. So, the Minister has made it very clear to NHS staff, who are continuing to work incredibly hard to respond to the waiting times, what she expects from them, and how we've increased training places to support the NHS, going forward. And we know now that all health boards have initiated rapid diagnostic centres—one-stop shop clinics—for people with symptoms that they can attend as well.

Photo of David Rees David Rees Labour 2:51, 14 June 2022

(Translated)

And finally, Mabon ap Gwynfor.

Photo of Mabon ap Gwynfor Mabon ap Gwynfor Plaid Cymru

Diolch yn fawr iawn, Dirprwy Lywydd. I welcome the statement made by the First Minister about an hour ago, saying that we should expect a statement on building safety before the end of the month—we need some clarity exactly when on that. It is disappointing that today's announcement was pulled. It's five years since the Grenfell tragedy. Seventy-two people tragically lost their lives and, of course, today our thoughts are with their loved ones. These people suffered and died because other selfish people cut corners and put their own greed before the well-being of others. This should never happen again. People continue to live with anxiety and fear today. There's more that both Governments can do, and we need to a sense of urgency in order to resolve this. Leaseholders today are already paying thousands of pounds extra for remediation works, on top of the service charges costs, which they shouldn't have to pay for. Often, this cost is transferred to the tenants. Ultimately, the responsibility lies with those selfish and devious developers and their companies. Those who refuse to take responsibility and pay for the works needed to correct these faults should be banned from any further developments here in Wales, and their directors should have their bank accounts frozen. Then they would realise how these innocent leaseholders and tenants feel. The fact that Michael Gove has gone ahead and secured an England-only developer pledge shows how little the UK Government cares for Wales as well. So, as part of the statement, will the Minister therefore provide us with an update on how the Government's discussion with the UK Government on this England-only approach is going, and can she give us the next steps that are planned to urgently resolve this issue? 

Photo of Lesley Griffiths Lesley Griffiths Labour 2:53, 14 June 2022

Thank you. Well, I certainly agree with what the Member said around the 72 people who sadly lost their lives, and our thoughts are with their families and, of course, the significant impact it will have had on their lives, but also with people who are having to live with issues around building safety, which you referred to. I don't think I've got anything further to add to what the First Minister said. As I said, the statement will be done before the summer recess. We only have four sitting weeks after this week, so I will ensure it's on the business statement and announcement as quickly as possible, so Members and, obviously, our constituents are aware of that. I don't think the Minister could do anything more quickly or more urgently than she's doing, but I will certainly ask her to take your concerns and the specific points you raise, particularly about her discussions with the UK Government, into consideration when she brings forward her statement. 

Photo of David Rees David Rees Labour 2:54, 14 June 2022

(Translated)

I thank the Trefnydd.