6. Debate on the Equality and Social Justice Committee Report: 'Annual scrutiny of the Future Generations Commissioner: An update'

Part of the debate – in the Senedd at 5:00 pm on 15 June 2022.

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Photo of Jenny Rathbone Jenny Rathbone Labour 5:00, 15 June 2022

So, now really is the time to review the role of the well-being of future generations commissioner's office, but also to look at all the other independent people whose job it is to independently scrutinise public bodies. So, thank you very much indeed for that, but I agree with you also on the points you made about the importance of cultural change, making people aware and also understanding what the words on the page actually mean in the way we translate policy into action.

Sioned Williams dwelt on recommendation 2 in relation to training and—3, I beg your pardon, in relation to training and professional development of Welsh Government staff and the importance of the Welsh Government not over-relying on the office of the future generations commissioner, which happens to be co-located in our capital city. I think geographical proximity, obviously, often plays a role in all these things. It's really important that the Welsh Government is making sure that all its officials understand the importance of its own Act. It's the Welsh Government who proposed this Act. Carl Sargeant really did shape it into something that's proved to be a really important initiative, but it's really crucial that the Welsh Government is doing enough work on its own to induct its officials to release the time of the well-being of future generations commissioner to deal with other public bodies. There are 45 other bodies involved, and we need to ensure that we're taking account of their needs, and often they are much smaller organisations, much less likely to have experts involved.

Sarah Murphy posed an interesting question, which is: should the well-being of future generations commissioner take on casework? She illustrated it with a local campaign in her constituency, also reminding us about the importance of consulting the workforce on how this looks to them. I think that's a really important point and it will come up again in relationship to the social partnership Bill.

Altaf Hussain focused on the very important global and more equal Wales and the really difficult decisions that parents are having to make, skipping meals to feed their child, and the fact that so many households are now threatened with fuel poverty. So, it's absolutely important that we are ensuring that the work of the well-being of future generations commissioner is focusing on that as much as anything else. But we also have to remind ourselves that producing very fat reports doesn't necessarily get us where we need to be, and 365 well-being objectives—thank you for reminding us of that—makes it a pretty impossible task. We really do need to hone those down into smaller numbers so that they can be more effective.

I absolutely agree with Ken Skates that Sophie Howe has been fiercely independent and has done a wonderful job in really setting the bar for any successor, and the importance of getting to grips with how we share excellence and get resources to the front line. I also think it's really important that we are ensuring that—. The economic action plan that was proposed by Ken Skates, obviously, is likely to be embedded into legislation through the social partnership and procurement Bill. It will bring private bodies who want to contract with public bodies into the Act, and, therefore, we really do have to get this right and make it into something that's coherent and manageable, digestible.

Sophie Howe once again gave some excellent examples of the way in which her office has implemented the Act, the anti-racist action plan, the pilot of the minimum income guarantee, and I'm fully confident that the Minister really does lead that cross-Government commitment. I was also very pleased to see the Minister for finance listening intently to this debate, because, obviously, this is entirely relevant to the very difficult decisions that Rebecca has to make in devising the next budget.

So, I absolutely agree with the Minister that scoping and evaluating the implementation of the Act is a very important milestone to ensure we're getting this right. So, we have a difficult task ahead of us, but we really do need to be coherent and inclusive, and, as the Minister for Climate Change rightly reminds us, we cannot be outsourcing our global carbon emissions. We have global responsibility, so simply saying, 'We're going to do x so that we have less emissions in Wales'—. We have to ensure that we are living our lives differently so that we are globally responsible and sharing the burden—