My thanks go to Sam for bringing forward this legislative proposal. It gives a really much-needed airing here in the Senedd to the benefits of outdoor education and activity. It's very timely on the back of the new curriculum, which has been shaped by the heightened realisation of the wide benefits of learning in the outdoors. Indeed, the Welsh Government curriculum guidance states that learning outdoors can lead to high levels of well-being, confidence and engagement; that it supports social, emotional, spiritual and physical development; that it provides opportunities to inspire awe and wonder, to engage and connect with the natural world, to explore the concept of sustainability in a practical way; and to explore a young person's physical potential, develop their ability to assess and experience risk, helping to develop resilience and confidence. So, we're on fertile ground, where, from Welsh Government to front-line educators, there's a drive towards taking our pupils, our young people, into the great outdoors.

The habits of early years are ingrained. If we develop active participation in the outdoors as a child, it sticks with us. In primary school, I was lucky enough to visit Llangrannog for a week, and also an outdoor education centre in the Gower, learning about oxbow lakes and prehistoric burial mounds. In secondary school, we went to Bala, and we canoed and we climbed. Our geography teacher took us scrambling over the mountains and valleys of north Wales, to study glacial moraines, arêtes, drumlins and cirques. We learnt hands on through the Duke of Edinburgh awards, to gold level, how to safely venture into the outdoors in all conditions, and read maps and the hills in front of us, old style. And by the time I left school, I could trust myself, and be trusted by others, to walk back in the snow and the full moon along the Fan Hir ridge, or even to hike those Alps that I never got to as a youngster because there was a fee to do so. I've been there now, and I've literally got the T-shirt. Now, at nearly 60, I still get itchy feet to get out of the Siambr and up high on the mountains, or on our great Wales coast path, or even canoeing the Cleddau. Residential stays are even more profound for a young person than even the best, the most brilliant day excursions. Staying away from home with your peers, with expert and experienced tutors and teachers, is a deeper and more lasting experience. It's the difference between dipping your toes in that mountain stream and full head-and-shoulders immersion in that mountain lake.

With my own background, but also as the current chair of the cross-party group for the outdoor activity sector, of which Sam is a prominent member—and, in fact, many of Wales's outdoor organisations are members, and probably helped him in drafting the legislative proposal—I have an intuitive warmth towards this. But there are, and Sam will acknowledge this, some real and difficult questions to face, which are not to do with the good intent or principle of the proposal, but they go to the heart of the practicality at this moment in time. Not least amongst these—and the Minister touched on them—are costs and legislative time. The proposal isn't clear on costs yet, understandably. It estimates £10 million to £15 million, but it could be more. The costs have a heightened significance right now, at a time when we know that schools, local authorities and the Welsh Government itself are under intense pressures. We anticipate that things could get a lot worse. To mandate schools, local authorities or the Welsh Government to even find another £10 million or £15 million, or more, for residential stays right now—a cost that, I have to say, in better times, would be considered money well spent—is I suspect currently money not available easily, when, at the same time, schools may be this autumn facing decisions on whether to lay off staff, not just whether they can afford an uplift in salaries.

The second issue is that of legislative time and the immense legislative load of Government and the Senedd, and, indeed, the Commission. There's the made-in-Wales legislation, which is ramping up as the programme for government and the co-operation agreement commitments kick in; the unprecedented number of LCMs flowing from the made-in-England and Wales legislation, originating from Westminster; the long tail continuing of the post-Brexit legislation and the pandemic legislation—all this and the pending Northern Ireland legislation and the headlong rush to remove EU retained law from the statute book by December 2023, involving an estimated 2,400 regulations, but we're not sure of the exact number. The legislative workload has never been so stretched; school and public finances likewise. There has never been, Sam, a more challenging time to bring forward a Bill, and I say that as somebody who is supportive of seeing more backbench legislation forming part of our legislative programme. 

If the reality I describe is correct, Minister, then it does fall to you to explain how the spirit, if not the letter, of this well-intentioned proposal can be taken forward. You've started to flesh that up. If we don't have the cash or the legislative capacity right now, that will surely not always be the case. I and others would advocate that our children and young people should have access to the outdoors as a rite—and I say this in capitals—of passage into safe lifelong enjoyment and exploration of the outdoors with all the benefits it brings. 

Minister, you've acknowledged in your statement that a residential outdoor experience could indeed be part of every child or person's life, and that if the timing is wrong now, and the door is not being shut forever on such a proposal, that Government will embark on a new phase of work with the organisations behind the proposal, and the proposer, Sam, and the cross-party group on ways to encourage greater uptake of outdoor experience, and this will look at removing real or perceived barriers to outdoor residential uptake from schools, but immediately, ways in which the sector can work with the new curriculum to maximise opportunities for them and for learners. 

Finally, Minister, if I could simply ask you in closing to make every effort—. I know you've engaged constructively with Sam, and likewise, it's been reciprocated. I want you to continue that dialogue with Sam, with the wider outdoor education and activity sector, and also, dare I suggest, with the cross-party group as well, because this is a well-intentioned piece of legislation, even if the timing is difficult.