Part of the debate – in the Senedd at 4:03 pm on 15 November 2022.
I do not, in any way, want to distract from the opportunities presented by Wales qualifying for the world cup; it is a fantastic showcase—it's the biggest showcase we've ever had, and I think it's right that we are investing in this. I do, however, want to put on record that I do not believe that the world cup should be taking place in Qatar. I absolutely disagree with that decision. I was distressed but not surprised to hear Sepp Blatter, the former president of FIFA, saying in a recent interview that Qatar is a mistake, the choice was bad. He also acknowledged that human rights weren't a part of the decision making. And, I think, the more that comes out, increasingly so, it does make me question why Welsh Government is now attending, with more and more people admitting that these things were not taken into consideration.
I also want to remind people why these are not just concerns, but the facts behind these. So, as we know, migrant workers' rights, in 2021, The Guardian published an article, and an analysis found that 6,500 migrant workers had died in Qatar since the right to host the world cup was awarded. The total death toll is likely to be significantly higher, as these figures don't include the deaths from a number of countries that send a large number of workers to Qatar, including the Philippines and Kenya, nor are deaths from the end of 2020 onwards included. Can we just take a moment to reflect on that?
Further, homosexuality is illegal in Qatar, and officials continue to demand that visitors respect local customs and avoid public displays of affection. In an interview with Sky News, Qatar's minister of foreign affairs reiterated demands—demands—for visitors 'to respect our laws'. Asked what would happen if two men kiss or hold hands in the street, he said:
'The law actually doesn't allow a public display of affection, whether it's a man and a man, or a man and a woman. That's our law.'
And the UK Foreign Secretary, James Cleverly, who will also be at the tournament, has been criticised after he said that LGBT fans who go to Qatar, where same-sex activity is illegal, should show a little bit of 'flex and compromise'. Can we also take a moment to reflect on that?
I must admit that the more that comes out, the more uncomfortable, as I said, I am that we will be there, attending. Obviously, I'm incredibly proud that Team Cymru will be there. I think that they are to be commended for taking that strong stance, and I'm proud that they will be wearing the 'One Love' armband. I'm proud of our players and Rob Page's stance, and that should be acknowledged. But let's remind ourselves also that FIFA president, Gianni Infantino, recently asked world cup teams to avoid discussions concerning human rights issues in Qatar ahead of the tournament by writing to association leaders of the 32 competing nations last week, urging them not to,
'allow football to be dragged into every ideological or political battle that exists'.
Shocking. So, my question to you, Minister, you have said that the First Minister has raised concerns with the Qatar ambassador, and that you have written a letter concerning the homophobic comments and condemning them, but what response did you receive, and what response did the First Minister receive? It's one thing raising those concerns, but, by taking this stance, what will actually change in Qatar for LGBTQ+ people and migrant workers by the presence of Welsh Government there? What will actually change and what will be the legacy, not just in terms of economic value in terms of the Wales brand, but for those people who are affected and are being persecuted or are dying because of what is happening in Qatar?
I would also like to ask: why are we sending two men to represent Welsh Government? If you are going, why are we not sending a female representative from Welsh Government, as was originally planned? What message does this send to women's rights as well, which is also something that is a concern in Qatar? What message does it send that we are sending two men to represent our Welsh Government, if you are going?
I would also like to echo Paul Davies's point, in terms of COP27. I think it is a fair point to raise, in a climate emergency where we are saying, 'this is a priority', that we are prioritising attending two football matches to attending COP27. That is a question that needs to be addressed, and I would like clarity on that.
And, finally, may I ask what assurances you can give that our supporters will be safe in Qatar? And if you can't give them, what is your advice to any LGBTQ+ supporters who are due to go, but are concerned about their safety at this point in time? I think with more and more things in the press, saying that people have to respect customs, people are getting increasingly concerned, and they are due in Qatar imminently.
Similarly to Paul Davies, I think we need to know what measures are in place in terms of the investment, what the objectives are, what does success look like, and I would like to see that published as soon as possible so that we can see how that investment will change. But the most important thing is: how will this change things for people in Qatar? What will be that legacy?