9. Plaid Cymru Debate: Nurses' pay

Part of the debate – in the Senedd at 5:36 pm on 23 November 2022.

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Photo of Russell George Russell George Conservative 5:36, 23 November 2022

Diolch, Presiding Officer. Can I thank Plaid Cymru for bringing forward this debate today? A quite proper use of debating time in the Chamber this afternoon. 

A strike will have devastating consequences for patients, and we know six of the seven health boards have voted in favour of strike action. I think that just shows how desperate nurses are for the Welsh Government to listen to them. I'll say to the Minister: Minister, you must do everything in your power to avert a nursing strike as well as stemming the workforce pressures. 

To speak to the amendments today, we'll be supporting Plaid's motion fully today. I'm very disappointed at the Government's deleting point 2 of the Plaid motion. We've added an amendment of our own, which calls on the Welsh Government to meet with the Royal College of Nursing Wales to discuss its campaign for fair pay and safe staffing to avoid strike action this winter. To be really clear on this, the Minister has not met with the RCN to discuss their campaign for fair pay, and has only just responded to the request that they made last month. As Rhun ap Iorwerth has pointed out, the Minister still has no plans to meet with the RCN, and what frustrates me is that the Minister seeks to deflect, when this question is put to her, and then responds to a different point. Yes, you may be meeting the RCN to discuss other matters, and you may be meeting with unions, but you have not met with the RCN to discuss their fair pay campaign. And that is our amendment to the motion this afternoon, Minister. I hope you will confirm that you will be meeting with the RCN and supporting our amendment today.

Now, as Rhun ap Iorwerth has pointed out, it's not just about pay, of course, as well. Other areas need to be examined—key conditions, such as mental health support, retention, upskilling and tackling the mammoth staffing gaps in the NHS. They've got to be tackled urgently as well, so that the NHS workforce is fully supported. And whilst I'm on that point, I note Rhun did ask you to guarantee, in his opening comments, but I would reiterate that myself, Minister: can you give that guarantee that the nurses' tuition fee bursary will be safeguarded into the future in your remarks this afternoon?

Minister, you responded to one of my colleagues last week in the Chamber that you were fed up; you were fed up of some of the questions being put to you. [Interruption.] You did say that, Minister; you did say you were fed up of some of the questions being put to you. Well, can I say that I'm fed up, I'm frustrated, when Ministers don't take responsibility for what is in their power here? So, the Welsh Government has been responsible for the Welsh NHS for 20 years, and you, Minister—[Interruption.] I'll come on to that now, don't worry, Deputy Minister. But the Welsh Government is also responsible for nurses' pay and conditions as well. So, I'm fed up when you point your finger—it's health boards' responsibility, it's Westminster's responsibility, you want more money—all the time deflecting away from the responsibility here. 

The autumn statement has just been announced. The Welsh Government will receive an additional £1.2 billion in consequentials. You, Minister, can cut your cloth as you choose to do here. I could name a whole raft of areas where I believe the Welsh Government has spent money inappropriately, or wasted money. So, you have the responsibility here to cut your own cloth. I could talk about the different views in this Chamber about the £100 million that's about to be spent on 30 new Senedd Members. That's a debate for another day, but that's equivalent to 4,000 newly-qualified nurses. That debate will happen again, I'm sure. But the point is that these are decisions made here by you, Minister. I and my colleagues are wholeheartedly supporting our NHS nurses, and we think that they should be supported in the profession that they love. And it is disappointing that the Welsh Government has still failed to produce a retention plan for nursing over two years on from the NHS workforce plan in 2022. 

We face another winter of severe pressures on the NHS, and the Welsh Government should be doing everything in its hands and in its toolbox to avert strike action and avert pressure being put on the NHS across Wales. Minister, I would call on you this afternoon and call on the Welsh Government to meet with the Royal College of Nursing to discuss its campaign for fair pay and safe staffing to avoid a winter of industrial action in the coming months ahead. Diolch yn fawr.