We will now move to the short debate, and I'm sure everyone will leave quietly.

Members can leave quietly as we are still about our business here, and I will call on Jack Sargeant to introduce his short debate, and to start the final debate of 2022. Over to you, Jack.

Thank you very much, Llywydd. I'm very pleased to have this opportunity to bring this important debate before the Senedd today.

Llywydd, in opening today's debate, I agreed to give one minute of my time in this final debate of the Senedd term to Rhun ap Iorwerth. Presiding Officer, I did table this debate, titled 'Banking Services in Cymraeg', following an issue brought to me by a constituent of Alyn and Deeside. They had decided to register an online bank account for their newborn child. They decided to register that with Halifax banking group. To do so, they had to upload a birth certificate. This is where the problems began. Birth certificates issued in Cymru are two-sided. The Halifax website, which is part of the Lloyds banking group, only allowed for a one-sided certificate to be uploaded. Well, what did this mean? This meant that it was a 'no' from Halifax. They would not allow bilingual Welsh birth certificates to be uploaded. Their system was clear. They only allowed English birth certificates. The answer that they gave to my constituents, Presiding Officer, was to, 'Travel to your nearest branch instead.' Well, this does raise some serious issues of concern for me and, I’m sure, many Members of the Chamber today. We are fiercely proud of being a bilingual nation, and financial service providers not allowing bilingual birth certificates is something that we simply cannot accept. Now, I am pleased that I did receive confirmation from the Financial Conduct Authority, in a letter to me yesterday, that Halifax, part of the Lloyds banking group, following the tabling of this motion, has, and I quote:

'recently completed the work to allow this to happen'.

Obviously, I am very pleased, and I’m sure that Members will agree with me about being pleased, about that action taken. But, quite simply, it shouldn’t have needed to be taken, and it shouldn't have taken a Senedd debate to correct that matter. But, Presiding Officer, it also raises the issue of bank closures. Right across Wales, banks have closed branches, claiming that all services can be accessed online. But that simply isn’t true. We've proven that today already. But it also is the case that whole towns have completely lost banking provision, often against the backdrop of community campaigners. In Buckley, in my own constituency, we have seen every single bank close. And at the time of the final bank closure, a petition launched by a local town councillor, Carolyn Preece, went viral across Wales and across the United Kingdom, with tens of thousands of people signing it, calling for banks to listen to people in their local communities and provide those local services we all need. And in my work as a Member of the Senedd for Alyn and Deeside, I continue to work to open Wales's first community bank in Buckley. It is the lack of responsiveness from high-street retail banks to local communities like Buckley in my constituency, like many across all of our constituencies, that partly drives my work in that area. I want to put it this way: we have been let down by high-street banks, and the failure to respect the Welsh language, as we have demonstrated today, is one in a very long line of examples.

Llywydd, of course a community bank would be different, and I'm sure, if you were to speak to Banc Cambria in the coming weeks, they would tell you of the importance they place on Cymraeg. But in the meantime, Llywydd, I want to appeal to every single high-street bank in Wales to take the Welsh language seriously, to take our local people and our local communities seriously.

As the Llywydd said before, this is the final piece of Senedd business in the Siambr of 2022, and, of course, I wanted to shine a light today on how banking services are not all they should be. Of course, I wanted to highlight the importance of Banc Cambria and the community bank for Wales, but, of course, I also wanted to wish you all, Members here and those working within our Senedd, Nadolig llawen, a very happy new year, but if I may, Presiding Officer, Llywydd, I'll reflect and revert back to my last contribution of the 2019 Senedd term by stating again: all I want for Christmas is a bank in Buckley.

Very good. Rhun ap Iorwerth.

Oh, I'm not meant to comment on the speeches of Members, but I broke a rule there. Da iawn, Jack. Rhun ap Iorwerth. 

May I thank Jack for bringing this short debate forward today? I want to take you back some 30 years. I was chair of the University of Wales branch of Cymdeithas yr Iaith Gymraeg when I was invited to be part of a delegation to go to Barclays's headquarters in Wales, which was on Queen Street in Cardiff, to lobby for a Welsh option on cash points. Now, cash points were relatively new at that point, and they were in English only. It was explained to us that the bank supported the principle but that there were technological barriers at the time in introducing a Welsh option. Of course, we achieved Welsh cash points ultimately, and that was another small victory in the history of the language campaign. But here we are, 30 years later, and we still hear of technological barriers in making fundamental parts of banking services available bilingually. Our branches are being closed in towns in all corners of Wales, as we heard from Jack—branches where people, even before the Welsh language cash point was available, could enjoy a Welsh language service entirely naturally, provided by bilingual staff, for many years. But, as the branches close, we are encouraged to use online services, and those still aren't available in Welsh. I use online banking on a daily basis, I'm sure, and that is entirely through the medium of English, and that is not acceptable. Banking and financial services are fundamental services, so, come on, banks, and play your part in supporting and encouraging bilingualism.

The Minister for Social Justice to reply—Jane Hutt.

Thank you, Llywydd. Financial and digital equality, choice and inclusion is a priority and is vitally important to me.

I'm absolutely focused on ensuring equality of access for all the people of Wales in whatever geographical, cultural and personal situation they find themselves. I do thank Jack Sargeant for bringing forward the debate, and welcome the focus of this debate on banking services in Cymraeg and our ambition to make Wales a truly bilingual nation. 

But, of course, the responsibility for our financial services in the UK, including banking, isn't devolved to the Senedd. So, Welsh Government can't ensure banking availability, but we're very closely working with those who are able to do so. And in relation to this particular issue, we have to look to our Welsh Language Commissioner, who has a responsibility to work with the banking sector in Wales and to encourage them to treat the Welsh and English languages equally. This includes offering assistance in developing suitable technology to help them in providing Welsh language services. So, it is very disappointing to hear about this situation that affected your constituent. What an awful situation with that newborn baby in Wales, and the fact that the IT system used by Halifax didn't support that fully bilingual online service. And it just demonstrates the concerns that you and all of us and the Welsh Government share that online banking is not an alternative, I would say, to a physical branch either. But, you have made an impact already—the Member has made a huge impact by getting a response from the Financial Conduct Authority, so that's a real win in terms of your influence and the role of this Senedd, and our Senedd Members, and particularly Jack Sargeant, I would say, in relation to this issue.

There are positive stories coming from the banking sector. For example, the Welsh Language Commissioner has collaborated with Santander to launch new cash point machines that remember consumers' language preference, and also Welsh Government has business officials who assist businesses to use more Welsh. We've got a helpline that's being launched in the next few months to offer support to businesses and provide a free translation service, and that will make it easier for businesses to treat Welsh and English equally. Also, experimental work is being undertaken in technology to make it easier for organisations of all types to know whether their IT systems are capable of delivering quality Welsh and bilingual services. And I think Rhun ap Iorwerth's comments on this in terms of online banking are important and relevant. But, of course, you often need detailed technical guidance and you need specifications when designing computer systems, and embedded throughout this work is the equal treatment of the Welsh language, and acknowledging that so many people in communities throughout Wales want to undertake essential activities through the first language of choice and bilingually. 

Also, the existence of services and opportunities to use Welsh doesn't guarantee that people will take advantage of them. The evidence on Welsh speakers' use of bilingual services suggest that uptake of Welsh language services can be influenced by a range of factors, including accessibility, visibility of the service, speakers' perceptions, quality of provision, amongst others. So, our focus on bilingual provision includes providing those innovative services, such as shared banking hubs and our plans for a community bank, all of which provide opportunities for people to receive their banking services in Wales. But, we do have to say, from this debate today, brought by Jack Sargeant, I strongly urge banks of all types to be a welcoming and encouraging place to practise and grow confidence in the use of Welsh. 

So, I will turn briefly to this key point about our community bank and just give a bit of an update. I'd really like to thank Jack Sargeant for the role he's played in bringing forward Banc Cambria with his ambitions to locate community bank facilities within the constituency. And I will say, let's hope, if we meet again this time next year with a similar debate, you will get your bank for Christmas in Buckley. But, there are so many communities across Wales who are waiting for this community bank and who want to undertake those day-to-day functions through their first language of Welsh. This is going to be a really important aspect of the community bank. It will provide those opportunities to receive their banking services in Welsh. 

Critical in our aspirations to have a community bank in Wales is to have them based on mutual values, and it presents the opportunity to provide a fully bilingual service. I don't think this has come out enough in our discussions and questioning about the community bank. It can provide accessible face-to-face and digital services for customers through the medium of Welsh in a key sector of the economy, whilst at the same time offering employment in contributing to the 1 million by 2050 Welsh language strategy. 

So, there is a commercial proposition now for establishing this community bank. It's being developed by the Monmouthshire Building Society. They've undertaken detailed work over recent months—I met with them recently—informing their location strategy. A key element of their considerations has been the Welsh language, and the Welsh Government obviously recognises and is respectful of the fact that this is a commercial proposition being developed by MBS, with support from Cambria Cydfuddiannol Ltd. So, further details haven't yet been shared with the Welsh Government on the specifics of the plans, but we hope to have those in the near future. And, indeed, Vaughan Gething, the Minister for Economy, wrote recently to Monmouthshire Building Society, underlying the importance of Welsh language services to the Welsh Government's aspirations for a  community bank in Wales. So, we remain committed to the creation of the community bank in Wales, the emergence of a mutually-based and inclusive financial model that serves the people of Wales. 

And, just in terms of access to cash, I welcome the intervention by Link and Post Office to introduce shared banking hubs. And that's been identified as being necessary following the loss of high street banks across Wales, and raised so regularly in this Chamber. 

So, working with key partners across the banking sector, Wales is supporting a combination of innovation, diverse, inclusive initiatives that, together, will help increase access to a truly bilingual banking service for all the people of Wales. And it's about finding the best bilingual and tailored solution at the heart of this hugely important work.

And—  

—a very merry Christmas to you all. 

Nadolig Llawen, Jack Sargeant—you will get your bank back in Buckley. Diolch.

Thank you very much, Minister.

And there endeth our Christmas banking debate. We look forward to next year's version. And we'll all be there in Buckley for that bank opening. 

A very merry Christmas to you all. That brings today's proceedings to a close. 

The meeting ended at 18:17.