We move therefore to item 7: statement by the Minister for Education and Welsh Language on sustainable communities for learning. I call on the Minister, Jeremy Miles. 

Thank you, Dirprwy Lywydd. Last year saw the introduction of a new name for our flagship education infrastructure investment programme, namely the sustainable communities for learning programme. In doing so, we are making a clear statement about our commitments for the environment and future generations. To date, the programme has provided over £1.5 billion-worth of capital investment to support the delivery of 255 school and college projects.

Building on this, our programme for government commits a further £1.5 billion-worth of additional investment for the next phase, to deliver new schools and colleges across Wales. The programme's success reflects the strong collaborative partnership we have with local authorities, the Welsh Local Government Association, CollegesWales and diocesan authorities. It's allowed us to make strategic local decisions on education investment priorities across Wales, whilst providing a platform for the delivery of national priorities at the same time, including the new Curriculum for Wales.

In response to our delivery partners' needs for a more agile programme, I have decided to introduce a rolling programme for delivery. The lessons learned from band A, and the transition into band B, highlighted both the complexity and protracted nature of delivering projects through the previous fixed programme timelines. And, to that end, a rolling programme is being implemented to improve efficiency for both partners and Welsh Government, strengthening one of the programme's key attributes, namely that of projects progressing at pace and based on the priorities of our delivery partners.

School transformation remains a vital outcome of our investment in the programme. As a Government, we are clear that it isn't just about bricks and mortar. Well-designed buildings and pleasant surroundings play a key role in supporting both staff and learners, delivering high standards and aspirations for all.

Delivery partners are expected to submit their new strategic outline programmes at a time to suit their progress through their existing programme—typically above 60 percent of programme value—thereby initiating commencement of their rolling programme. The current five-year strategic outline programmes will therefore be replaced by nine-year strategic outline programmes that will enhance the planning of future investment. Rolling programmes will be submitted to the Welsh Government for review and consideration towards providing a staged commitment and support, with three-year reviews of their programmes to adjust and add further pipeline projects.

Dirprwy Lywydd, the programme is truly cross-cutting and has provided a platform to embed the Welsh language as well as other policies, such as active travel, biodiversity, ICT, community and curriculum, delivering and maximising the value from investments across our education estate and, in doing so, has provided a sustainability model for others to follow.

As one of the first nations to declare a climate emergency and intention to be a low-carbon nation, I have mandated that all new projects supported through the programme would be required to deliver net-zero carbon in operation, plus a 20 per cent reduction of embodied carbon. Twelve months on from this mandate, I am pleased to confirm that 16 projects have been approved and are progressing as net-zero carbon projects. I'd like to commend our delivery partners on taking up the challenge and developing net-zero projects in such a positive way, with all regions across Wales taking up the mantle, from Ysgol y Graig on Ynys Môn in the north, Ysgol Cedewain in Powys, to Ysgol y Deri in the Vale of Glamorgan in the south. 

As well as supporting all regions of Wales, the programme is having a positive impact across all sectors of education. With South Point Primary School being our first net-zero carbon school in Wales, we are now seeing projects for secondary schools, all-through schools, and special schools as well as colleges. Special schools present an additional challenge in achieving net-zero carbon due to specialist equipment, thereby increasing the demand for electricity. However, I can confirm there are currently three special school projects approved to progress towards meeting our net-zero carbon ambition, and lessons learned from these projects will feed into other pipeline projects on our journey to net zero.

Another challenging area, Dirprwy Lywydd, is that of achieving net-zero carbon on refurbishment projects, and I can confirm that our first net-zero refurbishment project will be Pen y Dre High School in Merthyr Tydfil. Pen y Dre will undergo a deep refurbishment of the existing school, stripping the fabric back to the structural frame. The embedded carbon saved by retaining the foundations, the floor slabs and the structural framework can save as much as 48 per cent of carbon alone. We expect a lot to be learnt from this project that will contribute to the programme’s buildings reuse target of 60 per cent.

We need to ensure that sustainability and decarbonisation commitments become embedded in our everyday life. This is especially true for the younger members of our nation. We need to provide effective ways for them to understand the environment that surrounds them, including the buildings that they learn in. I have previously spoken in the Siambr, Dirprwy Lywydd, about my expectation for local authorities and further education institutions and their design teams to work closely with our children, young people and staff so that they have the opportunity to help design their own learning environment. In response, last September I formally announced the launch of the sustainable schools challenge. Building on the programme’s net-zero carbon mandate, applications were invited from local authorities that are able to demonstrate innovative and collaborative design, development, delivery and management of two new schools that could make a positive contribution to the environment, community and surrounding landscape. I am pleased to say today that this challenge has been extremely well received by local authorities, with 17 project bids having been received. Officials are now being supported by external sector representatives in assessing the submissions, and I look forward to announcing the successful projects during the coming weeks.

I'd like to thank you, Minister, for your statement today. A major, long-term strategic capital investment programme with the aim of creating a generation of sustainable schools is something that is important for schoolchildren across Wales, and very important for my party. Having sustainable learning environments is one of the most important things that can help children learn and achieve their goals, and we welcome the moneys that have been provided by Welsh Government to date and the moneys going forward. We welcome the provision of the support to local government to get more schools built, including Welsh-medium schools to help reverse the decline of the numbers of Welsh speakers across the country. Minister, what I'd like to know, though, is how will you measure success in this funding and with the scheme to ensure that we are building those Welsh-medium schools, and making sure that we are getting more Welsh learners, especially after the recent census results, which were concerning, especially within three to 15 year-olds—those people going backwards with the numbers speaking Welsh.

There was a mention in your statement around active travel. School transportation does play a huge role in tackling climate change and carbon emissions across Wales. Many parents across the country, especially in rural areas, do face transport issues, and it isn't just as easy as telling people to walk or to cycle to school. So, how do you see sustainable communities working to provide effective and efficient safer school transport for schoolchildren in Wales as part of a sustainable community for learning? 

There are also concerns, Minister, as you're well aware, about the rising costs facing these schools because of inflationary pressures and everything else. One example is Ysgol y Deri in the Vale of Glamorgan, which has gone millions of pounds over budget. Councils are facing spiralling costs. So, I'd just like to know how you're going to support these schools in making sure that they are built in the most efficient way, and also how you're holding local councils' feet to the fire on this to make sure that projects are managed in an appropriate way. Minister, I'd like to thank you for your statement today, and if you could answer those questions I've posed to you, I'd be eternally grateful. Thank you.

I thank the Member for those questions. He's right to point out that the census results were disappointing, but he also will remember that there is a range of data in this area that shows a slightly more complex picture than, perhaps, that one source of data, very important though it is. So, the task for us is to look at the data in its entirety, but there are more children in Welsh-medium schools than seem to have been declared as speaking Welsh in the census in a particular year group—to the point that he was making about the expansion of Welsh-medium schools. I think that's an indication that we need to dig a little bit further about the context for that data as well.

He will also know that increasing availability to Welsh-medium schools is a fundamental part of being able to meet our 'Cymraeg 2050' strategy targets. The 10-year Welsh in education strategic plans, which all 22 authorities have submitted and which I have approved, have ambitious plans, not solely to move schools along the linguistic continuum towards greater use and delivery through the medium of Welsh, but also the construction of 23 new primary schools over the course of the plan, which is a significant investment. He will also probably be aware that, in addition to the intervention rate that applies broadly under the band B programme, which is, roughly speaking, between 65 and 85 per cent of the cost, depending on the nature of the school, for a limited number of projects, we have been able to provide a higher intervention rate for Welsh-medium provision, in order to be able to ensure that happens at pace. But I've made clear to local authority partners, and they have welcomed this, that future investment under the sustainable communities for learning investment programme will take cognisance of progress in delivering the WESPs as well, which I'm sure he’ll be keen to hear.

He's right to point out how important active travel is as part of any site design for projects that we fund. Bike and scooter storage is encouraged as part of the active travel to school design where possible, and the programme team expects stakeholders and contractors to work with schools to develop a travel plan that will support measures to increase active travel and environmentally sustainable travel more broadly to school.

He raised a very important point about the impact on particular projects. I'm bound say at this point that there’s a large number of projects that are looking at a very different cost profile to those that perhaps they were embarking on when they submitted their business cases to us. That's a common problem across the construction sector, as I know that he appreciates, and we touched on this in the recent committee discussion when my budget was being scrutinised. We are working with authorities on a bespoke basis in relation to each individual programme to understand the inflation impact on the cost for that project, and what can be done to look at the specification, perhaps, in some circumstances. In other circumstances—and there are many examples of this—where there has been increased cost, we've been able to agree terms on which we can share some of those costs with schools. We'll want to continue to make good use of the significant funding that we have made available, and I think, as he can see from the statement, we need to flexible in how we support our local authorities to deliver on that with us.

Thank you, Minister, for this afternoon's statement. Clearly, there are many things to be welcomed here. We certainly agree on the need to upgrade a number of schools. We know, travelling the length and breadth of Wales and visiting schools, that there are schools that truly do need investment. This is an important part of ensuring the learning environment, which is so important, as you've outlined, in influencing school attendance, and so on, if the resources are in place. We've also previously discussed the benefits for communities when there are facilities that can be used by the community outside of the school day.

Very similar to James Evans, I would like to focus specifically on Welsh-medium education, if I could return to that issue. I was pleased to hear what you said in your response to James in terms of WESPs, because, certainly, you've heard from many of us on this side of the Chamber some examples in our own regions where we have felt at times that the investment has been overly focused on English-medium schools, and when there are Welsh-medium schools, they are often placed in different communities to those where there previously was a Welsh-medium school, and that English-medium schools are placed there, and there's a risk. We have heard from parents that they make that choice in terms of sending their children to English-medium schools and leaving Welsh-medium education as a result. So, I would like to know more in terms of how this further investment will ensure that the Welsh language is a priority for our authorities and that we do look, particularly where there's been a tradition of Welsh-medium education, at how we ensure that that isn't lost if a new English-medium school is placed in an area.

We've also discussed transportation and the resources so that everyone can benefit from that. I know that that is an issue for the Deputy Minister for Climate Change, but clearly this will be an important element. And with transport costs increasing too, I do think that there's a broader issue to deliver that.

One of the things we know in terms of projects such as this is that very often they can take a very long time. I was pleased to hear that you hoped that this will provide more flexibility in terms of timetables and so on, and that's to be welcomed. But, for those schools that perhaps aren't successful in this round, and it may take years for them to achieve the investment that they need, are you also looking as a Government in terms of how we use community resources already in existence, such as local libraries or museums, that perhaps have received investment? There have been projects in the past, such as one in Swansea, where there was a very successful project in having a school in a museum, the National Waterfront Museum, and advantages from using community assets. Clearly, some of these are under threat now, but when you talk about the number of schools still using portakabins that have seen better days, is there any way we can look at how we can use community assets that schools could walk to, so that we can provide a sustainable future for facilities such as libraries and museums, and also enhancing the curricular advantages? I just wanted to ask if that is something you are considering, particularly given that it's going to be very tight for local authorities. We know that the costs of projects such as this will increase because of inflation, so are there alternative steps that we can take? I'll leave it there for now. Thank you, Minister.

Thank you for those questions. Just in terms of the investment in the Welsh-medium sector, the Member will have heard what I said to James Evans. But one point to add to that, following on from what she said, is that one of the challenges or weaknesses that we have in the WESPs is that the emphasis is on numbers, which of course is at the heart of the success in terms of what we want to see with regard to the number of Welsh speakers, but the geographical element is important too, as I've mentioned in several contributions in this Siambr. And the geographical element is vital in terms of the vibrancy of the Welsh language in specific communities, so that's an important element in the wider strategy too.

In terms of the prioritisation and the wait for investment, we are in the hands of local authorities in this regard, because they are the ones that propose what they want us to co-fund with them in terms of the timelines and prioritisation, and in terms of the quality of the current buildings. That's done on a basis that is objective, so that everybody understands what the criteria are, but at the end of the day they are the ones that propose the schemes for us and we collaborate with them on the funding of those. But the priority always in this scheme is prioritising those schools that do need most refurbishment or might be, perhaps, in the least attractive condition. So, that's the background to all of this.

This has all been done to create a more flexible system that allows authorities to make swifter decisions in that regard. Rather than setting out a scheme for five years, and that that is static, there's an opportunity now to look at this more often, so there's an opportunity to change priority as appropriate when conditions change. So, there's a period of three years when we agree on the funding profile, a period of six years when we'll be agreeing on investment or support in principle, and then a period of nine years where we have that longer term picture of what the authority is likely to ask for. So, it allows that greater flexibility in terms of the prioritisation that the Member mentioned.

Just to say on the final point, I do think that there's a connection—. One of the things that is at the heart of the sustainable schools challenge is to combine the teaching environment and the building with the curriculum. I want to see staff and pupils involved in the work of designing and building the school. I saw this on a visit to a school in Bridgend a year or so ago, and that partly motivated me for the broader scheme. So, the suggestion that the Member makes in terms of using community assets for curriculum opportunities is one that I would support too. 

Thank you very much for your leadership on this in ensuring that all new projects are going to have to be zero carbon. I'm particularly interested to find out how South Point Primary School in the Vale of Glamorgan is sharing the learning from this project, or rather the Vale of Glamorgan Council or your officers, to ensure that we understand the strengths and weaknesses of this pathfinder project, as well as an analysis of how much local labour was involved, or whether the expertise had to be imported from England or elsewhere, because it's a really crucial way of understanding how our net zero skills plan is going to be informed. I also think that it's really interesting that there's a school in Merthyr, Pen y Dre High School, that's going to be completely refurbished using the original foundations. So, both of these are really, really interesting.

Secondly, I just want to pick up on what James Evans was saying about active travel and what consideration you've given to some sort of bicycle loan scheme, similar to employers offering loan schemes for active travel to employees, so that poor families can also afford to have a bike, rather than putting all their money into £400 a term on a bus. Without that pump-priming, I don't think that's going to happen.

I thank Jenny Rathbone for those questions. I did highlight South Point Primary School because it's the first net-zero school in Wales, in the constituency of my Government colleague, Jane Hutt. I think it's probably fair to say—and I hope that they wouldn't mind me putting it in this way—it must be amongst the most visited schools, to look at what they've done there, and I thank them for their generosity and the welcome that you get. I fear that many of us have tested that welcome very frequently. So, they have been very, very proactive about being open to sharing that, and I know that the council very much supports and extends that as well. 

More broadly, I think the point the Member makes is very important, though, about how we rapidly universalise best practice and learning in what is a developing area in some ways, isn't it? So, there is a sectoral buildings decarbonisation task and finish group, which the Royal Institution of Chartered Surveyors in Wales has developed and that is aligned to our decarbonisation commitments. They've created a toolkit that can support the development of these projects, both in terms of being carbon neutral in operational terms but also in terms of the embodied carbon. So, there's a body of expertise now being built up that we can make sure is understood and shared.

The point that she makes on identifying the skill set and local labour is really important. One of the principles in the sustainable schools challenge fund was to prioritise the use of local skills and the foundational economy local to the location of the school, for reasons that I know she shares my commitment and passion about. But, we are working at the moment to identify what is clearly some level of skills gap in this area, and we heard Vaughan Gething speak a little bit about this earlier. So, officials are working very closely with the sector to identify what needs to happen in that space.

In relation to active travel, about a year or so ago, we asked the chair of the active travel board to look at the stipulations that we make in the sustainable communities for learning funding conditions to make sure that they were stretching. And so, there have been some developments since then. But, we're also looking at the work of the committee that Huw Irranca-Davies was involved in, looking at active travel more broadly, and they've had some challenging things to say to us about the extent to which we can and should go further in relation to investment in new schools around active travel. And the point that she makes I'm sure is one of those that we shall be taking into account, so thank you for raising that today.  

If I could touch on Welsh-medium education—and I'm sure that the Minister isn't going to be surprised by that—investment in it to achieve Welsh Government targets is going to be vital. Bridgend is a prime example. Yes, we heard last week that, on the face of it, Welsh language provision is increasing, with a new school in Porthcawl and the expansion of Ysgol Gymraeg Bro Ogwr, but if you look again, you'll see that there's still significant investment in expanding English-medium education. Bro Ogwr, my old primary, yes it's expanding, it's moving to a new site, it's increasing numbers, but on its current site, there's still uncertainty as to whether or not it will remain a Welsh-medium school.

So, is the Minister confident that Bridgend is moving swiftly enough to meet its target in the WESP? I know that the Minister is aware of the situation in Bridgend. I know that he has had a whole host of conversations with the council. But, like a number of others in the Siambr, I want to see the council moving at a greater pace on this. 

I thank the Member for that question. We need to provide Welsh-medium schools as well as English-medium schools. There is demand in both areas. And the challenge for us and our aspiration as a Government is to ensure that one doesn't happen at the expense of the other. And that's the point I was making earlier, in linking investments in the broader infrastructure with appropriate and swift developments in the delivery of the strategic plan. That's an important element of this way of working. I have had discussions with the authority, the leader and the cabinet member for education and the director of education to discuss the WESP, as part of the discussion that we have with all councils on their plans. I think the council's plans are ambitious, and we've discussed with them how important it is to make swift progress, and the council certainly accepts that. I think the council also accepts that, in the past, there hadn't been sufficient progress, and that places people's expectations in a different place, and I think having that conversation has been positive. I've told all authorities in Wales that I'm very pleased to see ambitious plans, but what we need to see on the ground is the delivery of those plans and to see developments happening, on the ground.

Minister, it was a pleasure to join you fairly recently at the brand new Hirwaun primary school in my constituency, built under the twenty-first century schools programme, with £10.2 million of funding from Welsh Government and RCT council. I think it was probably one of the last schools to be built under that iteration of the plan that we're discussing now. The benefits of that project's social value action plan included 90 per cent of spend being placed with businesses in Wales, 21 new entrant construction jobs, and 10 new entrant apprenticeships. So, I'd like to ask how similar value benefits remain a priority, moving forward.

I was also interested to hear your comments around the advantages of moving towards a rolling programme for delivery. These are powerful push factors to make the change, and I understand them completely. However, I would point out that, when a project has been agreed, such as at Glyncoch in my constituency, there is naturally considerable enthusiasm from pupils, parents and teachers to see it move forward at speed. So, I wonder whether you've identified any problems that the new rolling programme for the delivery could cause, or if there are any warnings that it might lead to slippage, and if these are identified, then what mechanisms would be put in place to ensure that this is not the case?

I thank the Member for those questions—really important questions. I think it's too soon to know if the new mechanism will demonstrate that there are challenges. I think, in principle, it ought to be much more nimble and ought to be actually less onerous, both for authorities and for the Government, which obviously then offers opportunities to deal with things in a slightly more flexible way and to give the right mix, I think, of focus on immediate delivery in the way that the Member was saying, the need to maintain the pace of the programme, which is obviously really important, but also to give that crucial longer term horizon so that we can plan jointly across the system for future projects as well, and obviously having a rolling programme enables that to be adjusted more nimbly and more responsively. So, that's the thinking behind the programme.

What I'm keen to look at is how some of the higher expectations, if I can put it like that, that we have made through the sustainable schools challenge programme—. That will lead to the building of two new schools as part of that, but actually, as the Member heard, there were 17 bids, and I know that, amongst those bids, there is a lot of innovation, and lots of creative thinking, so that exercise in itself has, I think, thrown up a number of different lessons that we can learn for projects, both in terms of local supply chains, but also the broader use of the foundational economy, as well as, I think, one of the real opportunities here, which I know the Member and others are interested in, how we can make sure that biodiversity, sustainable food production and those sorts of critical developments are embedded in both the life of the school, but also the premises and how they're constructed. So, there's a range of, I think, new areas of focus, perhaps, in that smaller programme, and I hope for us to be able to learn from success in that across the broader investment programme.

Finally, Sioned Williams.

Diolch, Deputy Llywydd. You mentioned in your statement how the programme provides a means of acting on national priorities such as promoting the Welsh language. You know that an outline business case from Neath Port Talbot Council to open a huge new English-medium school in Pontardawe under the twenty-first century schools programme, as it was at that time, was approved by the Welsh Government, and that the consultation that followed led to a successful judicial review, which came to a decision that it was unlawful because the council hadn't taken account of the impact of this on the Welsh language. And the report that the Government itself commissioned on the impact of this on the Welsh language is clear that the damaging impact on the language cannot be mitigated. But the same proposal is out for consultation again, but without initial approval from the Government, this couldn't happen. I know that you can't comment on this particular case, but I would like to know if it's possible to have an assurance that all business cases approved under capital programmes by the Government take full account of impact on the Welsh language. If so, will the Government refuse to proceed with joint funding any plans that have already been approved in outline form, but are damaging to the Welsh language, where the construction work is not already commenced, of course?

I can't make any comments in terms of specific decisions with regard to the case that the Member spoke about. I know that she campaigned, and Plaid Cymru local election candidates campaigned on the basis that the school shouldn't go ahead. Now, Plaid is in co-control of the council, and that was not the decision that the council made, and I understand that.

In terms of the case in the High Court, as the Member says, there was a very important conversation had with regard to the impact on the Welsh language. As the Member knows, a specific assessment was made by the Government with regard to what should be done to mitigate the impacts, and there's an opportunity for the council under the co-leadership of Plaid Cymru to take those steps if it is possible for them to do that.

We need to ensure that, at every stage, when any council seeks investment from the Welsh Government, the needs of their strategic plans have been met, and also that the impact on the Welsh language has been fully considered. So, that is already part of the arrangements that we have in place.

I thank the Minister.

Item 8 is the Council Tax Reduction Schemes (Prescribed Requirements and Default Scheme) (Wales) (Amendment) Regulations 2023, and I call on the Minister for Finance and Local Government to move the motion. Rebecca Evans.

Would you mind, Dirprwy Lywydd, if we do the intrastructure bank Bill first, because I had on my list for today's meeting the Landfill Disposals Tax (Tax Rates) (Wales) (Amendment) Regulations 2022? So, we'll try and resolve that. My apologies.

Okay. We'll suspend that one at the moment, I'll check what the regulations and Standing Orders are, but we'll move on to item 9 in that case.

Diolch, Dirprwy Lywydd.