Questions Without Notice from Party Spokespeople

4. Questions to the Minister for Health and Social Services – in the Senedd at 3:31 pm on 31 January 2023.

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Photo of Elin Jones Elin Jones Plaid Cymru 3:31, 31 January 2023

(Translated)

Spokespeople's questions today are all to be answered by the Deputy Minister for Health and Well-being. And the first is to be asked by the Conservative spokesperson, James Evans.

Photo of James Evans James Evans Conservative

Diolch, Llywydd. Deputy Minister, do you agree with me that having public access to mental health data on all mental health conditions is vital to improving mental health services across Wales?

Photo of Lynne Neagle Lynne Neagle Labour

Yes, I agree with you that having access to data is vitally important. That's why a key priority for us is to make sure that we can progress our core mental health data set, which will supplement the information that we already routinely publish on mental health waiting times. 

Photo of James Evans James Evans Conservative 3:32, 31 January 2023

Thank you, Deputy Minister. Having access to information is important, as you've just realised, for the people we serve, and it also shines a light on the performance of the Welsh Government and health boards. For example, information that was only received via freedom of information requests to health boards shows that 7,258 children are waiting to have an autism diagnosis. Forty per cent of those children are waiting over a year, 22 per cent of those are waiting over 18 months, and 804 children are waiting over two years. And Betsi Cadwaladr University Health Board refused to even answer the freedom of information request.

So, I'd like to know what the Welsh Government is doing to tackle these waits and to ensure that, when information is asked of Betsi Cadwaladr health board, they provide the information so that we can scrutinise their performance.

Photo of Lynne Neagle Lynne Neagle Labour

Thank you for that question, James, and it's probably helpful if I clarify that neurodevelopmental services sit with my colleague Julie Morgan, although we do work very closely together as there are, clearly, strong links with mental health services, particularly for children and young people. What I can say is that Julie Morgan has taken decisive action in this area. You'll be aware that £12 million was announced in the summer to deal with the backlog around ND waiting times, and also to support the improvement of ND services. In addition to that, Julie Morgan has also set up an ND advisory group and has been engaging with stakeholders, including people with lived experience, and there is an action plan to improve those waiting times. 

For my part, I also recognise that our NEST/NYTH framework is also a key mechanism to support those children and young people, because we want those wraparound services to be available, and children and young people should not need the label of a diagnosis in order to access the support. So, NYTH is also a key area for us in that regard, and something that we work closely on. 

Photo of James Evans James Evans Conservative 3:34, 31 January 2023

Thank you very much for that, Deputy Minister. After meeting with charities, a lot of them have told me about data not being regularly available, and that one way we could strengthen this area is by relooking at the Mental Health (Wales) Measure 2010 to make sure that there are more targets that the Government can actually implement upon and can be reported back to this Senedd. 

So, do you agree with the charities out there in the sector that we need to have a strengthened mental health Measure, and is that something you would look to as a Government, to make sure that we can do our job as opposition parties here, to make sure that mental health services are being improved across Wales for better outcomes for the population of Wales?

Photo of Lynne Neagle Lynne Neagle Labour

Thank you. You're probably aware, James, that there is a duty to review the mental health Measure. We weren't able to progress that because of the pressures during the pandemic, and the delay in reviewing the mental health Measure was something that was agreed with the Wales Alliance for Mental Health—the third sector bodies that we meet with. So, they were on board with that decision to delay that. We are recommencing work around the duty to review the mental health Measure, so we are taking that work forward.

But what I would also say is that we've got a UK Government's that's reforming the Mental Health Act 1983. At the moment, we're waiting for them to progress that; that will involve us working with the UK Government on how that is implemented in Wales. We're also waiting for the UK Government to take forward their legislation on liberty protection safeguards—the deadlines for that have continued to move. So, at the moment, we're poised, ready to go on that; we've got large amounts of funding set aside to implement it. So, I do think we have to be mindful of the other legislative pressures that we face, and the capacity within the system to deal with that.

What I also think is that it is vitally important that we focus on delivery, and the most important thing for me is making sure that people get access to services, and I think we have to bear that in mind when we're considering any further reviews.

Photo of Elin Jones Elin Jones Plaid Cymru 3:36, 31 January 2023

(Translated)

Plaid Cymru spokesperson, Peredur Owen Griffiths.

Photo of Peredur Owen Griffiths Peredur Owen Griffiths Plaid Cymru

Diolch, Llywydd. The cost-of-living crisis is having a significant impact on our health service. From increasing health inequalities to preventing people from being warm and fed this winter, the NHS is showing signs of extreme strain and crisis. The strain is also evident in those who work in public health. The nurses' strike, backed by Plaid Cymru, has been well-documented in this Senedd. I'd like to take this opportunity to highlight the impact upon those working in the sector of substance use and addiction treatment. Earlier this month, ITV Wales reported on the cost-of-living struggles of peers with the drug and alcohol service. They spoke to Vinnie, a peer and recovered addict, who had been clean for three years, about his struggle to survive on his salary. He said,

'I'm relying on food banks, it's really tough, I don't have the heating on at home. I'm literally scared to turn on my heating, to turn on my gas because I'm just dreading that next bill, because I just haven't got (the money).'

Vinnie is not unique. Because of his history of drugs, he and many like him are vulnerable. I fear that the stress of the cost-of-living crisis will push many people like him off the platform of sobriety. Do you recognise the problems that exist within this sector, and do you have plans to remedy it with improved terms and conditions? I hope that you agree, especially given the alarming increase in drug and alcohol deaths, that we cannot afford to allow drug and alcohol services to be run on the cheap.

Photo of Lynne Neagle Lynne Neagle Labour 3:38, 31 January 2023

Thank you very much, Peredur. And can I take this opportunity to place on record my gratitude to the people who work as peer supporters in Wales? They do a phenomenal job. I certainly don't think we could be accused of running drug and alcohol services on the cheap. As you're aware, not only have we protected substance misuse funding in Wales, but we've actually increased the funding, and that includes for our peer-led services, which we've had to find extra money within Welsh Government funding for, because some of that funding came from the European Union, and obviously we lost that money. I do recognise, of course, that this is an incredibly tough time for everyone, including people working in the third sector, who we are really grateful to. That's why the Government has placed so much focus on using whatever levers we have to tackle the cost-of-living crisis, and that's why we are continuing, despite the very straitened circumstances that we face, to invest in substance misuse services, to help get people through this very difficult time.

Photo of Peredur Owen Griffiths Peredur Owen Griffiths Plaid Cymru 3:39, 31 January 2023

Thank you. We're still waiting for the Minister's workforce plan, which was promised for this month; given that there are a few hours left in the day, we remain in hope that it will come in time. Oh, there are thumbs up there, so that's good. Can you confirm that you and your officials were heavily involved in devising this plan? This is a key question, because mental health support has often compared badly with other areas of the NHS when it comes to priorities and funding. Improving access to psychological therapies was meant to be a key aim of the original 'Together for Mental Health' strategy, and has been a priority within each of the delivery plans, yet over the last 10 years, numerous reports have raised concerns about the access to psychological therapies on the back of substance misuse and addiction and those who are vulnerable to that. It's a real concern.

Despite some improvements, hundreds of people are still waiting beyond the 26-week target to access support. These are people who often need urgent treatment to prevent their mental health spiralling out of control. Does the Minister intend to reduce the target from 26 weeks and what steps are being taken to address the situation of those waiting a considerable time in some health board areas? Thank you.

Photo of Lynne Neagle Lynne Neagle Labour 3:40, 31 January 2023

Thank you, Peredur. I think you saw the Minister give a positive signal there that things are going well in terms of the workforce plan that she's taking forward. We also have a separate workforce plan for mental health, which is being developed by Health Education and Improvement Wales and Social Care Wales. That was launched in November. I'm really pleased that, because of the extra £75 million funding made available by the Welsh Government this year for mental health, including substance misuse, we are able to fund that workforce plan, which does come with a very hefty price tag in full. That will enable some immediate short-term actions to be taken on the workforce pressures that we face, including things like the training and employment of clinical associates in psychology, who aren't fully qualified in a doctorate for psychology, but are able to offer some psychological therapies, and access to psychology is a key part of that workforce plan. 

I note the comments that you've made about waiting times for psychology services and, clearly, there is more work to do in that space. The NHS delivery unit is currently undertaking a review of psychological therapies for Welsh Government. That report is due in March and, as with their other reports on mental health, will provide us with a set of recommendations to make sure that we can improve services in a sustainable way.

The other point that I would make, Peredur, is that we are spending huge sums of money in Wales on open-access tier 0 and tier 1 support. There is online cognitive behavioural therapy available right across Wales for a range of lower level mental health issues. We've got our call helpline that's available 24 hours a day, and we are making really good progress with our 111 'press 2 for mental health', which is operating everywhere now in Wales and will be 24/7 by the spring. I think that will be a real game changer in terms of the 'no wrong door' approach to mental health.