Part of the debate – in the Senedd at 4:56 pm on 31 January 2023.
Can I say, firstly, that I think your representation of the interim report and the work up to that stage is, indeed, a misrepresentation? Because what they have done is put forward a whole series of evidence sessions. Again, you're right in terms of the online consultation, and, to be honest, that's the same with just about every online consultation that takes place, that you have a large number of people with a predetermined position, and they've been absolutely honest about that. They said that straight upfront, but they've also said that that isn't the basis of the consultation, that the whole purpose of producing the interim report was to provide a framework on core options—and you've seen the three options that they've identified—on which they're now going through a much more detailed and grass-roots engagement process. So, I think it is unfair to criticise engagement when that engagement is actually taking place on the basis of the interim report.
I understand the position that you have, and I understand, within this Chamber, that when positions are put forward, sometimes they're positions that are overexaggerated for party political reasons and so on. What I do hope is that you do, deep down, recognise that there is now a very serious engagement process that is under way with the commission, that the Welsh Government is not directing or controlling that, that it is a genuine independent commission, and you are free to ensure that your views on all the specific points they are looking at are answered and you give evidence. I hope you will follow the exemplary example of Darren Millar, the former Secretary of State for Wales Simon Hart, and UK Government Ministers who have chosen to give that evidence, as, indeed, I understand, has Gordon Brown as well. I think your views are just as valid, and I now look forward to perhaps reading the evidence that you yourself submit in terms of your views in terms of the various points that are being made in the consultation that is under way.