Before I move on to the substance of this discussion, I just wanted to express huge praise for the campaign group from my constituency, which is totally community led, for the work they have done to date to bring this petition to the Chamber. I know their dedication will continue beyond today to make sure that Port Talbot has a good way forward, and some of the members are in the gallery this afternoon.

The petition being discussed this afternoon calls on the Welsh Government to reject the Ministry of Justice's proposals to release the land for the development of the superprison. David Rowlands, as Chair of the Petitions Committee, highlighted that as the main focus, but can I also highlight that the public services that are being impacted upon are also devolved to the Welsh Government, so there's actually a second issue that you may want to consider?

Many of the arguments that will be raised this afternoon were raised during the Plaid Cymru debate on 20 September, and I'm not going to apologise for repeating any of those, as they are core to the reasons for rejecting this proposal. However, since that date, further evidence has been uncovered that supports our calls in this petition. There are two aspects that need to be addressed in this debate: (1) the appropriateness of the site for a superprison, and (2) the penal policy of the UK Government and the role the Welsh Government plays in its delivery.

With regard to the first point, there are numerous reasons as to why this site is inappropriate. First, it's on a C1 flood zone, as has already been mentioned, which was a C2 flood zone when the site was identified by the Welsh Government and given to the MOJ as one on the list, even though the criteria from the MOJ actually said, for suitable sites, 'Good ground conditions which do not have a high possibility of flooding'. Now, Cabinet Secretary, I did ask about this before, and I asked why it was included in the criteria. I was given the answer, 'It's not for the Welsh Government to determine that—it's for the developers'. I'm sorry, but that's simply abdicating the responsibility of the Welsh Government. The site should never have been included in any list the Welsh Government gave, and even now should be withdrawn on that basis, particularly as the conditions on the site haven't changed.

Secondly, the site is in the enterprise zone—Port Talbot Waterfront enterprise zone—as has already been mentioned. That should be used for economic growth of existing businesses and attraction of inward investment that would bring further economic benefits to the community. I know the claims of the MOJ are that a prison will deliver economic benefits, but research has shown that claims that the development of a superprison will win economic benefits—including the creation of jobs—fail to take account of the broader social costs of incarcerating a large number of inmates, and that simple job numbers are not an accurate measure of economic growth.

Also, the identified employment it would create does not necessarily benefit the local community immediately around the area—undeniably true in this case, because it's known that Swansea and Cardiff are up for closing. If they close, the direct employment of those will be transferred to this new site and all the supply-chain employment that feeds in. That is reality; those are the views of the UK Government about Victorian prisons. Additionally, the research shows that there can be economic downturns on investment for communities that become known as prison towns. We are experiencing that, with one business preparing to leave the town if it is given the go-ahead. So, the claim that the prison will be a vehicle for economic growth in Port Talbot is totally false.

Thirdly, there's the issue of the covenant on the land, and another criteria specified by the MOJ when they asked for the sites was that it should not have a covenant. Others may have more time to explore this matter, but I'm sure you're aware that we've already explored it with the Counsel General and the First Minister and I can assure you that will not go away. 

I wish to spend a little bit more time now on the second consideration, because we must give it to any new superprison proposal—the ability of the penal policy to reduce reoffending, improve rehabilitation, and the impact upon the services delivered by the Welsh Government to support that ambition. Again, numerous reports and research show that the creation of a superprison fails to deliver on that ambition. In fact, they do the opposite. Cabinet Secretary, building crime-free lives is about a more equal society. It's about poverty, healthcare, housing and education. It's about prisons that seek to build long-lasting change and not a prison industrial complex, which assumes that profound change will come through stuffing a building to capacity with humans, like they are bottles of wine that will mature over time when they're shut away in the cold and the dark. Let's not support an agenda that is financially driven by the MOJ. Let's rather deliver one that will address the needs of society.

Cabinet Secretary, considering the role the Welsh Government has in delivering services to prisoners, is it now time for penal policy to be devolved to Wales? Perhaps you should be pushing that agenda forward. I agree with the comments that were made in the Plaid Cymru debate—I've turned around, I've come around to your way of thinking—that perhaps penal policy should now be devolved. But if it was, would the Welsh Government consider superprisons a good model, let alone build one in the heart of a community on such flimsy evidence? I very much hope not.

Llywydd, I'll conclude with the following because I see my time is up—I've got a lot more to say but I see my time is up. This afternoon, we'll be asked to vote to note the petition, but I actually want more than that. I want the Welsh Government to listen to the people who signed the petition and act on their behalf. I said in September that there is clearly no justice coming to Port Talbot from the Ministry of Justice, and I called on Welsh Government to deliver that by setting our economy as the priority and not the MOJ's decision to save money. Cabinet Secretary, it's quite simple: when the MOJ comes asking for that land to be developed on, just say 'no'. Listen to the petitioners: Port Talbot can do better and deserves much more.