I congratulate the Chair on her exemplary introduction to the report, making clear what the policy background is to the area before moving too quickly to the areas of controversy and recommendation. Thank you.

I would like to initially say that the trade-off between a universal programme and a targeted programme is one that the Assembly has discussed in many other areas—quite recently, in our committee, on free schools meals and the targeted grants. I understand the Welsh Government's position that it is easier to deliver a programme in a targeted geographical area where the recipients can easily get to where the service is being provided, and that the universal nature reduces stigma and encourages more people to join and benefit without feeling they're being singled out. 

The 2.5 per cent for outreach has now gone up to 5 per cent. I think that's sensible and agree with the committee's conclusions. I think we were unanimous that the Welsh Government should consider expanding that further, but some of that money is being spent on kids who've been in the area, are midway through a programme, benefiting from it, and their parents move outside. It would seem extraordinary just to cut off the programme at that moment of the address change when the children may be benefiting from it.

I would ask the Minister to look at one other area, perhaps, to recommend to local authorities, but also to facilitate: allowing spending on out-of-area outreach programmes to be done on a basis so that we can judge whether the programme is working. And, yes, you can look at areas where it's available compared to areas where it's not, you can look at kids who are part of it compared to those who are not, but often you will find that the characteristics of families who engage are different to those who do not, so it will not necessarily be reliable.

Within the area, people have a right to benefit from it. Outside, it's a much smaller sum; many more people who want the programme can benefit from it. Will the Minister look at actually facilitating randomised controlled trials that will actually give us good evidence as to whether the interventions work? For instance, a number of people come forward who would like to benefit if they can and the sum that's available in the new budget, if it does go up, can then be allocated—. Are you seeking to intervene, Minister? Wonderful.